So as I work and wait for any deadline deals, I have to admit I'm not in the greatest mood about our team from Pittsburgh (of course the after All-Star break failure to score runs does not help).
But I have to ask, is BC doing all that great?
1) Our last two high picks Davis and Gonzales have only proved that they can spend lots of time on the IR so far.
2) No rookies we have brought up this year have shown any staying power. They have had their moments, but not near enough of them. (I was in Seattle last week and got to watch Julio Rodriguez live twice and I get he is exceptional, but it was hard watching exceptional when we can't seem to graduate acceptable).
3) Despite the brag that our minor system is deep, only Bradenton is showing any spark - and they're Low-A:
Greensboro - 42-52
Altoona - 47-49
Indianapolis - 46-50 (the constant shuffling has to be hard here I'll admit)
A lot goes into any of these team's records, but looking through each of them, I don't get a feeling that we are deep in prospects. There are prospects sure, but a lot?
4) Where's the pitching? You can cherry-pick a few guys in the system who are doing well - Burrows, Priester, and a few others, but system-wide we just don't seem to have that many arms who will make a difference at the MLB level.
5) The construction of the MLB roster to start the year was poor. Since he got here, BC seems to care less about trying to fill the MLB roster with any short of talent that can help hold us over till the "kids are ready"
6) Race for Last Place. I've been reminded that this year there will be a lottery, but here we are gunning for the worst record yet again.
7) From every indication that I've seen Shelton sucks. His management of the bullpen especially for me is awful. I swear he tries to lose. BC was a GM before, BC had time in Toronto, I think his reputation has to suffer with a Shelton selection.
So is BC doing the job?
I think at times the Covid interruption makes us forget that he came in late 2019. But this is the third season he's had his hands on the steering wheel. And I've been surprised that he has avoided being under the microscope much from the fans.
Not feeling great this August 2022. My boys have picked their own teams as they grew up (no regional baseball bias in Utah and the Bucs where never good enough for them to get too excited), one (27) is a Cards fan because at 7 he started loving Pujols, another was a big Ripkin fan (42), and the last (43) has turned into a huge M's fan after moving to Seattle.
So Cards are always there, O's are surprising everyone and getting better, and M's pulled off a huge winning streak, looking for a WC spot and have a generational rookie in Julio Rodriguez. And dad's passion for the Pirates, heaven help me!
Anybody want to cheer me up about our current status in the baseball world and the guy at the helm?
Is BC Building a Better Organization?
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
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skinnyhorse
- Posts: 926
- Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2016 1:19 am
Is BC Building a Better Organization?
54756069516873607564010 wrote: So as I work and wait for any deadline deals, I have to admit I'm not in the greatest mood about our team from Pittsburgh (of course the after All-Star break failure to score runs does not help).
But I have to ask, is BC doing all that great?
1) Our last two high picks Davis and Gonzales have only proved that they can spend lots of time on the IR so far.
2) No rookies we have brought up this year have shown any staying power. They have had their moments, but not near enough of them. (I was in Seattle last week and got to watch Julio Rodriguez live twice and I get he is exceptional, but it was hard watching exceptional when we can't seem to graduate acceptional).
3) Despite the brag that our minor system is deep, only Bradenton is showing any spark - and they're Low-A:
Greensboro - 42-52
Altoona - 47-49
Indianapolis - 46-50 (the constant shuffling has to be hard here I'll admit)
A lot goes into any of these team's records, but looking through each of them, I don't get a feeling that we are deep in prospects. There are prospects sure, but a lot?
4) Where's the pitching? You can cherry-pick a few guys in the system who are doing well - Burrows, Priester, and a few others, but system-wide we just don't seem to have that many arms who will make a difference at the MLB level.
5) The construction of the MLB roster to start the year was poor. Since he got here, BC seems to care less about trying to fill the MLB roster with any short of talent that can help hold us over till the "kids are ready"
6) Race for Last Place. I've been reminded that this year there will be a lottery, but here we are gunning for the worst record yet again.
7) From every indication that I've seen Shelton sucks. His management of the bullpen especially for me is awful. I swear he tries to lose. BC was a GM before, BC had time in Toronto, I think his reputation has to suffer with a Shelton selection.
So is BC doing the job?
I think at times the Covid interruption makes us forget that he came in late 2019. But this is the third season he's had his hands on the steering wheel. And I've been surprised that he has avoided being under the microscope much from the fans.
Not feeling great this August 2022. My boys have picked their own teams as they grew up (no regional baseball bias in Utah and the Bucs where never good enough for them to get too excited), one (27) is a Cards fan because at 7 he started loving Pujols, another was a big Ripkin fan (42), and the last (43) has turned into a huge M's fan after moving to Seattle.
