25040C250E06610 wrote: Personally I think it is time for the Bucs to move on from this deal. ChiSox want too much in terms of prospects. If they want Glasnow that is the only one of the top guys I trade. I know it is the long term future for winning now but such is the business of baseball these days.
No guarantee that Glasnow is going to be light out right away or maybe ever. Really good no doubt about it. Who is to say that Quintana screws up his arm the first ST game he pitches for the Bucs and is out for the year and perhaps declines really fast due to the injury.
Good and bad outcomes could happen for each team. NH has to realize that buy giving away too much for Quintana he is messing with the long term future of the team if Quintana bombs.
That is a risk when dealing prospects for a kid like Quintana. Sort of like what will happen to Pittsburgh if they traded him for prospects. The prospects could bomb. Personally, I would deal anyone not named Meadows for Quintana. There is a small window of opportunity here in Pittsburgh. A healthy Cole, Quintana, Nova, Taillon is a pretty substantial starting rotation. What's not to say Glasnow is the second coming of Bullington or JVB and Meadows is Hermansen as far as impact in the majors? Not every prospect will develop.
Quintana
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fjk090852-7
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Quintana
I agree with Possum, I think it is time to move on from this trade. If the Sox want three of our top prospects such as Meadows,Bell and Glasnow I would begin to look at other options by trade or free agents.
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dogknot17@yahoo.co
Quintana
6D7D7C4B5D5D513E0 wrote: Personally I think it is time for the Bucs to move on from this deal. ChiSox want too much in terms of prospects. If they want Glasnow that is the only one of the top guys I trade. I know it is the long term future for winning now but such is the business of baseball these days.
No guarantee that Glasnow is going to be light out right away or maybe ever. Really good no doubt about it. Who is to say that Quintana screws up his arm the first ST game he pitches for the Bucs and is out for the year and perhaps declines really fast due to the injury.
Good and bad outcomes could happen for each team. NH has to realize that buy giving away too much for Quintana he is messing with the long term future of the team if Quintana bombs.
That is a risk when dealing prospects for a kid like Quintana. Sort of like what will happen to Pittsburgh if they traded him for prospects. The prospects could bomb. Personally, I would deal anyone not named Meadows for Quintana. There is a small window of opportunity here in Pittsburgh. A healthy Cole, Quintana, Nova, Taillon is a pretty substantial starting rotation. What's not to say Glasnow is the second coming of Bullington or JVB and Meadows is Hermansen as far as impact in the majors? Not every prospect will develop.
I agree to a point. It is very tough in dealing top prospects. A lot of money and time was put into these players. Their expectations are very high.
What if Glasnow is better than Kershaw? Meadows better than Trout? That thinking has to come into play too.
Quintana is a "sure" thing. You know what you will get. He is hitting his prime years. But would Glasnow be even better down the road?
Personally, I would not trade Glasnow and Meadows. I don't want to trade Meadows at all. For years, Meadows was the guy assumed to replace McCutchen. That looks like the case more and more now. I don't want to trade anyone on the major league roster either. Tough call for sure.
No guarantee that Glasnow is going to be light out right away or maybe ever. Really good no doubt about it. Who is to say that Quintana screws up his arm the first ST game he pitches for the Bucs and is out for the year and perhaps declines really fast due to the injury.
Good and bad outcomes could happen for each team. NH has to realize that buy giving away too much for Quintana he is messing with the long term future of the team if Quintana bombs.
That is a risk when dealing prospects for a kid like Quintana. Sort of like what will happen to Pittsburgh if they traded him for prospects. The prospects could bomb. Personally, I would deal anyone not named Meadows for Quintana. There is a small window of opportunity here in Pittsburgh. A healthy Cole, Quintana, Nova, Taillon is a pretty substantial starting rotation. What's not to say Glasnow is the second coming of Bullington or JVB and Meadows is Hermansen as far as impact in the majors? Not every prospect will develop.
I agree to a point. It is very tough in dealing top prospects. A lot of money and time was put into these players. Their expectations are very high.
What if Glasnow is better than Kershaw? Meadows better than Trout? That thinking has to come into play too.
Quintana is a "sure" thing. You know what you will get. He is hitting his prime years. But would Glasnow be even better down the road?
Personally, I would not trade Glasnow and Meadows. I don't want to trade Meadows at all. For years, Meadows was the guy assumed to replace McCutchen. That looks like the case more and more now. I don't want to trade anyone on the major league roster either. Tough call for sure.
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UtahPirate
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Quintana
I think we're at the "who blinks first" part of negotiations -- only I don't think the Bucs will blink. I'd imagine we've gone as far as we're going to go. If the Sox blink, they'll take what we're offering right now. We'll see, there's still time.
