1C1417203613343B550 wrote: What happened when some fans tried to organize a "Walk Out"?
BOB wasn't booed. The people who walked out were.
So, in some respects, I think we get what we get.
For every complaint about a lackluster roster, I hear or read three people say that they'd rather see "kids" play.
So, I don't know what to think about the sad state of affairs anymore.
I remember when this happened. When people are more worried about being entertained than winning, this is sort of the result.
Whether it's "Buccaroos ask the Bucs," the Pierogi race, Cervelli's love advice, "What's in the Treasure Chest," or whatever other gimmick they have going on that day...whether it's fireworks, free shirt Fridays, or bobbleheads, whatever it is...people seem to be more interested in these things than the actual product on the field.
This is one reason why I loathe the NL DH. It just seems to me to cater to that mentality...people are only here to be entertained. Yes, but for me, baseball is much more than that. If it were just about entertainment, we'd just play home run derby every night.
For me, winning is fun. I was an MLB.tv subscriber, and I looked forward to watching the Pirates each night after work in 2013-2015. That was enjoyable. I haven't renewed the last two years. I have far better things to do with my time and money than watch the Bucs get their @$$e$ handed to them every night.
Yes, I'm excited about the future of the team. But I fear this new CBA won't do anything to help. We'll likely get faster free agency, "no service time manipulation" which in Pirate-land means guys will be traded in year four rather than year 5. We won't see a salary cap, anything having to do with equitable revenue sharing, or ending of the blackouts (not sure if that's even covered under the CBA or not). In short, the fans will be screwed, particularly fans in Milwaukee, Tampa, Cincinnati, Cleveland, and Pittsburgh.
Remind me again why I should care about this team or league? I really can't think of a compelling reason right now.
I don't think it's an issue of fans preferring entertainment at the ballpark to winning. But the Pirates don't offer a winning atmosphere at the park. They don't win frequently enough to make fans even expect it when they attend a game. But when they were winning in 2013, there was a level of excitement that fans at PNC rarely get to show. Remember the "Cueto" game. and when they won 98 games in 2015 they set a franchise attendance record. The fans want to win but Nutting & Co would rather save money and entertain them with gimmicks. That's what the fans are accustomed to, but they would prefer a competitive team.
Similarly, there was a previous comment from GW that "For every complaint about a lackluster roster, I hear or read three people say that they'd rather see "kids" play." But I don't believe it's a matter of the fans preferring to watch young guys play than to watch a talented, winning roster. But I think if the choices are a losing team comprised of dumpster dives and a losing team comprised of "kids," the kids at least offer hope for a better future if they take advantage of the opportunity and develop up to their potential. In terms of competitive baseball, the Pirates offer their fans a very limited product. I think the fans just make the most of what's available to them.
DH To National League
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GreenWeenie
- Posts: 4012
- Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2020 3:47 pm
DH To National League
BOB's franchise value is based on his ability to peddle hope. To be fair, he's not alone in that.
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GreenWeenie
- Posts: 4012
- Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2020 3:47 pm
DH To National League
464E4D7A6C496E610F0 wrote: What happened when some fans tried to organize a "Walk Out"?
BOB wasn't booed. The people who walked out were.
So, in some respects, I think we get what we get.
For every complaint about a lackluster roster, I hear or read three people say that they'd rather see "kids" play.
So, I don't know what to think about the sad state of affairs anymore.
I remember when this happened. When people are more worried about being entertained than winning, this is sort of the result.
Whether it's "Buccaroos ask the Bucs," the Pierogi race, Cervelli's love advice, "What's in the Treasure Chest," or whatever other gimmick they have going on that day...whether it's fireworks, free shirt Fridays, or bobbleheads, whatever it is...people seem to be more interested in these things than the actual product on the field.
This is one reason why I loathe the NL DH. It just seems to me to cater to that mentality...people are only here to be entertained. Yes, but for me, baseball is much more than that. If it were just about entertainment, we'd just play home run derby every night.
For me, winning is fun. I was an MLB.tv subscriber, and I looked forward to watching the Pirates each night after work in 2013-2015. That was enjoyable. I haven't renewed the last two years. I have far better things to do with my time and money than watch the Bucs get their @$$e$ handed to them every night.
