What would another GM do?
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
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SteadyFreddy
What would another GM do?
I agree the way this offense and this bench is constructed now unless things drastically improve and some upgrades are made or Meadows gets brought up this team will be lucky to win 70-75 games. If Huntington and management are going to continue to say we feel we can win and compete for a playoff spot with this roster then for crying out loud go out and get some bench help that's better then Jaso and Gosselin. The bottom line is this team stinks overall and anybody who thinks they can make a serious run at a playoff spot is delusional at this point.
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ChitownBucco
- Posts: 492
- Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2016 9:10 pm
What would another GM do?
I think it is too early to close this window and sell off.
I know all the news appears to be bad in this moment....
Kang, Marte, ect.
but I think the league is watered down all around. lots of parity.
a bit better than .500 might be good enough this year. Something like 85-88 wins might get a wild card. No real great NL teams out there other than Cubbies.
Bucs always seem to have slow starts and warm up as weather warms up.
2014 they were 10-18, but still went on to get the wild card
2015 they were 18-22 and still went on to get wild card and win 98 games
long season, let things play out at least another 6-8 weeks if I were GM
I know all the news appears to be bad in this moment....
Kang, Marte, ect.
but I think the league is watered down all around. lots of parity.
a bit better than .500 might be good enough this year. Something like 85-88 wins might get a wild card. No real great NL teams out there other than Cubbies.
Bucs always seem to have slow starts and warm up as weather warms up.
2014 they were 10-18, but still went on to get the wild card
2015 they were 18-22 and still went on to get wild card and win 98 games
long season, let things play out at least another 6-8 weeks if I were GM
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SteadyFreddy
What would another GM do?
This team won't sniff 85-88 wins at this point with this current lineup and roster. That's a pipe dream.
What would another GM do?
Last night's game, like quite a few other games was brutal to watch. While I am hoping and praying that much of last night's malaise was attributable to the weather, there were so many unforced errors that the future of this season - as of today - looks really bleak.
While I know the pickings are slim, NH must go get another outfielder, even if it is even a defensive substitute who can be inserted into a game in the late innings to try and preserve a win. If the team felt comfortable inserting Rodriguez for Jaso and now Jaso for Bell, clearly they should feel comfortable playing someone who can at least judge and maybe catch a fly ball. And, while it is easy to pick on Osuna, Jaso or Frazier for poor outfield play, none of these folks are really outfielders. They are playing out of position because there are no other options.
Continuing, I don't know who the Bucs have in the minors at present who are outfielders (too lazy to look and no, not Meadows), but at least someone down there should be able to catch a fly ball. If so, bring them up and jettison Bastardo, who the manager has walked away from using in a meaningful game, even thought the GM is currently likely keeping him because of salary commitments and hoping that he will improve. And, if the Bucs don't have someone in the minors who can play outfield, doesn't some other team?
I have a lot of patience for someone like Bell, but my patience with Polanco and Cervelli is wearing quite thin. I have yet to see any flashes of brilliance from Polanco in the OF, and his bat is not as strong as advertised, particularly in the #4 spot. While Kuhl was getting hit hard, the game could have been different if Cervelli had held onto the ball and in turn wiped two runs off the scoreboard and shortened some innings. The passed ball that let folks advance also wasn't good.
At present, I only have confidence in the defense of three players - Harrison when he is at 2nd (despite the blunder against the Yankees) and Mercer and Freese, neither of whom is spectacular, but both of whom generally make the play. The play of all of the outfielders is so bad that it is nearly unwatchable (McCutchen and Polanco on the fly ball last week was atrocious).
So - What would I do if I was a GM.
1) I go get an outfielder who can play good defense, preferably someone who can play any outfield position. I would prefer someone who can play LF at PNC so Polanco and his bad glove but decent arm can move back to RF. Cutch in CF is bad, but his poor defense would be less of a problem with better OF play in the corners.
2) I know it may hurt, but release Bastardo. I would not be willing to pay the price of trading minor league depth along with Bastardo to try and save a million or so.
3) The team needs more the reserve infielders - Gosselin, Frazier and Hanson on the bench, and at the same time carrying a very weak hitting catcher in Stewart. One of the three reserve infielders needs to go. If Hurdle's assessment of Hanson is accurate, move him for a middling talent outfielder from some other team. If Hanson has a future, let Gosselin, who isn't really a shortstop walk, or try to trade him for the middling reserve outfielder.
The above three moves are mere band-aids to try and provide some immediate help on defense and by cutting the weakest arm in the pen.
If, by the end of May the team is still floundering, I am shopping players who could yield a return for 2018 and beyond. Players The players I shop include:
1) McCutchen - He is not a CF'er and his overall skills, particularly speed, seems to be rapidly diminishing.
2) Freese - He is playing well for the Pirates, but he could bring back some valuable talent because of his reasonable salary, his versatility and his performance (to date). I believe moving him would hurt the team and performance on the field, but I don't believe the Pirates have a lot of talent that would attract a return.
3) Watson - I believe he now throws too many pitches per appearance to be a reliable pitcher for a whole season. Someone else may like him as a late inning reliever rather than a closer. Also, he will be too expensive next year.