So Cards are always there, O's are surprising everyone and getting better, and M's pulled off a huge winning streak, looking for a WC spot and have a generational rookie in Julio Rodriguez. And dad's passion for the Pirates, heaven help me!
Anybody want to cheer me up about our current status in the baseball world and the guy at the helm?
Excellent observation. I too look at the Pirates maybe differently than those who live in the immediate Pittsburgh area. I too get tired of the Rosy Pirates front office propaganda. He's had 3 years and I'm not feeling it. Sorry I can't blow any smoke your way.
But I have to ask, is BC doing all that great?
1) Our last two high picks Davis and Gonzales have only proved that they can spend lots of time on the IR so far.
2) No rookies we have brought up this year have shown any staying power. They have had their moments, but not near enough of them. (I was in Seattle last week and got to watch Julio Rodriguez live twice and I get he is exceptional, but it was hard watching exceptional when we can't seem to graduate acceptional).
3) Despite the brag that our minor system is deep, only Bradenton is showing any spark - and they're Low-A:
Greensboro - 42-52
Altoona - 47-49
Indianapolis - 46-50 (the constant shuffling has to be hard here I'll admit)
A lot goes into any of these team's records, but looking through each of them, I don't get a feeling that we are deep in prospects. There are prospects sure, but a lot?
4) Where's the pitching? You can cherry-pick a few guys in the system who are doing well - Burrows, Priester, and a few others, but system-wide we just don't seem to have that many arms who will make a difference at the MLB level.
5) The construction of the MLB roster to start the year was poor. Since he got here, BC seems to care less about trying to fill the MLB roster with any short of talent that can help hold us over till the "kids are ready"
6) Race for Last Place. I've been reminded that this year there will be a lottery, but here we are gunning for the worst record yet again.
7) From every indication that I've seen Shelton sucks. His management of the bullpen especially for me is awful. I swear he tries to lose. BC was a GM before, BC had time in Toronto, I think his reputation has to suffer with a Shelton selection.
So is BC doing the job?
I think at times the Covid interruption makes us forget that he came in late 2019. But this is the third season he's had his hands on the steering wheel. And I've been surprised that he has avoided being under the microscope much from the fans.
Not feeling great this August 2022. My boys have picked their own teams as they grew up (no regional baseball bias in Utah and the Bucs where never good enough for them to get too excited), one (27) is a Cards fan because at 7 he started loving Pujols, another was a big Ripkin fan (42), and the last (43) has turned into a huge M's fan after moving to Seattle.
So Cards are always there, O's are surprising everyone and getting better, and M's pulled off a huge winning streak, looking for a WC spot and have a generational rookie in Julio Rodriguez. And dad's passion for the Pirates, heaven help me!
Anybody want to cheer me up about our current status in the baseball world and the guy at the helm?
Excellent observation. I too look at the Pirates maybe differently than those who live in the immediate Pittsburgh area. I too get tired of the Rosy Pirates front office propaganda. He's had 3 years and I'm not feeling it. Sorry I can't blow any smoke your way.
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CarolinaBucco
Is BC Building a Better Organization?
There are lots of problems, issues and red flags.
But the biggest is No. 4.
Even if (big if) some of the young positional players happen to develop, where is the pitching. I mean WHERE IS THE PITCHING?
I don't see any elite high-end quality, I don't see much in the way of solid above-average quantity, and I don't see any depth.
If the Pirates can't draft and develop power arms, then it doesn't really matter what else they do in terms of roster-building.
This organization is void of legit pitching, and that is a bad, bad sign as we look 2-4 years down the road.
But the biggest is No. 4.
Even if (big if) some of the young positional players happen to develop, where is the pitching. I mean WHERE IS THE PITCHING?
I don't see any elite high-end quality, I don't see much in the way of solid above-average quantity, and I don't see any depth.
If the Pirates can't draft and develop power arms, then it doesn't really matter what else they do in terms of roster-building.
This organization is void of legit pitching, and that is a bad, bad sign as we look 2-4 years down the road.
Is BC Building a Better Organization?
my concern is that next year is going to be similar to this year as far as major league performance goes.
Neither Nutting or Cherington should be happy with that.
I don't expect a miracle run for the playoffs or a championship, but I do think it isn't unreasonable to expect a team that is at least a little over 500.
Neither Nutting or Cherington should be happy with that.
I don't expect a miracle run for the playoffs or a championship, but I do think it isn't unreasonable to expect a team that is at least a little over 500.
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Bobster21
Is BC Building a Better Organization?