Yes, I'm excited about the future of the team. But I fear this new CBA won't do anything to help. We'll likely get faster free agency, "no service time manipulation" which in Pirate-land means guys will be traded in year four rather than year 5. We won't see a salary cap, anything having to do with equitable revenue sharing, or ending of the blackouts (not sure if that's even covered under the CBA or not). In short, the fans will be screwed, particularly fans in Milwaukee, Tampa, Cincinnati, Cleveland, and Pittsburgh.
Remind me again why I should care about this team or league? I really can't think of a compelling reason right now.
I'll answer your "question" first, then I'll ask one.
I've asked myself part of your same question several times. Why should I care about the Pirates? I've maintained since the day I first wrote it, that the Pirates will never win the World Series until one or more of the following conditions exist, not in any specific order:
1. Nutting is no longer involved with the team.
2. There is a change in the manner in which teams qualify for post-season play (note- since I originally wrote it, there has already been one. The second WC was implemented. Now, there's talk of further playoff expansion.)
3. A significant, and I mean significant, change to the CBA, such as implementing a salary cap and salary floor.
4. Division realignment
I hold that one or more of those have to happen. Otherwise, we will finish somewhere between second and 30. I'm good with that. I hold the dream of making it as far as the NLCS, final four. I
I love the competition. I had to enjoy baseball before I could love my team. I love seeing the best pitchers face the best hitters. I love each game, regardless of when the last one is played.
I wrote that over ten years ago. My opinion hasn't changed. Yet, I am still anything BUT a 'so-called fan."
I'm a Pirates fan because, the Pirates, Steelers, and Pitt Panthers are my only remaining tie to the western Pennsylvania region OTHER THAN my two brothers who remain there. I was once more of a Penguins fan, but that's since ended only because I don't have the free time that I had in the past. One had to give, and I chose hockey.
The Pirates take me back in my memory of going to the 71 World Series with Big Weenie. No matter WHAT BOB does to make me ruin my love for the team he owns, he will NEVER take those memories from me.
Now, my question for you (and others) is- Forget Revenue Sharing. It will never happen, so any time saying that MLB teams should share revenue equally will never happen. There are a number of reasons why it won't.
Other owners already give smaller-revenue teams money. I don't know how much, but they do.
What exactly do you want other teams to do that would help them be better competitors? I haven't been able to think of anything. Should smaller-market teams get better draft position? Should they be allowed to do things that other teams can't? No. I haven't been able to come up with ideas.
Other teams are too busy trying to find ways to make their own team better. They don't have time to solve the Pirates problem. Everyone knows what that problem is.
BOB wasn't booed. The people who walked out were.
So, in some respects, I think we get what we get.
For every complaint about a lackluster roster, I hear or read three people say that they'd rather see "kids" play.
So, I don't know what to think about the sad state of affairs anymore.
I remember when this happened. When people are more worried about being entertained than winning, this is sort of the result.
Whether it's "Buccaroos ask the Bucs," the Pierogi race, Cervelli's love advice, "What's in the Treasure Chest," or whatever other gimmick they have going on that day...whether it's fireworks, free shirt Fridays, or bobbleheads, whatever it is...people seem to be more interested in these things than the actual product on the field.
This is one reason why I loathe the NL DH. It just seems to me to cater to that mentality...people are only here to be entertained. Yes, but for me, baseball is much more than that. If it were just about entertainment, we'd just play home run derby every night.
For me, winning is fun. I was an MLB.tv subscriber, and I looked forward to watching the Pirates each night after work in 2013-2015. That was enjoyable. I haven't renewed the last two years. I have far better things to do with my time and money than watch the Bucs get their @$$e$ handed to them every night.
Yes, I'm excited about the future of the team. But I fear this new CBA won't do anything to help. We'll likely get faster free agency, "no service time manipulation" which in Pirate-land means guys will be traded in year four rather than year 5. We won't see a salary cap, anything having to do with equitable revenue sharing, or ending of the blackouts (not sure if that's even covered under the CBA or not). In short, the fans will be screwed, particularly fans in Milwaukee, Tampa, Cincinnati, Cleveland, and Pittsburgh.
Remind me again why I should care about this team or league? I really can't think of a compelling reason right now.
I'll answer your "question" first, then I'll ask one.