4) I would move either or both Jaso or Harrison if anyone would bite, simply to move some salary. I doubt anyone bites on either, unless some other team has a glaring injury.
5) Hudson. If he is pitching well, and the season appears lost, see what he could yield in return.
6) LeBlanc. If his recent resurgence continues, shop him for some talent, Lefty relievers have value. Remember, Zack Duke was still pitching at this time last year.
7) Mercer. I don't know what the Pirates would do without him, and I doubt he would bring much in return, but he could be an injury replacement for a team seeking a SS. I doubt that he is back with the Bucs next year.
About the only folks that I think are off-limits are the starting pitchers, which could be a real strength in 2018, and Bell and perhaps Polanco (mostly because of the Marte situation) and in the pen Rivero.
Feeling very pessimistic after last night.
While I know the pickings are slim, NH must go get another outfielder, even if it is even a defensive substitute who can be inserted into a game in the late innings to try and preserve a win. If the team felt comfortable inserting Rodriguez for Jaso and now Jaso for Bell, clearly they should feel comfortable playing someone who can at least judge and maybe catch a fly ball. And, while it is easy to pick on Osuna, Jaso or Frazier for poor outfield play, none of these folks are really outfielders. They are playing out of position because there are no other options.
Continuing, I don't know who the Bucs have in the minors at present who are outfielders (too lazy to look and no, not Meadows), but at least someone down there should be able to catch a fly ball. If so, bring them up and jettison Bastardo, who the manager has walked away from using in a meaningful game, even thought the GM is currently likely keeping him because of salary commitments and hoping that he will improve. And, if the Bucs don't have someone in the minors who can play outfield, doesn't some other team?
I have a lot of patience for someone like Bell, but my patience with Polanco and Cervelli is wearing quite thin. I have yet to see any flashes of brilliance from Polanco in the OF, and his bat is not as strong as advertised, particularly in the #4 spot. While Kuhl was getting hit hard, the game could have been different if Cervelli had held onto the ball and in turn wiped two runs off the scoreboard and shortened some innings. The passed ball that let folks advance also wasn't good.
At present, I only have confidence in the defense of three players - Harrison when he is at 2nd (despite the blunder against the Yankees) and Mercer and Freese, neither of whom is spectacular, but both of whom generally make the play. The play of all of the outfielders is so bad that it is nearly unwatchable (McCutchen and Polanco on the fly ball last week was atrocious).
So - What would I do if I was a GM.
1) I go get an outfielder who can play good defense, preferably someone who can play any outfield position. I would prefer someone who can play LF at PNC so Polanco and his bad glove but decent arm can move back to RF. Cutch in CF is bad, but his poor defense would be less of a problem with better OF play in the corners.
2) I know it may hurt, but release Bastardo. I would not be willing to pay the price of trading minor league depth along with Bastardo to try and save a million or so.
3) The team needs more the reserve infielders - Gosselin, Frazier and Hanson on the bench, and at the same time carrying a very weak hitting catcher in Stewart. One of the three reserve infielders needs to go. If Hurdle's assessment of Hanson is accurate, move him for a middling talent outfielder from some other team. If Hanson has a future, let Gosselin, who isn't really a shortstop walk, or try to trade him for the middling reserve outfielder.
The above three moves are mere band-aids to try and provide some immediate help on defense and by cutting the weakest arm in the pen.
If, by the end of May the team is still floundering, I am shopping players who could yield a return for 2018 and beyond. Players The players I shop include:
1) McCutchen - He is not a CF'er and his overall skills, particularly speed, seems to be rapidly diminishing.
2) Freese - He is playing well for the Pirates, but he could bring back some valuable talent because of his reasonable salary, his versatility and his performance (to date). I believe moving him would hurt the team and performance on the field, but I don't believe the Pirates have a lot of talent that would attract a return.
3) Watson - I believe he now throws too many pitches per appearance to be a reliable pitcher for a whole season. Someone else may like him as a late inning reliever rather than a closer. Also, he will be too expensive next year.
4) I would move either or both Jaso or Harrison if anyone would bite, simply to move some salary. I doubt anyone bites on either, unless some other team has a glaring injury.
5) Hudson. If he is pitching well, and the season appears lost, see what he could yield in return.
6) LeBlanc. If his recent resurgence continues, shop him for some talent, Lefty relievers have value. Remember, Zack Duke was still pitching at this time last year.
7) Mercer. I don't know what the Pirates would do without him, and I doubt he would bring much in return, but he could be an injury replacement for a team seeking a SS. I doubt that he is back with the Bucs next year.
About the only folks that I think are off-limits are the starting pitchers, which could be a real strength in 2018, and Bell and perhaps Polanco (mostly because of the Marte situation) and in the pen Rivero.
Feeling very pessimistic after last night.
What would another GM do?
4B40484441405B1E186F564E474040014C402F0 wrote: The problem is that it is April 25th. No team will trade a big player at this time. Even if the price is right. It will tell their fans they are giving up on the season.
