An observation
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
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SammyKhalifa
- Posts: 3631
- Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2016 4:19 am
An observation
Yeah, his reason for not ever going for the big move is because he said he wanted to be competitive year in and year out.
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dogknot17@yahoo.co
An observation
So, I shouldn't accept reality because a lot of fans aren't accepting it? Sorry, I am not quitting on the Pirates or baseball in general. That doesn't mean I am happy with the current situation, but I can't change it. People have to accept reality or move on. It is what it is. The trades happened. Rebuilding is happening.
I think giving him three years is fair. Most teams rebuild in three to four years. If he shows no signs, they need to bring in someone who will, someone better.
I think giving him three years is fair. Most teams rebuild in three to four years. If he shows no signs, they need to bring in someone who will, someone better.
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SammyKhalifa
- Posts: 3631
- Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2016 4:19 am
An observation
Now I will say (whether someone one agrees with them or not) is that this is why ownership gave them a longer extension than a lot of us expected. Someone about to break things down needs to be able to so without looking over their shoulders.
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rucker59@gmail.com
An observation
4C474F4346475C191F685149404747064B47280 wrote: So, I shouldn't accept reality because a lot of fans aren't accepting it? Sorry, I am not quitting on the Pirates or baseball in general. That doesn't mean I am happy with the current situation, but I can't change it. People have to accept reality or move on. It is what it is. The trades happened. Rebuilding is happening.
I think giving him three years is fair. Most teams rebuild in three to four years. If he shows no signs, they need to bring in someone who will, someone better.
That’s fine. We can agree that Neal failed at a fundamental level with regard to his plan. You think he deserves three years to rebuild and within five years the Pirates will be serious contenders.
Personally I like Neal. But I don’t see any way he builds a contender in three years. Why do you think he can accomplish this?
I think giving him three years is fair. Most teams rebuild in three to four years. If he shows no signs, they need to bring in someone who will, someone better.
That’s fine. We can agree that Neal failed at a fundamental level with regard to his plan. You think he deserves three years to rebuild and within five years the Pirates will be serious contenders.
Personally I like Neal. But I don’t see any way he builds a contender in three years. Why do you think he can accomplish this?
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dogknot17@yahoo.co
An observation
101701090710575B22050F030B0E4C010D0F620 wrote: So, I shouldn't accept reality because a lot of fans aren't accepting it? Sorry, I am not quitting on the Pirates or baseball in general. That doesn't mean I am happy with the current situation, but I can't change it. People have to accept reality or move on. It is what it is. The trades happened. Rebuilding is happening.
I think giving him three years is fair. Most teams rebuild in three to four years. If he shows no signs, they need to bring in someone who will, someone better.
That’s fine. We can agree that Neal failed at a fundamental level with regard to his plan. You think he deserves three years to rebuild and within five years the Pirates will be serious contenders.
Personally I like Neal. But I don’t see any way he builds a contender in three years. Why do you think he can accomplish this?
I don't know if he can accomplish this. The reality is that he is under contract for four years. I don't see him being fired now or next year.
I like Huntington too. He has done it before. If he doesn't do it again, he will be gone. I blame Huntington more than Nutting. Huntington's drafts have been pretty bad and so have some of his signings/talent evaluation.
I think giving him three years is fair. Most teams rebuild in three to four years. If he shows no signs, they need to bring in someone who will, someone better.
That’s fine. We can agree that Neal failed at a fundamental level with regard to his plan. You think he deserves three years to rebuild and within five years the Pirates will be serious contenders.
Personally I like Neal. But I don’t see any way he builds a contender in three years. Why do you think he can accomplish this?
I don't know if he can accomplish this. The reality is that he is under contract for four years. I don't see him being fired now or next year.
I like Huntington too. He has done it before. If he doesn't do it again, he will be gone. I blame Huntington more than Nutting. Huntington's drafts have been pretty bad and so have some of his signings/talent evaluation.
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rucker59@gmail.com
An observation
212A222E2B2A317472053C242D2A2A6B262A450 wrote: So, I shouldn't accept reality because a lot of fans aren't accepting it? Sorry, I am not quitting on the Pirates or baseball in general. That doesn't mean I am happy with the current situation, but I can't change it. People have to accept reality or move on. It is what it is. The trades happened. Rebuilding is happening.
I think giving him three years is fair. Most teams rebuild in three to four years. If he shows no signs, they need to bring in someone who will, someone better.
That’s fine. We can agree that Neal failed at a fundamental level with regard to his plan. You think he deserves three years to rebuild and within five years the Pirates will be serious contenders.
Personally I like Neal. But I don’t see any way he builds a contender in three years. Why do you think he can accomplish this?
I don't know if he can accomplish this. The reality is that he is under contract for four years. I don't see him being fired now or next year.
I like Huntington too. He has done it before. If he doesn't do it again, he will be gone. I blame Huntington more than Nutting. Huntington's drafts have been pretty bad and so have some of his signings/talent evaluation.
