Off Season

shedman · Post by **shedman** » Thu Sep 16, 2021 9:18 pm

4C796E6E655C6E6E65626E0B0 wrote: Grossly Overpay, Yinzer-Style: $1.00 > LM.
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Eggzactlee!!!

GreenWeenie · Post by **GreenWeenie** » Fri Sep 17, 2021 12:43 am

The "gross overpay" one day becomes the "going rate" the next day.

One would think that, by now, we would understand what being so cheap gets us. Punt. Sell that future is what it gets us.

shedman · Post by **shedman** » Fri Sep 17, 2021 12:52 am

162334343F0634343F3834510 wrote: The "gross overpay" one day becomes the "going rate" the next day.

One would think that, by now, we would understand what being so cheap gets us. Punt. Sell that future is what it gets us.
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Yup. The can has been snapped, Shelton places the can on the ground, and Cherington kicks the can down the road. The can has been kicked so far down the road, that the road isn't even paved. We are now kicking the can down an old dirt path.

2drfischer@gmail.c · Post by **2drfischer@gmail.c** » Fri Sep 17, 2021 1:39 am

342F22232A2629470 wrote: The "gross overpay" one day becomes the "going rate" the next day.

One would think that, by now, we would understand what being so cheap gets us. Punt. Sell that future is what it gets us.
_________

Yup. The can has been snapped, Shelton places the can on the ground, and Cherington kicks the can down the road. The can has been kicked so far down the road, that the road isn't even paved. We are now kicking the can down an old dirt path.

::) Hyperbolize much?

Bobster21 · Post by **Bobster21** » Fri Sep 17, 2021 11:56 am

655047474C7547474C4B47220 wrote: The "gross overpay" one day becomes the "going rate" the next day.

One would think that, by now, we would understand what being so cheap gets us. Punt. Sell that future is what it gets us.
Well, here you go conflating one issue with the standard "Pirates are cheap" refrain. What? The Pirates are cheap? Stop the presses! Who knew?!

I made the "grossly overpay" comment in reference to the issue of re-signing Anderson. So let me spell it out for the crowd who can't separate any issue from the "Pirates are cheap" issue. If any player worth signing has offers from both good and awful teams, there is more incentive to sign with the good team. Unless the awful team offers to "grossly overpay" beyond what the better teams are offering.

Yes, the Pirates are cheap! We know that! Yes, Nutting is a terrible owner! We know that! But the issue at hand was whether they could re-sign Anderson. It had been suggested in this thread that he should not have traded him because they could have re-signed him. So moving beyond the Pirates are cheap issue for a moment, I noted the lack of incentive to re-sign with the Pirates would require him to be grossly overpaid by the standard of what would normally be expected to be a fair price for him.

GW and Shedman, please stay out of discussions if you have nothing to say beyond your standard refrain. It is very tiresome. And patience with tolerating you is reaching its limit.

GreenWeenie · Post by **GreenWeenie** » Fri Sep 17, 2021 12:42 pm

So pay what it takes to get Anderson, who is a decent pitcher. If it's considered an "overpay," so be it. Should have done it in the first place.

fjk090852-7 · Post by **fjk090852-7** » Fri Sep 17, 2021 5:08 pm

The comment about drafting, developing, trading etc is the way to improve a last place team, is spot on. That is what Ben Cherington and his group are doing, and I have said it more than once he would not have come to Pittsburgh if he did not receive assurances that when the time comes he will add pieces for the organization to contend for the postseason.

UtahPirate · Post by **UtahPirate** » Fri Sep 17, 2021 6:18 pm

I probably have the fewest posts of anybody who has been on here since 2016, I tend to lurk and try to stay out of anything controversial. Bobster, I totally get your point about FA, it is not lost on me. So you try to get Anderson right now, you don't wait.

July 15: Tyler you know that we are looking to trade you at the deadline. So far we haven't received an offer even close to the value we believe you bring to our team. We love the way you compete. We love your attitude in the clubhouse and think you set a very good example for our younger players.

We are trying to build something here. We're young and our pitchers need experience, seasoning, and a mentor to help them out. Tyler, we see you as the ideal person to take that role for us. As a FA, we know you'll have options at the end of the year, but to show you our commitment, and how much we think you can help, we'd like to offer you a contract extension of (fill in the appropriate blank) today.

Talk with your agent, let us know if that works. We'd like to keep you as a Pirate. If that doesn't, we'll wish you all the best.

BC has proven he can think outside of the box with a really great draft. Why not with the major league team by at least adding a piece that solidifies next years starting staff just a bit?

I keep feeling like BC is the GM of the Pirate minor league system and not the GM of the Pittsburgh Pirates themselves.

Bobster, you estimate of 98 losses next year. How many years does a rebuild require you to lose 100 games (or the 2020 equivalent)? How many years do you need to draft in the first 5 slots? What I love (hate) about windows is they always slip.

I just think it's time we start building some bridges to that prospect window. We all know prospects don't catch on at the MLB level as quickly as we'd like.

Finally, I like Anderson, liked him a lot. So maybe I'm pushing that too hard. But I'm really tiring of trading everything decent and trying out leftovers.

I'll go back to lurking now. I've made too many posts in the last couple of days.

2drfischer@gmail.c · Post by **2drfischer@gmail.c** » Fri Sep 17, 2021 6:23 pm

737F7E252C252D20273822150 wrote: The comment about drafting, developing, trading etc is the way to improve a last place team, is spot on. That is what Ben Cherington and his group are doing, and I have said it more than once [highlight]he would not have come to Pittsburgh if he did not receive assurances that when the time comes he will add pieces for the organization to contend for the postseason.[/highlight]

I wouldn't be surprised that BC received those assurances. I also wouldn't be surprised if Nutting didn't carry through with them. Is there anything that you've seen from Nutting since he gained control of the franchise that would suggest he would honor his promise? Me neither.

fjk090852-7 · Post by **fjk090852-7** » Fri Sep 17, 2021 6:45 pm

653325313E24343F322517303A363E3B7934570 wrote: The comment about drafting, developing, trading etc is the way to improve a last place team, is spot on. That is what Ben Cherington and his group are doing, and I have said it more than once [highlight]he would not have come to Pittsburgh if he did not receive assurances that when the time comes he will add pieces for the organization to contend for the postseason.[/highlight]

I wouldn't be surprised that BC received those assurances. I also wouldn't be surprised if Nutting didn't carry through with them. Is there anything that you've seen from Nutting since he gained control of the franchise that would suggest he would honor his promise? Me neither.
You are so right about the way that Bob Nutting has run this franchise. Notwithstanding, I either read, or heard that after the 2019 season the Nutting family, possibly Mr. Nutting , was not pleased how the media and fans were writing and talking negatively towards the family. I may be in the minority, but I think the current management group including Travis Williams, as well as BC group have been given the directive to right the organization. I might be wrong, but I am going to continue to remain positive with the current Management Group.