OnlyBucs

434A42535D270 wrote: Of course I would be thrilled to have him. Surely he can be had for less than Keller though with 2 years left and NOT cost controlled by any stretch of the imagination 



Or a combination of prospective talent that doesn't include Keller.  Keller has multiple plus pitches and control and almost ready.   I just don't know if that's a smart trade to make



 
I would be interested. I would not include Keller or Meadows. The only way I send a top guy back is with lots of money coming back our way. I would like to have him for sure, he would be a big upgrade.

Just checked and saw that Hamels is getting 22.5M this year with a 6M buyout or 20M salary for 2019.



Salary relief could involve trading Ivan Nova, a relative bargain at 8.5M. We have a lot of pitching prospects in the high minors. I don't think we need to give up Keller.



Hamels should do well at PNC, and we could use a lefty in our rotation.



Of course I don't think it will happen, but I'm glad for the topic!

082528393E2F38787B4A0 wrote: The Pirates have lost three series this year, but they can't win a playoff series? I think it's too early to be setting up for the Playoffs. Not sure Hamels would be my guy.



Also, Cole and Morton are pitching better in the AL compared to their time in the NL. Maybe the hitters are better in the NL?  Hamels ERA could get worse.
NL league average team ERA is 3.91. AL average ERA is 4.31. AL is a more offense minded league due to DH. Cole and Morton are the exceptions. That said, however, I would not trade a top prospect for Hamels at age 34 unless I thought he would be the missing piece to a World Series team. And I don't think that's likely. 




Cole and Morton are putting up Cy Young type numbers in a harder league to pitch, and also one of the hardest parks to pitch.  Ouch Ray Searage!

363F372628520 wrote: The Pirates have lost three series this year, but they can't win a playoff series? I think it's too early to be setting up for the Playoffs. Not sure Hamels would be my guy.



Also, Cole and Morton are pitching better in the AL compared to their time in the NL. Maybe the hitters are better in the NL?  Hamels ERA could get worse.
NL league average team ERA is 3.91. AL average ERA is 4.31. AL is a more offense minded league due to DH. Cole and Morton are the exceptions. That said, however, I would not trade a top prospect for Hamels at age 34 unless I thought he would be the missing piece to a World Series team. And I don't think that's likely. 




Cole and Morton are putting up Cy Young type numbers in a harder league to pitch, and also one of the hardest parks to pitch.  Ouch Ray Searage!


Verlander also revived his career in Houston. He was looking like he was on the downside of his career until he went to the Astros last year and posted a 1.06 ERA and is now at 1.05. Maybe the Astros' pitching coach should get some credit.

Credit definitely seems due.

It makes a lot of sense from the Bucs’ perspective. You get him for several more starts than if you wait to the deadline to make a move. They should be able to afford the payroll hit and the prospects. It sends a strong message to the team and the fans and could bring more people to games. I’m not sure Hamels is the guy, but a TOR LHSP also makes sense.



Now, all that said, why would Texas(?) or any other team make that trade at this point unless the offer is probably an overpayment even given lots of salary relief? Why not let the price rise as the deadline approaches and give yourself time to get in the playoff race?

While it's fun to envision the addition of a quality starter like Cole Hamels to the Pirates it is surely a pipedream. In addition to Hamels' salary which would likely be enough to curdle the milk in Bob Nutting's cereal bowl, Hamels also has a limited no trade clause in his contract. According to an article in The Athletic:



"Hamels, however, can be traded to only nine teams without his permission — the Mariners, Cardinals, Nationals, Astros, Cubs, Phillies, Braves, Royals, and Rays, according to MLB Network’s Jon Paul Morosi."

6642565E5B370 wrote: ... Hamels also has a limited no trade clause in his contract. According to an article in The Athletic:



"Hamels, however, can be traded to only nine teams without his permission — the Mariners, Cardinals, Nationals, Astros, Cubs, Phillies, Braves, Royals, and Rays, according to MLB Network’s Jon Paul Morosi."


That's a weird collection of teams. Looks like he wants to stay out of the major media markets maybe? But the Cubs, Nats, and Phils are in big media markets. Don't see the connection.



And I agree that with the FO and owner, getting a guy like Hamels or any established front line starter is a pipe dream.

While ERA is not the be all and end all for stats, Hamels' ERA is now 3.48. He is expensive, but he has a limit on the number of years the Pirates would be committed to him; only this year and next. He is a lefty, which the Pirates desperately need in their rotation, and he is still has a reasonable strike-out rate. While he is giving up a few too many HR's, 9 to date, Texas is a difficult park in which to pitch.



The Rangers and Pirates will both need to do something to decrease the salary concerns; Texas wants to shed salary and the Bucs will not want to take on too much salary. Thus, I believe SyrBucco's suggestion makes the most amount of sense.



Bucs send Nova to Texas to reduce the salary gap. Bucs also send some good but not top tier prospects to Texas. I would try a package of Osuna, Reynolds (know that he is hurt), Hearn and perhaps Clay Holmes.



Bucs would pay all of Hamels 2018 salary, but would ask Texas to pay $3,000,000 mil or so of his 2019 salary. This could be workable for the Pirates because of the loss of Nova's salary next year and because most of the rest of the starting pitchers will be making near the major league minimum.



Also understand that Hamels would need to agree to a trade to Pittsburgh and that he may want some money to get there. Texas should be responsible for such.



My package of prospects may be a bit light, but Reynolds has some real upside and Osuna appears to be someone well suited for the AL. Oh well, just a thought.

I read an article recently indicating the Rangers' plan is for a rebuild focusing on obtaining high upside prospects in trades for players like Hamel. I think it's doubtful that Nova would interest the Rangers, and given the lack of a Meadows or Keller in the prospects you've indicated I think the Rangers would find a better return elsewhere.