Fair enough. Neal has a contract and will get at least four years. Let’s hope he can pull another rabbit out of the hat. I’d love to be wrong. But I think there is a more like chance we’re looking at four more losing seasons.
I think giving him three years is fair. Most teams rebuild in three to four years. If he shows no signs, they need to bring in someone who will, someone better.
That’s fine. We can agree that Neal failed at a fundamental level with regard to his plan. You think he deserves three years to rebuild and within five years the Pirates will be serious contenders.
Personally I like Neal. But I don’t see any way he builds a contender in three years. Why do you think he can accomplish this?
I don't know if he can accomplish this. The reality is that he is under contract for four years. I don't see him being fired now or next year.
I like Huntington too. He has done it before. If he doesn't do it again, he will be gone. I blame Huntington more than Nutting. Huntington's drafts have been pretty bad and so have some of his signings/talent evaluation.
Fair enough. Neal has a contract and will get at least four years. Let’s hope he can pull another rabbit out of the hat. I’d love to be wrong. But I think there is a more like chance we’re looking at four more losing seasons.
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Bobster21
An observation
6D666E6267667D383E497068616666276A66090 wrote:
I believe in windows of opportunity. The rebuild just started.
I am giving him three years to show a team has been put together. I expect them to be big time contenders in five years.
I know you're being realistic inasmuch as they are years away. One thing to consider (which I have not researched) is when the players we will be seeing in the upcoming seasons will reach free agency or even arbitration. That is likely to determine how long some of the currently rebuilding team will remain Pirates. For instance, Taillon becomes a FA in 2023. If the Bucs become big time contenders in 5 years, that will be 2022. Assuming the Pirates have paid him thru his arb years, would they be looking to move him in his final year before free agency? Arbitration usually kicks in after the 4th year. If some of these players have become stars by then, it will be expensive to keep them. When we look 5 years ahead, these are issues that have to be taken into consideration. It makes it very difficult to project the roster that far ahead.
I believe in windows of opportunity. The rebuild just started.
I am giving him three years to show a team has been put together. I expect them to be big time contenders in five years.
I know you're being realistic inasmuch as they are years away. One thing to consider (which I have not researched) is when the players we will be seeing in the upcoming seasons will reach free agency or even arbitration. That is likely to determine how long some of the currently rebuilding team will remain Pirates. For instance, Taillon becomes a FA in 2023. If the Bucs become big time contenders in 5 years, that will be 2022. Assuming the Pirates have paid him thru his arb years, would they be looking to move him in his final year before free agency? Arbitration usually kicks in after the 4th year. If some of these players have become stars by then, it will be expensive to keep them. When we look 5 years ahead, these are issues that have to be taken into consideration. It makes it very difficult to project the roster that far ahead.
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dogknot17@yahoo.co
An observation
133E33222534236360510 wrote:
I believe in windows of opportunity. The rebuild just started.
I am giving him three years to show a team has been put together. I expect them to be big time contenders in five years.
I know you're being realistic inasmuch as they are years away. One thing to consider (which I have not researched) is when the players we will be seeing in the upcoming seasons will reach free agency or even arbitration. That is likely to determine how long some of the currently rebuilding team will remain Pirates. For instance, Taillon becomes a FA in 2023. If the Bucs become big time contenders in 5 years, that will be 2022. Assuming the Pirates have paid him thru his arb years, would they be looking to move him in his final year before free agency? Arbitration usually kicks in after the 4th year. If some of these players have become stars by then, it will be expensive to keep them. When we look 5 years ahead, these are issues that have to be taken into consideration. It makes it very difficult to project the roster that far ahead.
Yes, I understand that. That is why I said it is a weird rebuild with guys who are around the age of 25 and major league ready now.
Usually, rebuilds are with younger players and they sign some extensions because they will be free agents again before age 30. The Pirates have pretty much signed all of the current team to extensions. It might be different this time around as players will be older. Again, weird rebuild.
I believe in windows of opportunity. The rebuild just started.
I am giving him three years to show a team has been put together. I expect them to be big time contenders in five years.
I know you're being realistic inasmuch as they are years away. One thing to consider (which I have not researched) is when the players we will be seeing in the upcoming seasons will reach free agency or even arbitration. That is likely to determine how long some of the currently rebuilding team will remain Pirates. For instance, Taillon becomes a FA in 2023. If the Bucs become big time contenders in 5 years, that will be 2022. Assuming the Pirates have paid him thru his arb years, would they be looking to move him in his final year before free agency? Arbitration usually kicks in after the 4th year. If some of these players have become stars by then, it will be expensive to keep them. When we look 5 years ahead, these are issues that have to be taken into consideration. It makes it very difficult to project the roster that far ahead.
Yes, I understand that. That is why I said it is a weird rebuild with guys who are around the age of 25 and major league ready now.
Usually, rebuilds are with younger players and they sign some extensions because they will be free agents again before age 30. The Pirates have pretty much signed all of the current team to extensions. It might be different this time around as players will be older. Again, weird rebuild.