I've asked myself part of your same question several times. Why should I care about the Pirates? I've maintained since the day I first wrote it, that the Pirates will never win the World Series until one or more of the following conditions exist, not in any specific order:
1. Nutting is no longer involved with the team.
2. There is a change in the manner in which teams qualify for post-season play (note- since I originally wrote it, there has already been one. The second WC was implemented. Now, there's talk of further playoff expansion.)
3. A significant, and I mean significant, change to the CBA, such as implementing a salary cap and salary floor.
4. Division realignment
I hold that one or more of those have to happen. Otherwise, we will finish somewhere between second and 30. I'm good with that. I hold the dream of making it as far as the NLCS, final four. I
I love the competition. I had to enjoy baseball before I could love my team. I love seeing the best pitchers face the best hitters. I love each game, regardless of when the last one is played.
I wrote that over ten years ago. My opinion hasn't changed. Yet, I am still anything BUT a 'so-called fan."
I'm a Pirates fan because, the Pirates, Steelers, and Pitt Panthers are my only remaining tie to the western Pennsylvania region OTHER THAN my two brothers who remain there. I was once more of a Penguins fan, but that's since ended only because I don't have the free time that I had in the past. One had to give, and I chose hockey.
The Pirates take me back in my memory of going to the 71 World Series with Big Weenie. No matter WHAT BOB does to make me ruin my love for the team he owns, he will NEVER take those memories from me.
Now, my question for you (and others) is- Forget Revenue Sharing. It will never happen, so any time saying that MLB teams should share revenue equally will never happen. There are a number of reasons why it won't.
Other owners already give smaller-revenue teams money. I don't know how much, but they do.
What exactly do you want other teams to do that would help them be better competitors? I haven't been able to think of anything. Should smaller-market teams get better draft position? Should they be allowed to do things that other teams can't? No. I haven't been able to come up with ideas.
Other teams are too busy trying to find ways to make their own team better. They don't have time to solve the Pirates problem. Everyone knows what that problem is.
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DemDog
DH To National League
427760606B5260606B6C60050 wrote: What happened when some fans tried to organize a "Walk Out"?
BOB wasn't booed. The people who walked out were.
So, in some respects, I think we get what we get.
For every complaint about a lackluster roster, I hear or read three people say that they'd rather see "kids" play.
So, I don't know what to think about the sad state of affairs anymore.
I remember when this happened. When people are more worried about being entertained than winning, this is sort of the result.
Whether it's "Buccaroos ask the Bucs," the Pierogi race, Cervelli's love advice, "What's in the Treasure Chest," or whatever other gimmick they have going on that day...whether it's fireworks, free shirt Fridays, or bobbleheads, whatever it is...people seem to be more interested in these things than the actual product on the field.
This is one reason why I loathe the NL DH. It just seems to me to cater to that mentality...people are only here to be entertained. Yes, but for me, baseball is much more than that. If it were just about entertainment, we'd just play home run derby every night.
For me, winning is fun. I was an MLB.tv subscriber, and I looked forward to watching the Pirates each night after work in 2013-2015. That was enjoyable. I haven't renewed the last two years. I have far better things to do with my time and money than watch the Bucs get their @$$e$ handed to them every night.
Yes, I'm excited about the future of the team. But I fear this new CBA won't do anything to help. We'll likely get faster free agency, "no service time manipulation" which in Pirate-land means guys will be traded in year four rather than year 5. We won't see a salary cap, anything having to do with equitable revenue sharing, or ending of the blackouts (not sure if that's even covered under the CBA or not). In short, the fans will be screwed, particularly fans in Milwaukee, Tampa, Cincinnati, Cleveland, and Pittsburgh.
Remind me again why I should care about this team or league? I really can't think of a compelling reason right now.
I'll answer your "question" first, then I'll ask one.
I've asked myself part of your same question several times. Why should I care about the Pirates? I've maintained since the day I first wrote it, that the Pirates will never win the World Series until one or more of the following conditions exist, not in any specific order:
1. Nutting is no longer involved with the team.
2. There is a change in the manner in which teams qualify for post-season play (note- since I originally wrote it, there has already been one. The second WC was implemented. Now, there's talk of further playoff expansion.)
3. A significant, and I mean significant, change to the CBA, such as implementing a salary cap and salary floor.
4. Division realignment
I hold that one or more of those have to happen. Otherwise, we will finish somewhere between second and 30. I'm good with that. I hold the dream of making it as far as the NLCS, final four. I
I love the competition. I had to enjoy baseball before I could love my team. I love seeing the best pitchers face the best hitters. I love each game, regardless of when the last one is played.
