I have been wanting to discuss this the last few weeks or so but have not been able too so I just want to see what everybody thinks the Pirates should do with both Bell and especially Glasnow after the break.
I still think you gotta get Glasnow up here and let him take his lumps now so that he is a better pitcher to start next season. I know he is walking a lot of guys but seriously how much worse could he be then what we have seen from both Liriano and Niese the last month or so. If I'm the Pirates I call Glasnow up sometime during that 8 game homestand after the break against the Brewers, Phillies, and Mariners and get him going. Jon Niese needs to start being on a short leash too here. His ERA is well over 5 and he is still giving up way too many home runs. As I stated Glasnow won't be any worse then Niese at this point if given the opportunity he just won't be.
As for Bell he is leading AAA in OPS and extra base hits and the way Jaso is hitting now at first I don't think he can be much worse. I really do think if both of these guys are called up it will make the Pirates a much better team in the 2nd half of the season.
Glasnow and Bell...
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
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LumberCo
Glasnow and Bell...
I think both would help but I am more convinced the time for Glasnow is now. if Bell is fielding the position at an above average level then why not.
Glasnow and Bell...
I'm still not sure about Glasnow. Do I think he's one of the five best starting pitchers in the organization right now? Yes. The question I ask myself is whether his control issues would make him a big step up from Niese or Locke or even Liriano at this point.
When I look at the results that Taillon and Kuhl have had thus far in their major league debuts I see decent results. Encouraging for sure but not as dominant or consistent as I think they will eventually be. Both of those guys had impressive control numbers in AAA and have brought that with them.
On the other hand Glasnow has had significant control issues (although he walked only 1 batter in 6 innings in his last start) at AAA. He's not suffered much because of it as a result of his overpowering stuff keeping hits to a minimum. Realistically I think Glasnow will struggle much more than Taillon or Kuhl has at the major league level because of the control issue and the hitting talent he'll be facing. Whether his struggles will be such that he'll still be more effective than Niese, Locke or Liriano is really the most important question for me.
Ideally I'd like to see him show greater pitch command and be ready for a successful start to his MLB career rather than risk a failure that might require a return to AAA. However there has been nothing ideal about this season for the Pirates and especially their starting pitching so perhaps it'd be best to see what we've got with Glasnow right now and hope he's ready to push one of our other starters to the pen.
As for Bell I don't see the urgency to bring him up. The offense is alright without him. I think he makes it possible for the Pirates to deal from strength if they decide to trade Jaso or Freese or Joyce. He could even be a major trading chip himself in acquiring a good young starting pitcher.
When I look at the results that Taillon and Kuhl have had thus far in their major league debuts I see decent results. Encouraging for sure but not as dominant or consistent as I think they will eventually be. Both of those guys had impressive control numbers in AAA and have brought that with them.
On the other hand Glasnow has had significant control issues (although he walked only 1 batter in 6 innings in his last start) at AAA. He's not suffered much because of it as a result of his overpowering stuff keeping hits to a minimum. Realistically I think Glasnow will struggle much more than Taillon or Kuhl has at the major league level because of the control issue and the hitting talent he'll be facing. Whether his struggles will be such that he'll still be more effective than Niese, Locke or Liriano is really the most important question for me.
Ideally I'd like to see him show greater pitch command and be ready for a successful start to his MLB career rather than risk a failure that might require a return to AAA. However there has been nothing ideal about this season for the Pirates and especially their starting pitching so perhaps it'd be best to see what we've got with Glasnow right now and hope he's ready to push one of our other starters to the pen.
As for Bell I don't see the urgency to bring him up. The offense is alright without him. I think he makes it possible for the Pirates to deal from strength if they decide to trade Jaso or Freese or Joyce. He could even be a major trading chip himself in acquiring a good young starting pitcher.
Glasnow and Bell...
Yes I would call him up and start him for Niese, and banish him to the bullpen, or Frankie, and give him some time off on the 15day DL for (arm fatigue)
Glasnow doesn't have to be perfect to be effective. And i think for sure he will be a better pitcher in April 2017 having been called up now.
Glasnow doesn't have to be perfect to be effective. And i think for sure he will be a better pitcher in April 2017 having been called up now.
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Bobster21
Glasnow and Bell...
