7F72734452525E57505F310 wrote: It's also possible that Taillon is not ready. I believe if his injury was "fake", they would have DL'd him after his last start and not wait 4 additional days before they did. He may truly have an injury and he needs some more time. Maybe.
I thought he said he wasn't hurt and did not know he was going on the DL (rookie mistake leaking info)?
Highly unlikely, since the Pirates would be violating the CBA if true.
You need to let go of the idea that every DL stint truly means a pitcher is physically unable to perform. It's not a grievance if the player doesn't grieve it. And the fact is, if a player with option years left doesn't want to go on the DL for shoulder fatigue, thats not problem. The team will option him and he can make his 40 man roster wage in AAA instead of his ML minimum while on the DL.
It's silly and the union won't complain about it because the player is making 3 times the pay on the DL he would be making in AAA. (In certain cases, could be even more depending on the split contract)
What kind of a union (or employee) would file a grievance about making more money?
Rotation to start 2nd half...
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
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SteadyFreddy
Rotation to start 2nd half...
72757B4C5A5A564A390 wrote: now the rotation looks like:
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
-
SammyKhalifa
- Posts: 3630
- Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2016 4:19 am
Rotation to start 2nd half...
74534246435E61554243435E270 wrote: now the rotation looks like:
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
I haven't seen any evidence that Glasnow would do any better of a job as those other guys this season.
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
I haven't seen any evidence that Glasnow would do any better of a job as those other guys this season.
Rotation to start 2nd half...
42707C7C685A79707D787770110 wrote: now the rotation looks like:
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
I haven't seen any evidence that Glasnow would do any better of a job as those other guys this season.
Wait... what? he's been untouchable in AAA and limited the cards to less than a baserunner per inning in his ML debut. You think Vogelsong or Locke is better than that? Or Niese?
Do you believe that those pitchers would be essentially unhittable in AAA?
Had Caminero not come in an goated the relief appearance, Glasnow's line would have been very good. But he didn't. He gave up the 3 run homer, first batter.
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
I haven't seen any evidence that Glasnow would do any better of a job as those other guys this season.
Wait... what? he's been untouchable in AAA and limited the cards to less than a baserunner per inning in his ML debut. You think Vogelsong or Locke is better than that? Or Niese?
Do you believe that those pitchers would be essentially unhittable in AAA?
Had Caminero not come in an goated the relief appearance, Glasnow's line would have been very good. But he didn't. He gave up the 3 run homer, first batter.
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Bobster21
Rotation to start 2nd half...
64565A5A4E7C5F565B5E5156370 wrote: now the rotation looks like:
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
I haven't seen any evidence that Glasnow would do any better of a job as those other guys this season.
After just one start? His first MLB game? When he left in the 6th with 2 on and trailing just 2-1 until Caminero gave up a 3-run HR? Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese have all had worse outings than that. Seems pretty early to assume he can't do better than those others.
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
I haven't seen any evidence that Glasnow would do any better of a job as those other guys this season.
After just one start? His first MLB game? When he left in the 6th with 2 on and trailing just 2-1 until Caminero gave up a 3-run HR? Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese have all had worse outings than that. Seems pretty early to assume he can't do better than those others.
-
SteadyFreddy
Rotation to start 2nd half...
75474B4B5F6D4E474A4F4047260 wrote: now the rotation looks like:
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
I haven't seen any evidence that Glasnow would do any better of a job as those other guys this season. I want Glasnow pitching up not just for this season but for next season as well so he is much better and ready to be a major factor in the rotation next year. He isn't going to get that experience pitching in AAA where he really has nothing left to prove. I sympathize with Vogelsong what happened to him with his eye but he has no business being on this roster now. There is no room for him. So you would rather keep a guy like John Niese in the rotation and continue to pitch him every 5th day rather then having a guy with the pedigree of Glasnow up here pitching every 5th day and continuing to get better??
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
I haven't seen any evidence that Glasnow would do any better of a job as those other guys this season. I want Glasnow pitching up not just for this season but for next season as well so he is much better and ready to be a major factor in the rotation next year. He isn't going to get that experience pitching in AAA where he really has nothing left to prove. I sympathize with Vogelsong what happened to him with his eye but he has no business being on this roster now. There is no room for him. So you would rather keep a guy like John Niese in the rotation and continue to pitch him every 5th day rather then having a guy with the pedigree of Glasnow up here pitching every 5th day and continuing to get better??