I wrote that over ten years ago. My opinion hasn't changed. Yet, I am still anything BUT a 'so-called fan."
I'm a Pirates fan because, the Pirates, Steelers, and Pitt Panthers are my only remaining tie to the western Pennsylvania region OTHER THAN my two brothers who remain there. I was once more of a Penguins fan, but that's since ended only because I don't have the free time that I had in the past. One had to give, and I chose hockey.
The Pirates take me back in my memory of going to the 71 World Series with Big Weenie. No matter WHAT BOB does to make me ruin my love for the team he owns, he will NEVER take those memories from me.
Now, my question for you (and others) is- Forget Revenue Sharing. It will never happen, so any time saying that MLB teams should share revenue equally will never happen. There are a number of reasons why it won't.
Other owners already give smaller-revenue teams money. I don't know how much, but they do.
What exactly do you want other teams to do that would help them be better competitors? I haven't been able to think of anything. Should smaller-market teams get better draft position? Should they be allowed to do things that other teams can't? No. I haven't been able to come up with ideas.
Other teams are too busy trying to find ways to make their own team better. They don't have time to solve the Pirates problem. Everyone knows what that problem is.
Geesh GW you are bringing tears to my eyes. I remember sitting home when they won the 60 series and Big Possum had tickets to 2 games and did not take 12 yr old me along. During that 60 season, the Big Possum took me to many games and he also did the same until he had a stroke in 1987. Win or lose, Big Possum and I had many great times together rooting on the Bucs. I have had the chance to introduce my daughter and her two kids to Bucco baseball even though they live in Chicagoland. When they come back to PA for a visit in the summer we always take in a couple of Buc games and they are there for more than just the fireworks, pierogi races, etc. They enjoy watching the game and letting their Poppy teach them about baseball. Thanks for bringing back those memories GW. [smiley=happy.gif] [smiley=happy.gif] [smiley=happy.gif]
BOB wasn't booed. The people who walked out were.
So, in some respects, I think we get what we get.
For every complaint about a lackluster roster, I hear or read three people say that they'd rather see "kids" play.
So, I don't know what to think about the sad state of affairs anymore.
I remember when this happened. When people are more worried about being entertained than winning, this is sort of the result.
Whether it's "Buccaroos ask the Bucs," the Pierogi race, Cervelli's love advice, "What's in the Treasure Chest," or whatever other gimmick they have going on that day...whether it's fireworks, free shirt Fridays, or bobbleheads, whatever it is...people seem to be more interested in these things than the actual product on the field.
This is one reason why I loathe the NL DH. It just seems to me to cater to that mentality...people are only here to be entertained. Yes, but for me, baseball is much more than that. If it were just about entertainment, we'd just play home run derby every night.
For me, winning is fun. I was an MLB.tv subscriber, and I looked forward to watching the Pirates each night after work in 2013-2015. That was enjoyable. I haven't renewed the last two years. I have far better things to do with my time and money than watch the Bucs get their @$$e$ handed to them every night.
Yes, I'm excited about the future of the team. But I fear this new CBA won't do anything to help. We'll likely get faster free agency, "no service time manipulation" which in Pirate-land means guys will be traded in year four rather than year 5. We won't see a salary cap, anything having to do with equitable revenue sharing, or ending of the blackouts (not sure if that's even covered under the CBA or not). In short, the fans will be screwed, particularly fans in Milwaukee, Tampa, Cincinnati, Cleveland, and Pittsburgh.
Remind me again why I should care about this team or league? I really can't think of a compelling reason right now.
I'll answer your "question" first, then I'll ask one.
I've asked myself part of your same question several times. Why should I care about the Pirates? I've maintained since the day I first wrote it, that the Pirates will never win the World Series until one or more of the following conditions exist, not in any specific order:
1. Nutting is no longer involved with the team.
2. There is a change in the manner in which teams qualify for post-season play (note- since I originally wrote it, there has already been one. The second WC was implemented. Now, there's talk of further playoff expansion.)