In the MLB prospect rankings, 9 of the Pirates top 30 are pitchers. we can only hope they get a few good ones out of that and that a few of what they already have are serviceable or better. I doubt that there are many teams with a bunch of can't miss pitching prospects. There are a lot of promising position players too. So I'll give BC the benefit of the doubt as to the organization he's building. But without owner support there is only so much he can do. Filling out the roster with VanMeters instead of more expensive, more productive players won't help. Trading off key players because they don't want to pay them won't help. Putting the roster in the hands of Shelton won't help. So it's going to take more than just promoting prospects to the roster.
https://www.mlb.com/prospects/pirates
https://www.mlb.com/prospects/pirates
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JollyRoger
- Posts: 1469
- Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2016 8:31 pm
Is BC Building a Better Organization?
0322373E063F24372233560 wrote: So as I work and wait for any deadline deals, I have to admit I'm not in the greatest mood about our team from Pittsburgh (of course the after All-Star break failure to score runs does not help).
But I have to ask, is BC doing all that great?
1) Our last two high picks Davis and Gonzales have only proved that they can spend lots of time on the IR so far.
2) No rookies we have brought up this year have shown any staying power. They have had their moments, but not near enough of them. (I was in Seattle last week and got to watch Julio Rodriguez live twice and I get he is exceptional, but it was hard watching exceptional when we can't seem to graduate acceptable).
3) Despite the brag that our minor system is deep, only Bradenton is showing any spark - and they're Low-A:
Greensboro - 42-52
Altoona - 47-49
Indianapolis - 46-50 (the constant shuffling has to be hard here I'll admit)
A lot goes into any of these team's records, but looking through each of them, I don't get a feeling that we are deep in prospects. There are prospects sure, but a lot?
4) Where's the pitching? You can cherry-pick a few guys in the system who are doing well - Burrows, Priester, and a few others, but system-wide we just don't seem to have that many arms who will make a difference at the MLB level.
5) The construction of the MLB roster to start the year was poor. Since he got here, BC seems to care less about trying to fill the MLB roster with any short of talent that can help hold us over till the "kids are ready"
6) Race for Last Place. I've been reminded that this year there will be a lottery, but here we are gunning for the worst record yet again.
7) From every indication that I've seen Shelton sucks. His management of the bullpen especially for me is awful. I swear he tries to lose. BC was a GM before, BC had time in Toronto, I think his reputation has to suffer with a Shelton selection.
So is BC doing the job?
I think at times the Covid interruption makes us forget that he came in late 2019. But this is the third season he's had his hands on the steering wheel. And I've been surprised that he has avoided being under the microscope much from the fans.
Not feeling great this August 2022. My boys have picked their own teams as they grew up (no regional baseball bias in Utah and the Bucs where never good enough for them to get too excited), one (27) is a Cards fan because at 7 he started loving Pujols, another was a big Ripkin fan (42), and the last (43) has turned into a huge M's fan after moving to Seattle.
So Cards are always there, O's are surprising everyone and getting better, and M's pulled off a huge winning streak, looking for a WC spot and have a generational rookie in Julio Rodriguez. And dad's passion for the Pirates, heaven help me!
Anybody want to cheer me up about our current status in the baseball world and the guy at the helm?
I can’t offer you any cheer about our Bucs as your observations are accurate. However you can at least enjoy some world class ski resorts you have in Utah!
But I have to ask, is BC doing all that great?
1) Our last two high picks Davis and Gonzales have only proved that they can spend lots of time on the IR so far.
2) No rookies we have brought up this year have shown any staying power. They have had their moments, but not near enough of them. (I was in Seattle last week and got to watch Julio Rodriguez live twice and I get he is exceptional, but it was hard watching exceptional when we can't seem to graduate acceptable).
3) Despite the brag that our minor system is deep, only Bradenton is showing any spark - and they're Low-A:
Greensboro - 42-52
Altoona - 47-49
Indianapolis - 46-50 (the constant shuffling has to be hard here I'll admit)
A lot goes into any of these team's records, but looking through each of them, I don't get a feeling that we are deep in prospects. There are prospects sure, but a lot?
4) Where's the pitching? You can cherry-pick a few guys in the system who are doing well - Burrows, Priester, and a few others, but system-wide we just don't seem to have that many arms who will make a difference at the MLB level.
5) The construction of the MLB roster to start the year was poor. Since he got here, BC seems to care less about trying to fill the MLB roster with any short of talent that can help hold us over till the "kids are ready"
6) Race for Last Place. I've been reminded that this year there will be a lottery, but here we are gunning for the worst record yet again.
7) From every indication that I've seen Shelton sucks. His management of the bullpen especially for me is awful. I swear he tries to lose. BC was a GM before, BC had time in Toronto, I think his reputation has to suffer with a Shelton selection.
So is BC doing the job?
I think at times the Covid interruption makes us forget that he came in late 2019. But this is the third season he's had his hands on the steering wheel. And I've been surprised that he has avoided being under the microscope much from the fans.
Not feeling great this August 2022. My boys have picked their own teams as they grew up (no regional baseball bias in Utah and the Bucs where never good enough for them to get too excited), one (27) is a Cards fan because at 7 he started loving Pujols, another was a big Ripkin fan (42), and the last (43) has turned into a huge M's fan after moving to Seattle.