-
SteadyFreddy
Rotation to start 2nd half...
5D707D6C6B7A6D2D2E1F0 wrote: now the rotation looks like:
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
I haven't seen any evidence that Glasnow would do any better of a job as those other guys this season.
After just one start? His first MLB game? When he left in the 6th with 2 on and trailing just 2-1 until Caminero gave up a 3-run HR? Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese have all had worse outings than that. Seems pretty early to assume he can't do better than those others.
I have no problem if Locke gets another start or two with as many off days as the Pirates have the next 2-3 weeks, but you also have got to find a way to mix Glasnow in the rotation also during that time period. Kuhl as well after the way he pitched yesterday deserves at least a few more starts. I'm sure the Pirates are going to try and limit both Taillon and Glasnow's innings as much as possible so both are available to pitch in September when hopefully the games really matter. But you have to win now too to make those games in September mean something. And you're not going to win more now if you continue to pitch guys like Locke,Niese, and even Vogelsong more then you pitch guys like Taillon, Kuhl and Glasnow.
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
I haven't seen any evidence that Glasnow would do any better of a job as those other guys this season.
After just one start? His first MLB game? When he left in the 6th with 2 on and trailing just 2-1 until Caminero gave up a 3-run HR? Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese have all had worse outings than that. Seems pretty early to assume he can't do better than those others.
I have no problem if Locke gets another start or two with as many off days as the Pirates have the next 2-3 weeks, but you also have got to find a way to mix Glasnow in the rotation also during that time period. Kuhl as well after the way he pitched yesterday deserves at least a few more starts. I'm sure the Pirates are going to try and limit both Taillon and Glasnow's innings as much as possible so both are available to pitch in September when hopefully the games really matter. But you have to win now too to make those games in September mean something. And you're not going to win more now if you continue to pitch guys like Locke,Niese, and even Vogelsong more then you pitch guys like Taillon, Kuhl and Glasnow.
-
SammyKhalifa
- Posts: 3630
- Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2016 4:19 am
Rotation to start 2nd half...
01263733362B14203736362B520 wrote: now the rotation looks like:
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
I haven't seen any evidence that Glasnow would do any better of a job as those other guys this season. I want Glasnow pitching up not just for this season but for next season as well so he is much better and ready to be a major factor in the rotation next year. He isn't going to get that experience pitching in AAA where he really has nothing left to prove. I sympathize with Vogelsong what happened to him with his eye but he has no business being on this roster now. There is no room for him. So you would rather keep a guy like John Niese in the rotation and continue to pitch him every 5th day rather then having a guy with the pedigree of Glasnow up here pitching every 5th day and continuing to get better??
Well, you know, Niese is NOT pitching every fifth day as it is. As for the other guys, I have no preference to anyone except that it would be nice to have a guy I think will have a decent chance to pitch 6-7 innings when he goes out there. That's not Glasnow until he gets his efficiency under control. To be fair that's not anyone else in our staff either, but that's kind of the problem here. But if he doesn't HELP the team what's the point?
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
I haven't seen any evidence that Glasnow would do any better of a job as those other guys this season. I want Glasnow pitching up not just for this season but for next season as well so he is much better and ready to be a major factor in the rotation next year. He isn't going to get that experience pitching in AAA where he really has nothing left to prove. I sympathize with Vogelsong what happened to him with his eye but he has no business being on this roster now. There is no room for him. So you would rather keep a guy like John Niese in the rotation and continue to pitch him every 5th day rather then having a guy with the pedigree of Glasnow up here pitching every 5th day and continuing to get better??
Well, you know, Niese is NOT pitching every fifth day as it is. As for the other guys, I have no preference to anyone except that it would be nice to have a guy I think will have a decent chance to pitch 6-7 innings when he goes out there. That's not Glasnow until he gets his efficiency under control. To be fair that's not anyone else in our staff either, but that's kind of the problem here. But if he doesn't HELP the team what's the point?
-
SteadyFreddy
Rotation to start 2nd half...