3. A significant, and I mean significant, change to the CBA, such as implementing a salary cap and salary floor.
4. Division realignment
I hold that one or more of those have to happen. Otherwise, we will finish somewhere between second and 30. I'm good with that. I hold the dream of making it as far as the NLCS, final four. I
I love the competition. I had to enjoy baseball before I could love my team. I love seeing the best pitchers face the best hitters. I love each game, regardless of when the last one is played.
I wrote that over ten years ago. My opinion hasn't changed. Yet, I am still anything BUT a 'so-called fan."
I'm a Pirates fan because, the Pirates, Steelers, and Pitt Panthers are my only remaining tie to the western Pennsylvania region OTHER THAN my two brothers who remain there. I was once more of a Penguins fan, but that's since ended only because I don't have the free time that I had in the past. One had to give, and I chose hockey.
The Pirates take me back in my memory of going to the 71 World Series with Big Weenie. No matter WHAT BOB does to make me ruin my love for the team he owns, he will NEVER take those memories from me.
Now, my question for you (and others) is- Forget Revenue Sharing. It will never happen, so any time saying that MLB teams should share revenue equally will never happen. There are a number of reasons why it won't.
Other owners already give smaller-revenue teams money. I don't know how much, but they do.
What exactly do you want other teams to do that would help them be better competitors? I haven't been able to think of anything. Should smaller-market teams get better draft position? Should they be allowed to do things that other teams can't? No. I haven't been able to come up with ideas.
Other teams are too busy trying to find ways to make their own team better. They don't have time to solve the Pirates problem. Everyone knows what that problem is.
Geesh GW you are bringing tears to my eyes. I remember sitting home when they won the 60 series and Big Possum had tickets to 2 games and did not take 12 yr old me along. During that 60 season, the Big Possum took me to many games and he also did the same until he had a stroke in 1987. Win or lose, Big Possum and I had many great times together rooting on the Bucs. I have had the chance to introduce my daughter and her two kids to Bucco baseball even though they live in Chicagoland. When they come back to PA for a visit in the summer we always take in a couple of Buc games and they are there for more than just the fireworks, pierogi races, etc. They enjoy watching the game and letting their Poppy teach them about baseball. Thanks for bringing back those memories GW. [smiley=happy.gif] [smiley=happy.gif] [smiley=happy.gif]
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GreenWeenie
- Posts: 4012
- Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2020 3:47 pm
DH To National League
To be open- and, fair- Big was a good man, but he had his faults.
He forced me to go with him to my share of Pitt games back in the day. Larry Csonka (Syracuse,) Gary Beban (UCLA Heisman winner,) Ted Kwalick and Jack Hamm (Penn State,) you name it. I witnessed it.
Let's just say that I've earned my stripes.
You think BOB's teams are bad?
Big lived to see Pitt win the national championship, but he was no fan of Tony Dorsett because of the parking tickets that someone took care of.
He forced me to go with him to my share of Pitt games back in the day. Larry Csonka (Syracuse,) Gary Beban (UCLA Heisman winner,) Ted Kwalick and Jack Hamm (Penn State,) you name it. I witnessed it.
Let's just say that I've earned my stripes.
You think BOB's teams are bad?
Big lived to see Pitt win the national championship, but he was no fan of Tony Dorsett because of the parking tickets that someone took care of.
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GreenWeenie
- Posts: 4012
- Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2020 3:47 pm
DH To National League
Sorry for the multiples. I realize that I might not have been as clear with my explanation as to why I remain a fan of the team:
I always have the goal of at least reaching the NLCS. That's my target no matter what anyone says our chances are. I think that we should always have that expectation. To think otherwise just allows the status quo....to go on being the status guo. That's my mentality- to get to the NLCS.
I think that our highest possible outcome is to win that. I don't think that we stand any chance of becoming world champions under Nutting for reasons I've explained before.
Still, even though I know that we can't win the World Series, I see no reason at all why that should take away my love for the sport or the team. I can still enjioy the chase; the competition. I can enjoy winning each day's game. I enjoy the one-on-one matchups and the one-against-nine.
I choose not to concentrate on things that don't matter to me. The "unfairness" doesn't matter to me. The incompetence does. That matters a lot to me, as most of you have probably come to know. When someone is incompetent, they're often incompetent with financial decisions as much as anything else.
I always have the goal of at least reaching the NLCS. That's my target no matter what anyone says our chances are. I think that we should always have that expectation. To think otherwise just allows the status quo....to go on being the status guo. That's my mentality- to get to the NLCS.