Niese shouldn't be hard to move at the deadline if not sooner. There's always a marker for a LH starter, even a not very good one. His contract is team friendly (2 more years at 10 and 11 mil if team wants to keep him or $500,000 buyout either year if not). He's an albatross in the rotation now. Time to give Glasnow a chance.
BTW-Scahill was DFA'd.
BTW-Scahill was DFA'd.
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ArnoldRothstein
Glasnow and Bell...
Another board is saying Bell got some stiches after a collision last week. If not for that, I'd think his arrical was imminent.
I think that Glasnow will be up within a month or so, mostly because it might be necessary to spread some starts among a few of the younger or wounded pitchers.
I think that Glasnow will be up within a month or so, mostly because it might be necessary to spread some starts among a few of the younger or wounded pitchers.
Glasnow and Bell...
Definitely think if they don't call him up pretty soon, they will hold him back until Sept and then until June 2017 to avoid Super Two. It won't be long until the "it's not worth losing the extra year of control over the 2 months of him being up" crowd comes out to play.
Glasnow and Bell...
5D545C4D43390 wrote: Definitely think if they don't call him up pretty soon, they will hold him back until Sept and then until June 2017 to avoid Super Two. It won't be long until the "it's not worth losing the extra year of control over the 2 months of him being up" crowd comes out to play.
I'm part of that crowd, but I think the situation has changed. Our lineup is too good and the pitching has been too bad to wait long enough to avoid super-2, and Glasnow has had all this extra time now to work on his control. As soon as he shows he has the control he needs, we need to bring him up. Sometime this year would be ideal, to get him acclimated and ready to start next season.
However, if his control issues continue, I think we have 2 options : keep him down and continue to work with him, or bring him up and let the big club's staff work with him. The control issues aren't something we can handwave away, so the only thing that remains is how to deal with them. I wouldn't bring him up to 'take his lumps' until I thought he has all the tools he needed to succeed - then you can bring him up and let him work things out. I wouldn't bring him up to learn CONTROL unless they thought Searage and company can give him a different perspective that will click for him.
We need pitching. I hope Glasnow's last start with one walk is the beginning of good things, and we can bring him up soon, so he'll be a little seasoned for the beginning of next season.
I'm part of that crowd, but I think the situation has changed. Our lineup is too good and the pitching has been too bad to wait long enough to avoid super-2, and Glasnow has had all this extra time now to work on his control. As soon as he shows he has the control he needs, we need to bring him up. Sometime this year would be ideal, to get him acclimated and ready to start next season.
However, if his control issues continue, I think we have 2 options : keep him down and continue to work with him, or bring him up and let the big club's staff work with him. The control issues aren't something we can handwave away, so the only thing that remains is how to deal with them. I wouldn't bring him up to 'take his lumps' until I thought he has all the tools he needed to succeed - then you can bring him up and let him work things out. I wouldn't bring him up to learn CONTROL unless they thought Searage and company can give him a different perspective that will click for him.
We need pitching. I hope Glasnow's last start with one walk is the beginning of good things, and we can bring him up soon, so he'll be a little seasoned for the beginning of next season.
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CutchisaBoss
Glasnow and Bell...
Bell has no business being in AAA for another moment. He's produced better than Cutch, Pedro, Marte, and Polanco ever did at the level. Plus, Jaso has just fallen off a cliff. He's about done.
I'm okay with them waiting until they feel Glasnow is ready, as long as Taillon and Kuhl stay in the rotation. I want them to do everything they can to give Glasnow the best chance possible to reach his potential.
I'm okay with them waiting until they feel Glasnow is ready, as long as Taillon and Kuhl stay in the rotation. I want them to do everything they can to give Glasnow the best chance possible to reach his potential.
Glasnow and Bell...
I just don't think Glasnow is ready.
Walking guys is generally not condusive to success in the bigs no matter how good your stuff is.
We knocked Kershaw out last week because he was walking guys. It's so rare that a pitcher has success giving up walks in the long term. Big league hitters have the talent to make him pay for that. I don't want him up in the bigs, giving up six walks in five innings because hits will follow.
Walking guys is generally not condusive to success in the bigs no matter how good your stuff is.
We knocked Kershaw out last week because he was walking guys. It's so rare that a pitcher has success giving up walks in the long term. Big league hitters have the talent to make him pay for that. I don't want him up in the bigs, giving up six walks in five innings because hits will follow.