Official Game Thread - 7/3 - Buc vs Cards

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Bobster
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Re: Official Game Thread - 7/3 - Buc vs Cards

Post by Bobster »

Batter hits to Tellez and Chapman forgets to cover 1B. FUNDAMENTALS!!!!!
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Bobster
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Re: Official Game Thread - 7/3 - Buc vs Cards

Post by Bobster »

Reynolds' single scores the imaginary runner. 4-4.

Cruz hit plates Cutch.

We had 'em all the way! :lol:
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Wildwoodcoach
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Re: Official Game Thread - 7/3 - Buc vs Cards

Post by Wildwoodcoach »

Raise it- That was fun!!
Possum
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Re: Official Game Thread - 7/3 - Buc vs Cards

Post by Possum »

Jones pulled due to right lat tightness.
Let's Go Bucs
Surgnbuck
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Re: Official Game Thread - 7/3 - Buc vs Cards

Post by Surgnbuck »

I lit a fire under Reynolds!!!!
Doc
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Re: Official Game Thread - 7/3 - Buc vs Cards

Post by Doc »

I was at the game last night and made it a point to watch Cruz in between plays, and before and after innings. I'll make no secret that I'm not a fan of his. I agree that he has immense talent but I also believe we'll never see it on full display.

To put it bluntly, he may be the laziest player I've ever seen. He was the last man both on and off the field in every inning. He never ran, jogged, or trotted to or from his position. Instead, he walked on and off the field every time, and I'm talking at a pace that one would walk when with a toddler. Even every outfielder arrived at the dugout before he did. In between plays, he looked totally unfocused, mostly looking all around the ballpark instead of toward the plate where the batter would already be settling in, oftentimes just getting himself in position and set as the pitch was being delivered. He appeared to be totally disinterested. The only time he did look like he cared was when he was at the plate.

I fully understand that baseball is hard. Really hard. What players deal with over 162 games, both on and off the field, is inconceivable to all of us. That makes it really difficult for me to criticize a player when he fails. But I find it inexcusable when a player is lazy. Intentionally lazy. They have a gift that the rest of us would give almost anything to possess. They only get to have that gift for a short time. To waste one second of it doesn't register with me.

I remember reading once where Billy Bean showed his players video of Derek Jeter hitting a routine groundball to second base late in a game the Yankees were losing by a large margin. The video showed Jeter running full tilt, making the play close, when it meant very little in the context of that lopsided game. It was to illustrate how the game's supposed to be played, by a guy who could've mailed it in because of his status and the situation, yet he understood his gift and wasn't going to give away any little bit of it.

I don't expect Oneil Cruz to be Derek Jeter but, even though Cruz's talent is miles beyond Jeter's ability, there's no question who I'd rather have on my team, especially at that position. I feel both sorrow for, and anger at, Cruz for not playing up to his ability because he's not going to be what he fully could be. And with each passing day, he'll have lost another opportunity to be the best he can be.
Bobster
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Re: Official Game Thread - 7/3 - Buc vs Cards

Post by Bobster »

Doc, as we have seen countless times, there is an accountability problem with the Pirates. As in, it doesn't exist. No one is ever held accountable. We've seen a phone on a player, Hayes eating sunflower seeds, players forgetting how many outs there are, throwing to the wrong base, making stupid baserunning mistakes, Wil Craig even forgot how to play the game. Players routinely jog up the 1B line. Or stand at the plate admiring a hit they incorrectly think is a HR. Cruz jogs to 1B on ground balls. So he probably sees nothing wrong with strolling leisurely on the field. All of this is tolerated so the players do it. They have no reason to change until and unless it's no longer tolerated.
There's no basement in the Alamo.
Doc
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Re: Official Game Thread - 7/3 - Buc vs Cards

Post by Doc »

Bobster wrote: Thu Jul 04, 2024 2:34 pm Doc, as we have seen countless times, there is an accountability problem with the Pirates. As in, it doesn't exist. No one is ever held accountable. We've seen a phone on a player, Hayes eating sunflower seeds, players forgetting how many outs there are, throwing to the wrong base, making stupid baserunning mistakes, Wil Craig even forgot how to play the game. Players routinely jog up the 1B line. Or stand at the plate admiring a hit they incorrectly think is a HR. Cruz jogs to 1B on ground balls. So he probably sees nothing wrong with strolling leisurely on the field. All of this is tolerated so the players do it. They have no reason to change until and unless it's no longer tolerated.
So, the question is, why is this the case? For the past 15+ years, we've had two GMs, various front office personnel, several different field managers, and numerous members of the coaching staffs from Pittsburgh on down through the minor league system. Is it possible that all, or the vast majority, agree that accountability is unnecessary? That would be hard to believe.

But the one thing that's been consistent since 2007 is the man at the top. It appears that having an accountability problem is no problem at all to him. After all, he's in charge of the entire operation. He can have any policy he desires, any employee he wants. He's obviously satisfied that the way the baseball operation is run, the way the players (his employees) perform their jobs, is fine or he'd make the necessary changes. Since he hasn't made changes in over 17 years, accountability mustn't be a concern.