An observation
38333B373233286D6B1C253D343333723F335C0 wrote:
I believe in windows of opportunity. The rebuild just started.
I am giving him three years to show a team has been put together. I expect them to be big time contenders in five years.
I know you're being realistic inasmuch as they are years away. One thing to consider (which I have not researched) is when the players we will be seeing in the upcoming seasons will reach free agency or even arbitration. That is likely to determine how long some of the currently rebuilding team will remain Pirates. For instance, Taillon becomes a FA in 2023. If the Bucs become big time contenders in 5 years, that will be 2022. Assuming the Pirates have paid him thru his arb years, would they be looking to move him in his final year before free agency? Arbitration usually kicks in after the 4th year. If some of these players have become stars by then, it will be expensive to keep them. When we look 5 years ahead, these are issues that have to be taken into consideration. It makes it very difficult to project the roster that far ahead.
Yes, I understand that. That is why I said it is a weird rebuild with guys who are around the age of 25 and major league ready now.
Usually, rebuilds are with younger players and they sign some extensions because they will be free agents again before age 30. The Pirates have pretty much signed all of the current team to extensions. It might be different this time around as players will be older. Again, weird rebuild.
I started another thread about that rebuild word, but I don't think rebuild is the word. It really looks like their approach is one of keeping young players though much of their cost controlled years (about 5 years) and then adding FA for about 2 years. I don't know that there will ever be and "era" or a "rebuild." Every year the team changes so much. They do not operate with much consistency. They just cycle players through hoping that they can get some high level production for the short time they are here.
Don't get too attached to anyone. They won't be here long.
I believe in windows of opportunity. The rebuild just started.
I am giving him three years to show a team has been put together. I expect them to be big time contenders in five years.
I know you're being realistic inasmuch as they are years away. One thing to consider (which I have not researched) is when the players we will be seeing in the upcoming seasons will reach free agency or even arbitration. That is likely to determine how long some of the currently rebuilding team will remain Pirates. For instance, Taillon becomes a FA in 2023. If the Bucs become big time contenders in 5 years, that will be 2022. Assuming the Pirates have paid him thru his arb years, would they be looking to move him in his final year before free agency? Arbitration usually kicks in after the 4th year. If some of these players have become stars by then, it will be expensive to keep them. When we look 5 years ahead, these are issues that have to be taken into consideration. It makes it very difficult to project the roster that far ahead.
Yes, I understand that. That is why I said it is a weird rebuild with guys who are around the age of 25 and major league ready now.
Usually, rebuilds are with younger players and they sign some extensions because they will be free agents again before age 30. The Pirates have pretty much signed all of the current team to extensions. It might be different this time around as players will be older. Again, weird rebuild.
I started another thread about that rebuild word, but I don't think rebuild is the word. It really looks like their approach is one of keeping young players though much of their cost controlled years (about 5 years) and then adding FA for about 2 years. I don't know that there will ever be and "era" or a "rebuild." Every year the team changes so much. They do not operate with much consistency. They just cycle players through hoping that they can get some high level production for the short time they are here.
Don't get too attached to anyone. They won't be here long.
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DemDog
An observation
4A41494540415A1F196E574F464141004D412E0 wrote: So, I shouldn't accept reality because a lot of fans aren't accepting it? Sorry, I am not quitting on the Pirates or baseball in general. That doesn't mean I am happy with the current situation, but I can't change it. People have to accept reality or move on. It is what it is. The trades happened. Rebuilding is happening.
I think giving him three years is fair. Most teams rebuild in three to four years. If he shows no signs, they need to bring in someone who will, someone better.
Dog I think you have spoken with a real sense of reality here. The trades are what they are and we can't do anything to change them. Like you I am and always will be a Pirate fan.
The thing that really ticks me off is the mouth full of cow pies (manure) that NH is spewing about being contenders in 2018. Oh, if the stars are aligned just right they could be a wild card team but I believe that is just a big fat dream.
Because of the manure spewed from NH mouth I most likely will only do a few games when my daughter is in town. Otherwise I will get my baseball fix going to Morgantown to watch the kids playing for the Black Bears and watching me hopefully mature to the point that one of them might make the MLB roster before I go to be with Roberto and Pops in heaven.
I think giving him three years is fair. Most teams rebuild in three to four years. If he shows no signs, they need to bring in someone who will, someone better.
Dog I think you have spoken with a real sense of reality here. The trades are what they are and we can't do anything to change them. Like you I am and always will be a Pirate fan.
The thing that really ticks me off is the mouth full of cow pies (manure) that NH is spewing about being contenders in 2018. Oh, if the stars are aligned just right they could be a wild card team but I believe that is just a big fat dream.
Because of the manure spewed from NH mouth I most likely will only do a few games when my daughter is in town. Otherwise I will get my baseball fix going to Morgantown to watch the kids playing for the Black Bears and watching me hopefully mature to the point that one of them might make the MLB roster before I go to be with Roberto and Pops in heaven.