I think that our highest possible outcome is to win that. I don't think that we stand any chance of becoming world champions under Nutting for reasons I've explained before.
Still, even though I know that we can't win the World Series, I see no reason at all why that should take away my love for the sport or the team. I can still enjioy the chase; the competition. I can enjoy winning each day's game. I enjoy the one-on-one matchups and the one-against-nine.
I choose not to concentrate on things that don't matter to me. The "unfairness" doesn't matter to me. The incompetence does. That matters a lot to me, as most of you have probably come to know. When someone is incompetent, they're often incompetent with financial decisions as much as anything else.
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WildwoodDave2
DH To National League
033621212A1321212A2D21440 wrote: Sorry for the multiples. I realize that I might not have been as clear with my explanation as to why I remain a fan of the team:
I always have the goal of at least reaching the NLCS. That's my target no matter what anyone says our chances are. I think that we should always have that expectation. To think otherwise just allows the status quo....to go on being the status guo. That's my mentality- to get to the NLCS.
I think that our highest possible outcome is to win that. I don't think that we stand any chance of becoming world champions under Nutting for reasons I've explained before.
Still, even though I know that we can't win the World Series, I see no reason at all why that should take away my love for the sport or the team. I can still enjioy the chase; the competition. I can enjoy winning each day's game. I enjoy the one-on-one matchups and the one-against-nine.
I choose not to concentrate on things that don't matter to me. The "unfairness" doesn't matter to me. The incompetence does. That matters a lot to me, as most of you have probably come to know. When someone is incompetent, they're often incompetent with financial decisions as much as anything else.
In other words, Bob is a big fan of the Status Quo!!
I always have the goal of at least reaching the NLCS. That's my target no matter what anyone says our chances are. I think that we should always have that expectation. To think otherwise just allows the status quo....to go on being the status guo. That's my mentality- to get to the NLCS.
I think that our highest possible outcome is to win that. I don't think that we stand any chance of becoming world champions under Nutting for reasons I've explained before.
Still, even though I know that we can't win the World Series, I see no reason at all why that should take away my love for the sport or the team. I can still enjioy the chase; the competition. I can enjoy winning each day's game. I enjoy the one-on-one matchups and the one-against-nine.
I choose not to concentrate on things that don't matter to me. The "unfairness" doesn't matter to me. The incompetence does. That matters a lot to me, as most of you have probably come to know. When someone is incompetent, they're often incompetent with financial decisions as much as anything else.
In other words, Bob is a big fan of the Status Quo!!
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WildwoodDave2
DH To National League
79585079525A3D0 wrote: What happened when some fans tried to organize a "Walk Out"?
BOB wasn't booed. The people who walked out were.
So, in some respects, I think we get what we get.
For every complaint about a lackluster roster, I hear or read three people say that they'd rather see "kids" play.
So, I don't know what to think about the sad state of affairs anymore.
I remember when this happened. When people are more worried about being entertained than winning, this is sort of the result.
Whether it's "Buccaroos ask the Bucs," the Pierogi race, Cervelli's love advice, "What's in the Treasure Chest," or whatever other gimmick they have going on that day...whether it's fireworks, free shirt Fridays, or bobbleheads, whatever it is...people seem to be more interested in these things than the actual product on the field.
This is one reason why I loathe the NL DH. It just seems to me to cater to that mentality...people are only here to be entertained. Yes, but for me, baseball is much more than that. If it were just about entertainment, we'd just play home run derby every night.
For me, winning is fun. I was an MLB.tv subscriber, and I looked forward to watching the Pirates each night after work in 2013-2015. That was enjoyable. I haven't renewed the last two years. I have far better things to do with my time and money than watch the Bucs get their @$$e$ handed to them every night.
Yes, I'm excited about the future of the team. But I fear this new CBA won't do anything to help. We'll likely get faster free agency, "no service time manipulation" which in Pirate-land means guys will be traded in year four rather than year 5. We won't see a salary cap, anything having to do with equitable revenue sharing, or ending of the blackouts (not sure if that's even covered under the CBA or not). In short, the fans will be screwed, particularly fans in Milwaukee, Tampa, Cincinnati, Cleveland, and Pittsburgh.
Remind me again why I should care about this team or league? I really can't think of a compelling reason right now.
I'll answer your "question" first, then I'll ask one.