477579796D5F7C75787D7275140 wrote: now the rotation looks like:
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
I haven't seen any evidence that Glasnow would do any better of a job as those other guys this season. I want Glasnow pitching up not just for this season but for next season as well so he is much better and ready to be a major factor in the rotation next year. He isn't going to get that experience pitching in AAA where he really has nothing left to prove. I sympathize with Vogelsong what happened to him with his eye but he has no business being on this roster now. There is no room for him. So you would rather keep a guy like John Niese in the rotation and continue to pitch him every 5th day rather then having a guy with the pedigree of Glasnow up here pitching every 5th day and continuing to get better??
Well, you know, Niese is NOT pitching every fifth day as it is. As for the other guys, I have no preference to anyone except that it would be nice to have a guy I think will have a decent chance to pitch 6-7 innings when he goes out there. That's not Glasnow until he gets his efficiency under control. To be fair that's not anyone else in our staff either, but that's kind of the problem here. But if he doesn't HELP the team what's the point? I have a big preference when it comes to keeping guys like Taillon, Glasnow, and Kuhl on the Big League roster over guys like Vogelsong and Niese. Especially when you have the GM coming out and saying on his radio show yesterday that in hindsight he would have been better off trading Neil Walker for prospects instead of trading for Niese. Huntington knew Niese was not very good whenever he got him so I don't know what he was expecting. Everybody and their mother knew that Niese wasn't going to be anywhere near a number 3 type starter on this team. Not a real good statement for Huntington to come out and make in my opinion especially when the Pirates also had money they could have used to go out and sign a decent starting pitcher "cough cough" J.A. Happ.
Cole
Liriano
Kuhl
Taillon
Locke
In the shadow:
Glasnow
Vogelsong
Banished to bullpen:
Niese
Nicasio
Things might change when Polanco is back. If there is a trade for a SP with Rays or Yanks, there will still be a logjam if Locke or Niese are not traded.
what is obvious is that we need Cole and Liriano to keep the score close and go deeper in innings.
I don't see anyway you can keep all 3 guys like Vogelsong, Locke, and Niese and not keep up guys like Glasnow, Taillon and Kuhl. The Pirates are not a better team if they do this and it will not increase their chances of making the playoffs if they do this as well. I'm definitely still trying to trade either Niese or Locke and I am not keeping a guy like Vogelsong around over guys like Glasnow, Taillon, and Kuhl.
I haven't seen any evidence that Glasnow would do any better of a job as those other guys this season. I want Glasnow pitching up not just for this season but for next season as well so he is much better and ready to be a major factor in the rotation next year. He isn't going to get that experience pitching in AAA where he really has nothing left to prove. I sympathize with Vogelsong what happened to him with his eye but he has no business being on this roster now. There is no room for him. So you would rather keep a guy like John Niese in the rotation and continue to pitch him every 5th day rather then having a guy with the pedigree of Glasnow up here pitching every 5th day and continuing to get better??
Well, you know, Niese is NOT pitching every fifth day as it is. As for the other guys, I have no preference to anyone except that it would be nice to have a guy I think will have a decent chance to pitch 6-7 innings when he goes out there. That's not Glasnow until he gets his efficiency under control. To be fair that's not anyone else in our staff either, but that's kind of the problem here. But if he doesn't HELP the team what's the point? I have a big preference when it comes to keeping guys like Taillon, Glasnow, and Kuhl on the Big League roster over guys like Vogelsong and Niese. Especially when you have the GM coming out and saying on his radio show yesterday that in hindsight he would have been better off trading Neil Walker for prospects instead of trading for Niese. Huntington knew Niese was not very good whenever he got him so I don't know what he was expecting. Everybody and their mother knew that Niese wasn't going to be anywhere near a number 3 type starter on this team. Not a real good statement for Huntington to come out and make in my opinion especially when the Pirates also had money they could have used to go out and sign a decent starting pitcher "cough cough" J.A. Happ.
Rotation to start 2nd half...
I'm going to go out on a limb and say that a starting pitcher with the best ERA in the International league can probably help a bottom 3rd Major league rotation.
I know it's a gutsy call, but I'm ok going on record
I know it's a gutsy call, but I'm ok going on record