This I know, they need a young catcher pretty bad. I'm assuming Diaz is being dangled and while he no longer has a glamorous prospect status because of his age, he was minor league catcher of the year two years ago. I'm assuming it's Glasnow, Newman and Diaz (for whatever reason) right now. That's one top 10, another in the top 50 and a catcher who looks ready for full-time MLB play.
This I know, they need a young catcher pretty bad. I'm assuming Diaz is being dangled and while he no longer has a glamorous prospect status because of his age, he was minor league catcher of the year two years ago. I'm assuming it's Glasnow, Newman and Diaz (for whatever reason) right now. That's one top 10, another in the top 50 and a catcher who looks ready for full-time MLB play.
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dogknot17@yahoo.co
Quintana
7F5E4B427A43584B5E4F2A0 wrote: I think we're at the "who blinks first" part of negotiations -- only I don't think the Bucs will blink. I'd imagine we've gone as far as we're going to go. If the Sox blink, they'll take what we're offering right now. We'll see, there's still time.
This I know, they need a young catcher pretty bad. I'm assuming Diaz is being dangled and while he no longer has a glamorous prospect status because of his age, he was minor league catcher of the year two years ago. I'm assuming it's Glasnow, Newman and Diaz (for whatever reason) right now. That's one top 10, another in the top 50 and a catcher who looks ready for full-time MLB play.
I would consider those three for Quintana. Still tough thinking of Glasnow's upside, but Quintana would be huge this season and next. Glasnow probably wouldn't be a staple in the rotation until 2019.
This I know, they need a young catcher pretty bad. I'm assuming Diaz is being dangled and while he no longer has a glamorous prospect status because of his age, he was minor league catcher of the year two years ago. I'm assuming it's Glasnow, Newman and Diaz (for whatever reason) right now. That's one top 10, another in the top 50 and a catcher who looks ready for full-time MLB play.
I would consider those three for Quintana. Still tough thinking of Glasnow's upside, but Quintana would be huge this season and next. Glasnow probably wouldn't be a staple in the rotation until 2019.
Quintana
Dog- I agree with you. The potential upside of our prospects has to play a big part in determining whether a trade for Quintana is practical. For me Glasgow is a chip I willingly give up for Quintana. You give up a player with high upside potential for an established upside player with 4 years of affordable control. You can afford to give up pitching to obtain pitching.
On the other hand if one considers the possibility (probable I believe) of a Cutch trade then keeping Meadows becomes practically essential. There's no chance that the Pirates have access to his upside as Cutch's successor with anyone else. Certainly no quality outfielder will be coming back from the Chisox in a deal for Quintana.
NH has to carefully balance the benefits and risks of this possible deal and not be seduced by Quintana's talent and ability to be an instantly big upgrade. As others in this thread have noted the Chisox are in a strong position since they aren't compelled to deal Quintana.
On the other hand if one considers the possibility (probable I believe) of a Cutch trade then keeping Meadows becomes practically essential. There's no chance that the Pirates have access to his upside as Cutch's successor with anyone else. Certainly no quality outfielder will be coming back from the Chisox in a deal for Quintana.
NH has to carefully balance the benefits and risks of this possible deal and not be seduced by Quintana's talent and ability to be an instantly big upgrade. As others in this thread have noted the Chisox are in a strong position since they aren't compelled to deal Quintana.
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dogknot17@yahoo.co
Quintana
I forgot to mention Mitch Keller too. In two years, Keller could be where Glasnow is now with the Pirates. As Glasnow is a young starter in the league, Keller could be the next pitcher in line.
The Pirates can't trade both Glasnow and Keller. If Glasnow goes, Keller takes his spot as the pitcher to replace someone (Cole) in the rotation.
The Pirates can't trade both Glasnow and Keller. If Glasnow goes, Keller takes his spot as the pitcher to replace someone (Cole) in the rotation.
Quintana
5C575F5356574C090F784159505757165B57380 wrote: I think we're at the "who blinks first" part of negotiations -- only I don't think the Bucs will blink. I'd imagine we've gone as far as we're going to go. If the Sox blink, they'll take what we're offering right now. We'll see, there's still time.
This I know, they need a young catcher pretty bad. I'm assuming Diaz is being dangled and while he no longer has a glamorous prospect status because of his age, he was minor league catcher of the year two years ago. I'm assuming it's Glasnow, Newman and Diaz (for whatever reason) right now. That's one top 10, another in the top 50 and a catcher who looks ready for full-time MLB play.
I would consider those three for Quintana. Still tough thinking of Glasnow's upside, but Quintana would be huge this season and next. Glasnow probably wouldn't be a staple in the rotation until 2019.