I've asked myself part of your same question several times. Why should I care about the Pirates? I've maintained since the day I first wrote it, that the Pirates will never win the World Series until one or more of the following conditions exist, not in any specific order:
1. Nutting is no longer involved with the team.
2. There is a change in the manner in which teams qualify for post-season play (note- since I originally wrote it, there has already been one. The second WC was implemented. Now, there's talk of further playoff expansion.)
3. A significant, and I mean significant, change to the CBA, such as implementing a salary cap and salary floor.
4. Division realignment
I hold that one or more of those have to happen. Otherwise, we will finish somewhere between second and 30. I'm good with that. I hold the dream of making it as far as the NLCS, final four. I
I love the competition. I had to enjoy baseball before I could love my team. I love seeing the best pitchers face the best hitters. I love each game, regardless of when the last one is played.
I wrote that over ten years ago. My opinion hasn't changed. Yet, I am still anything BUT a 'so-called fan."
I'm a Pirates fan because, the Pirates, Steelers, and Pitt Panthers are my only remaining tie to the western Pennsylvania region OTHER THAN my two brothers who remain there. I was once more of a Penguins fan, but that's since ended only because I don't have the free time that I had in the past. One had to give, and I chose hockey.
The Pirates take me back in my memory of going to the 71 World Series with Big Weenie. No matter WHAT BOB does to make me ruin my love for the team he owns, he will NEVER take those memories from me.
Now, my question for you (and others) is- Forget Revenue Sharing. It will never happen, so any time saying that MLB teams should share revenue equally will never happen. There are a number of reasons why it won't.
Other owners already give smaller-revenue teams money. I don't know how much, but they do.
What exactly do you want other teams to do that would help them be better competitors? I haven't been able to think of anything. Should smaller-market teams get better draft position? Should they be allowed to do things that other teams can't? No. I haven't been able to come up with ideas.
Other teams are too busy trying to find ways to make their own team better. They don't have time to solve the Pirates problem. Everyone knows what that problem is.
Geesh GW you are bringing tears to my eyes. I remember sitting home when they won the 60 series and Big Possum had tickets to 2 games and did not take 12 yr old me along. During that 60 season, the Big Possum took me to many games and he also did the same until he had a stroke in 1987. Win or lose, Big Possum and I had many great times together rooting on the Bucs. I have had the chance to introduce my daughter and her two kids to Bucco baseball even though they live in Chicagoland. When they come back to PA for a visit in the summer we always take in a couple of Buc games and they are there for more than just the fireworks, pierogi races, etc. They enjoy watching the game and letting their Poppy teach them about baseball. Thanks for bringing back those memories GW. [smiley=happy.gif] [smiley=happy.gif] [smiley=happy.gif]
Amazing, Big Wildwood had two tickets and didn't take me as well. I believe it was game 4. Also, he hated the gunner but loved the Possum
BOB wasn't booed. The people who walked out were.
So, in some respects, I think we get what we get.
For every complaint about a lackluster roster, I hear or read three people say that they'd rather see "kids" play.
So, I don't know what to think about the sad state of affairs anymore.
I remember when this happened. When people are more worried about being entertained than winning, this is sort of the result.
Whether it's "Buccaroos ask the Bucs," the Pierogi race, Cervelli's love advice, "What's in the Treasure Chest," or whatever other gimmick they have going on that day...whether it's fireworks, free shirt Fridays, or bobbleheads, whatever it is...people seem to be more interested in these things than the actual product on the field.
This is one reason why I loathe the NL DH. It just seems to me to cater to that mentality...people are only here to be entertained. Yes, but for me, baseball is much more than that. If it were just about entertainment, we'd just play home run derby every night.
For me, winning is fun. I was an MLB.tv subscriber, and I looked forward to watching the Pirates each night after work in 2013-2015. That was enjoyable. I haven't renewed the last two years. I have far better things to do with my time and money than watch the Bucs get their @$$e$ handed to them every night.
Yes, I'm excited about the future of the team. But I fear this new CBA won't do anything to help. We'll likely get faster free agency, "no service time manipulation" which in Pirate-land means guys will be traded in year four rather than year 5. We won't see a salary cap, anything having to do with equitable revenue sharing, or ending of the blackouts (not sure if that's even covered under the CBA or not). In short, the fans will be screwed, particularly fans in Milwaukee, Tampa, Cincinnati, Cleveland, and Pittsburgh.