The Pirates are in last place, but only three games back. Meaning, they are still in it. Almost every team is still in it. I am sure Toronto, San Francisco, Mets and Kansas City feel the same way. No way will they start dumping players this early
Exactly. No one is going to come off anything useful in Late April. Short of taking on some of Martin's salary from Seattle or paying Angel Pagan, we're stuck with what we've got.
The Pirates are in last place, but only three games back. Meaning, they are still in it. Almost every team is still in it. I am sure Toronto, San Francisco, Mets and Kansas City feel the same way. No way will they start dumping players this early
Exactly. No one is going to come off anything useful in Late April. Short of taking on some of Martin's salary from Seattle or paying Angel Pagan, we're stuck with what we've got.
What would another GM do?
I want to go after O`Koyea Dickson OF in the dodgers AAA system ..He is older but of to a good start and just got passed up again today when they called up a younger player .Dude needs to catch a break and maybe we can catch some lightning for a season or 2.
Or we can go big and try to get Byron Buxton from the Twins he is struggling again .They have totally ruined that kid.Maybe a change of scenery could do him well.
Kind of ironic Willy Garcia off to a nice start in AAA.
We have crap for bats down in the minors , zero power .Time to trade some pitchers.
Or we can go big and try to get Byron Buxton from the Twins he is struggling again .They have totally ruined that kid.Maybe a change of scenery could do him well.
Kind of ironic Willy Garcia off to a nice start in AAA.
We have crap for bats down in the minors , zero power .Time to trade some pitchers.
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SteadyFreddy
What would another GM do?
[quote author=7A71797570716A2F295E677F767171307D711E0 link=1493141130/9#9 date=1493146971
The Pirates are in last place, but only three games back. Meaning, they are still in it. Almost every team is still in it. I am sure Toronto, San Francisco, Mets and Kansas City feel the same way. No way will they start dumping players this early.
I really don't care what teams like the Giants, Mets, Royals , and Bluejays do. I'm worried about what the Pirates do. Three of those 4 teams you mentioned have also won World Series and pennants over the last 4-5 years the Pirates haven't come close to doing neither. So I'm not going to sit here and justify the Pirates not going out and making any significant moves to improve their team just because these teams who are struggling also aren't. All 4 of these teams most likely at seasons end will all have better records then the Pirates.
The Pirates are in last place, but only three games back. Meaning, they are still in it. Almost every team is still in it. I am sure Toronto, San Francisco, Mets and Kansas City feel the same way. No way will they start dumping players this early.
I really don't care what teams like the Giants, Mets, Royals , and Bluejays do. I'm worried about what the Pirates do. Three of those 4 teams you mentioned have also won World Series and pennants over the last 4-5 years the Pirates haven't come close to doing neither. So I'm not going to sit here and justify the Pirates not going out and making any significant moves to improve their team just because these teams who are struggling also aren't. All 4 of these teams most likely at seasons end will all have better records then the Pirates.
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dogknot17@yahoo.co
What would another GM do?
No, the point is that it is April 25th. No team is going to panic at this time. No team is going to start dumping players even though they are in last place on April 25th.
There would be no impact players to trade for at this time. They need to make a trade for an outfielder big time. I said that right away. But who?
Yes, the Pirates have been close to the WS. They made the playoffs three years in a row. The Mets haven't won since 1986 and the Blue Jays haven't won since 1993.
There would be no impact players to trade for at this time. They need to make a trade for an outfielder big time. I said that right away. But who?
Yes, the Pirates have been close to the WS. They made the playoffs three years in a row. The Mets haven't won since 1986 and the Blue Jays haven't won since 1993.
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SteadyFreddy
What would another GM do?
6C676F6366677C393F487169606767266B67080 wrote: No, the point is that it is April 25th. No team is going to panic at this time. No team is going to start dumping players even though they are in last place on April 25th.
There would be no impact players to trade for at this time. They need to make a trade for an outfielder big time. I said that right away. But who?
Yes, the Pirates have been close to the WS. They made the playoffs three years in a row. The Mets haven't won since 1986 and the Blue Jays haven't won since 1993. No the Pirates have not come close to making the World Series. Losing two wildcard games at home and losing in the division series in 5 games when you had a 2-1 series lead Is not close to making the World Series I'm sorry it's not. The Mets at least won a pennant in 2015 a few years ago and went to the World Series and the Bluejays have at least been to the ALCS two years in a row and won a few playoff series in the divisional round. The Pirates have done NONE of that in there little 3 year playoff run.
There would be no impact players to trade for at this time. They need to make a trade for an outfielder big time. I said that right away. But who?
Yes, the Pirates have been close to the WS. They made the playoffs three years in a row. The Mets haven't won since 1986 and the Blue Jays haven't won since 1993. No the Pirates have not come close to making the World Series. Losing two wildcard games at home and losing in the division series in 5 games when you had a 2-1 series lead Is not close to making the World Series I'm sorry it's not. The Mets at least won a pennant in 2015 a few years ago and went to the World Series and the Bluejays have at least been to the ALCS two years in a row and won a few playoff series in the divisional round. The Pirates have done NONE of that in there little 3 year playoff run.
What would another GM do?
We will be 15 games under .5oo by the end of MAY.
Take that to the Bank. :'(
Take that to the Bank. :'(