Not expecting accountability makes it easier for him to justify his position (not publicly, of course) that winning isn't the priority.
Bobster
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Re: Official Game Thread - 7/3 - Buc vs Cards

Post by Bobster »

Doc wrote: Thu Jul 04, 2024 3:08 pm
Bobster wrote: Thu Jul 04, 2024 2:34 pm Doc, as we have seen countless times, there is an accountability problem with the Pirates. As in, it doesn't exist. No one is ever held accountable. We've seen a phone on a player, Hayes eating sunflower seeds, players forgetting how many outs there are, throwing to the wrong base, making stupid baserunning mistakes, Wil Craig even forgot how to play the game. Players routinely jog up the 1B line. Or stand at the plate admiring a hit they incorrectly think is a HR. Cruz jogs to 1B on ground balls. So he probably sees nothing wrong with strolling leisurely on the field. All of this is tolerated so the players do it. They have no reason to change until and unless it's no longer tolerated.
So, the question is, why is this the case? For the past 15+ years, we've had two GMs, various front office personnel, several different field managers, and numerous members of the coaching staffs from Pittsburgh on down through the minor league system. Is it possible that all, or the vast majority, agree that accountability is unnecessary? That would be hard to believe.

But the one thing that's been consistent since 2007 is the man at the top. It appears that having an accountability problem is no problem at all to him. After all, he's in charge of the entire operation. He can have any policy he desires, any employee he wants. He's obviously satisfied that the way the baseball operation is run, the way the players (his employees) perform their jobs, is fine or he'd make the necessary changes. Since he hasn't made changes in over 17 years, accountability mustn't be a concern.

Not expecting accountability makes it easier for him to justify his position (not publicly, of course) that winning isn't the priority.
Obviously, winning is not a priority with Nutting. So while I don't believe he actually thinks about the issue of accountability and decides against it, it's just something that doesn't occur to him. Little things that a winning organization addresses to give themselves every possible edge don't seem important to a team constantly treading water and just happy to stay out of last place. The focus of the Pirate organization seems to be on drafting and development, neither of which they are particularly good at, as well as keeping the players on the MLB roster rested and happy. Therre is no focus on leaving no stone unturned to give the team the best possible chance to win any given game. Hot hitters are rested, weak hitters bat cleanup, the manager makes decisions that are counterproductive to winning and players seem unfamiliar with the fundamentals of the game. It seems like the brain trust doesn't consider the team close enough to contending to make an issue of players' mistakes.
There's no basement in the Alamo.
JollyRoger8
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Re: Official Game Thread - 7/3 - Buc vs Cards

Post by JollyRoger8 »

Doc wrote: Thu Jul 04, 2024 2:11 pm I was at the game last night and made it a point to watch Cruz in between plays, and before and after innings. I'll make no secret that I'm not a fan of his. I agree that he has immense talent but I also believe we'll never see it on full display.

To put it bluntly, he may be the laziest player I've ever seen. He was the last man both on and off the field in every inning. He never ran, jogged, or trotted to or from his position. Instead, he walked on and off the field every time, and I'm talking at a pace that one would walk when with a toddler. Even every outfielder arrived at the dugout before he did. In between plays, he looked totally unfocused, mostly looking all around the ballpark instead of toward the plate where the batter would already be settling in, oftentimes just getting himself in position and set as the pitch was being delivered. He appeared to be totally disinterested. The only time he did look like he cared was when he was at the plate.

I fully understand that baseball is hard. Really hard. What players deal with over 162 games, both on and off the field, is inconceivable to all of us. That makes it really difficult for me to criticize a player when he fails. But I find it inexcusable when a player is lazy. Intentionally lazy. They have a gift that the rest of us would give almost anything to possess. They only get to have that gift for a short time. To waste one second of it doesn't register with me.

I remember reading once where Billy Bean showed his players video of Derek Jeter hitting a routine groundball to second base late in a game the Yankees were losing by a large margin. The video showed Jeter running full tilt, making the play close, when it meant very little in the context of that lopsided game. It was to illustrate how the game's supposed to be played, by a guy who could've mailed it in because of his status and the situation, yet he understood his gift and wasn't going to give away any little bit of it.

I don't expect Oneil Cruz to be Derek Jeter but, even though Cruz's talent is miles beyond Jeter's ability, there's no question who I'd rather have on my team, especially at that position. I feel both sorrow for, and anger at, Cruz for not playing up to his ability because he's not going to be what he fully could be. And with each passing day, he'll have lost another opportunity to be the best he can be.
Doc:
Do you think Cruz is lazier than Joggin George Hendrick?
I have been following Cruz closely since he was acquired from the Dodgers. I am not a scout but I saw that he was special.
I agree to a large extent in your comments. Cruz has been in professional ball since he was 16. He should be more mature by now. I think one of his issues that he needs to overcome is the fact that he does not control the highs and lows. When he is doing well he is all smiles and you can see the enthusiasm. But when he does poorly which is quite often, he sulks and lets it fester.
He’s been told all his career that his skill set is off the charts. Perhaps he developed a prima donna attitude. I think the Pirates really need to provide some counseling if they haven’t done so yet. After all we all know the Pirates record in developing their talent. It also would be beneficial in my opinion to have the Latin players on the team to get on his ass when he needs it. Nothing like peer pressure. He is too talented a player to give up on.
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