Remind me again why I should care about this team or league? I really can't think of a compelling reason right now.
I'll answer your "question" first, then I'll ask one.
I've asked myself part of your same question several times. Why should I care about the Pirates? I've maintained since the day I first wrote it, that the Pirates will never win the World Series until one or more of the following conditions exist, not in any specific order:
1. Nutting is no longer involved with the team.
2. There is a change in the manner in which teams qualify for post-season play (note- since I originally wrote it, there has already been one. The second WC was implemented. Now, there's talk of further playoff expansion.)
3. A significant, and I mean significant, change to the CBA, such as implementing a salary cap and salary floor.
4. Division realignment
I hold that one or more of those have to happen. Otherwise, we will finish somewhere between second and 30. I'm good with that. I hold the dream of making it as far as the NLCS, final four. I
I love the competition. I had to enjoy baseball before I could love my team. I love seeing the best pitchers face the best hitters. I love each game, regardless of when the last one is played.
I wrote that over ten years ago. My opinion hasn't changed. Yet, I am still anything BUT a 'so-called fan."
I'm a Pirates fan because, the Pirates, Steelers, and Pitt Panthers are my only remaining tie to the western Pennsylvania region OTHER THAN my two brothers who remain there. I was once more of a Penguins fan, but that's since ended only because I don't have the free time that I had in the past. One had to give, and I chose hockey.
The Pirates take me back in my memory of going to the 71 World Series with Big Weenie. No matter WHAT BOB does to make me ruin my love for the team he owns, he will NEVER take those memories from me.
Now, my question for you (and others) is- Forget Revenue Sharing. It will never happen, so any time saying that MLB teams should share revenue equally will never happen. There are a number of reasons why it won't.
Other owners already give smaller-revenue teams money. I don't know how much, but they do.
What exactly do you want other teams to do that would help them be better competitors? I haven't been able to think of anything. Should smaller-market teams get better draft position? Should they be allowed to do things that other teams can't? No. I haven't been able to come up with ideas.
Other teams are too busy trying to find ways to make their own team better. They don't have time to solve the Pirates problem. Everyone knows what that problem is.
Geesh GW you are bringing tears to my eyes. I remember sitting home when they won the 60 series and Big Possum had tickets to 2 games and did not take 12 yr old me along. During that 60 season, the Big Possum took me to many games and he also did the same until he had a stroke in 1987. Win or lose, Big Possum and I had many great times together rooting on the Bucs. I have had the chance to introduce my daughter and her two kids to Bucco baseball even though they live in Chicagoland. When they come back to PA for a visit in the summer we always take in a couple of Buc games and they are there for more than just the fireworks, pierogi races, etc. They enjoy watching the game and letting their Poppy teach them about baseball. Thanks for bringing back those memories GW. [smiley=happy.gif] [smiley=happy.gif] [smiley=happy.gif]
Amazing, Big Wildwood had two tickets and didn't take me as well. I believe it was game 4. Also, he hated the gunner but loved the Possum
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ChillinStation
- Posts: 424
- Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2020 2:40 pm
DH To National League
I`m cool with the DH, about time.
Nobody wants to watch a Pitcher hit. And all that strategy that will will now miss.
Boo Hoo, we all complain about how MGRS. suck making decision's anyway.
Playball
Nobody wants to watch a Pitcher hit. And all that strategy that will will now miss.
Boo Hoo, we all complain about how MGRS. suck making decision's anyway.
Playball
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SammyKhalifa
- Posts: 3631
- Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2016 4:19 am
DH To National League
5C7776737376714C6B7E6B7670711F0 wrote: I`m cool with the DH, about time.
Nobody wants to watch a Pitcher hit. And all that strategy that will will now miss.
Boo Hoo, we all complain about how MGRS. suck making decision's anyway.
Playball
But nobody wants to see a big guy run, either. And there are no cries for Designated Runners. Because, you know, running to a base is part of the game. That would be stupid.
Nobody wants to watch a Pitcher hit. And all that strategy that will will now miss.
Boo Hoo, we all complain about how MGRS. suck making decision's anyway.
Playball
But nobody wants to see a big guy run, either. And there are no cries for Designated Runners. Because, you know, running to a base is part of the game. That would be stupid.