You guys are silly! If we could get Quintana for that package I think it would already be done. I have to assume the SOX are asking for Glasnow and either Bell or Meadows plus others.
This I know, they need a young catcher pretty bad. I'm assuming Diaz is being dangled and while he no longer has a glamorous prospect status because of his age, he was minor league catcher of the year two years ago. I'm assuming it's Glasnow, Newman and Diaz (for whatever reason) right now. That's one top 10, another in the top 50 and a catcher who looks ready for full-time MLB play.
I would consider those three for Quintana. Still tough thinking of Glasnow's upside, but Quintana would be huge this season and next. Glasnow probably wouldn't be a staple in the rotation until 2019.
You guys are silly! If we could get Quintana for that package I think it would already be done. I have to assume the SOX are asking for Glasnow and either Bell or Meadows plus others.
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UtahPirate
- Posts: 582
- Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2016 10:36 pm
Quintana
5F5E4554420205310 wrote: I think we're at the "who blinks first" part of negotiations -- only I don't think the Bucs will blink. I'd imagine we've gone as far as we're going to go. If the Sox blink, they'll take what we're offering right now. We'll see, there's still time.
This I know, they need a young catcher pretty bad. I'm assuming Diaz is being dangled and while he no longer has a glamorous prospect status because of his age, he was minor league catcher of the year two years ago. I'm assuming it's Glasnow, Newman and Diaz (for whatever reason) right now. That's one top 10, another in the top 50 and a catcher who looks ready for full-time MLB play.
I would consider those three for Quintana. Still tough thinking of Glasnow's upside, but Quintana would be huge this season and next. Glasnow probably wouldn't be a staple in the rotation until 2019.
You guys are silly! If we could get Quintana for that package I think it would already be done. I have to assume the SOX are asking for Glasnow and either Bell or Meadows plus others.
I think that's my point. Our offering is below what the Sox are asking. But will they end up taking what's currently on the table if that is all they can get? Who'll blink first? Will we offer more (given our history, in my mind no)? Will the Sox come down to what is being offered (maybe). Will another team surpass our offer (I have my doubts). Will both teams walk away form the table with no deal (maybe). It's in the Sox best interests to get all they can get -- and that may end up being what we are currently offering.
Quintana is a really good fit for us. I mentioned him as a "get" for us right after Sale was traded. Here's the Sox question. They are in full rebuilding mode. The next two years of Quintana are almost worthless from a competitive standpoint. They will not have the team to compete for a little while. Do you take a chance that you'll actually get more in two years (will he be injury-free at that time)? Do you believe he'll be your guy for the two years left on his contract when you can actually compete -- when your new pieces start reaching their potential? Do you mesh what you can get right now into your lineup as you rebuild (maybe Glasnow then becomes your go-to guy in two years)? I don't think they're holding all the cards as they have to balance all of Quintana's value possibilities. And I think we've gone as far as we'll go. Will they blink?
This I know, they need a young catcher pretty bad. I'm assuming Diaz is being dangled and while he no longer has a glamorous prospect status because of his age, he was minor league catcher of the year two years ago. I'm assuming it's Glasnow, Newman and Diaz (for whatever reason) right now. That's one top 10, another in the top 50 and a catcher who looks ready for full-time MLB play.
I would consider those three for Quintana. Still tough thinking of Glasnow's upside, but Quintana would be huge this season and next. Glasnow probably wouldn't be a staple in the rotation until 2019.
You guys are silly! If we could get Quintana for that package I think it would already be done. I have to assume the SOX are asking for Glasnow and either Bell or Meadows plus others.
I think that's my point. Our offering is below what the Sox are asking. But will they end up taking what's currently on the table if that is all they can get? Who'll blink first? Will we offer more (given our history, in my mind no)? Will the Sox come down to what is being offered (maybe). Will another team surpass our offer (I have my doubts). Will both teams walk away form the table with no deal (maybe). It's in the Sox best interests to get all they can get -- and that may end up being what we are currently offering.
Quintana is a really good fit for us. I mentioned him as a "get" for us right after Sale was traded. Here's the Sox question. They are in full rebuilding mode. The next two years of Quintana are almost worthless from a competitive standpoint. They will not have the team to compete for a little while. Do you take a chance that you'll actually get more in two years (will he be injury-free at that time)? Do you believe he'll be your guy for the two years left on his contract when you can actually compete -- when your new pieces start reaching their potential? Do you mesh what you can get right now into your lineup as you rebuild (maybe Glasnow then becomes your go-to guy in two years)? I don't think they're holding all the cards as they have to balance all of Quintana's value possibilities. And I think we've gone as far as we'll go. Will they blink?