So Cards are always there, O's are surprising everyone and getting better, and M's pulled off a huge winning streak, looking for a WC spot and have a generational rookie in Julio Rodriguez. And dad's passion for the Pirates, heaven help me!
Anybody want to cheer me up about our current status in the baseball world and the guy at the helm?
I can’t offer you any cheer about our Bucs as your observations are accurate. However you can at least enjoy some world class ski resorts you have in Utah!
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UtahPirate
- Posts: 582
- Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2016 10:36 pm
Is BC Building a Better Organization?
684D4E4E5B704D454750220 wrote: So as I work and wait for any deadline deals, I have to admit I'm not in the greatest mood about our team from Pittsburgh (of course the after All-Star break failure to score runs does not help).
But I have to ask, is BC doing all that great?
1) Our last two high picks Davis and Gonzales have only proved that they can spend lots of time on the IR so far.
2) No rookies we have brought up this year have shown any staying power. They have had their moments, but not near enough of them. (I was in Seattle last week and got to watch Julio Rodriguez live twice and I get he is exceptional, but it was hard watching exceptional when we can't seem to graduate acceptable).
3) Despite the brag that our minor system is deep, only Bradenton is showing any spark - and they're Low-A:
Greensboro - 42-52
Altoona - 47-49
Indianapolis - 46-50 (the constant shuffling has to be hard here I'll admit)
A lot goes into any of these team's records, but looking through each of them, I don't get a feeling that we are deep in prospects. There are prospects sure, but a lot?
4) Where's the pitching? You can cherry-pick a few guys in the system who are doing well - Burrows, Priester, and a few others, but system-wide we just don't seem to have that many arms who will make a difference at the MLB level.
5) The construction of the MLB roster to start the year was poor. Since he got here, BC seems to care less about trying to fill the MLB roster with any short of talent that can help hold us over till the "kids are ready"
6) Race for Last Place. I've been reminded that this year there will be a lottery, but here we are gunning for the worst record yet again.
7) From every indication that I've seen Shelton sucks. His management of the bullpen especially for me is awful. I swear he tries to lose. BC was a GM before, BC had time in Toronto, I think his reputation has to suffer with a Shelton selection.
So is BC doing the job?
I think at times the Covid interruption makes us forget that he came in late 2019. But this is the third season he's had his hands on the steering wheel. And I've been surprised that he has avoided being under the microscope much from the fans.
Not feeling great this August 2022. My boys have picked their own teams as they grew up (no regional baseball bias in Utah and the Bucs where never good enough for them to get too excited), one (27) is a Cards fan because at 7 he started loving Pujols, another was a big Ripkin fan (42), and the last (43) has turned into a huge M's fan after moving to Seattle.
So Cards are always there, O's are surprising everyone and getting better, and M's pulled off a huge winning streak, looking for a WC spot and have a generational rookie in Julio Rodriguez. And dad's passion for the Pirates, heaven help me!
Anybody want to cheer me up about our current status in the baseball world and the guy at the helm?
I can’t offer you any cheer about our Bucs as your observations are accurate. However you can at least enjoy some world class ski resorts you have in Utah!
;D
Some good golf too, which is not overly expensive.
I'll keep that in mind as I do have control over those things!
But I have to ask, is BC doing all that great?
1) Our last two high picks Davis and Gonzales have only proved that they can spend lots of time on the IR so far.
2) No rookies we have brought up this year have shown any staying power. They have had their moments, but not near enough of them. (I was in Seattle last week and got to watch Julio Rodriguez live twice and I get he is exceptional, but it was hard watching exceptional when we can't seem to graduate acceptable).
3) Despite the brag that our minor system is deep, only Bradenton is showing any spark - and they're Low-A:
Greensboro - 42-52
Altoona - 47-49
Indianapolis - 46-50 (the constant shuffling has to be hard here I'll admit)
A lot goes into any of these team's records, but looking through each of them, I don't get a feeling that we are deep in prospects. There are prospects sure, but a lot?
4) Where's the pitching? You can cherry-pick a few guys in the system who are doing well - Burrows, Priester, and a few others, but system-wide we just don't seem to have that many arms who will make a difference at the MLB level.
5) The construction of the MLB roster to start the year was poor. Since he got here, BC seems to care less about trying to fill the MLB roster with any short of talent that can help hold us over till the "kids are ready"
6) Race for Last Place. I've been reminded that this year there will be a lottery, but here we are gunning for the worst record yet again.
7) From every indication that I've seen Shelton sucks. His management of the bullpen especially for me is awful. I swear he tries to lose. BC was a GM before, BC had time in Toronto, I think his reputation has to suffer with a Shelton selection.
So is BC doing the job?
I think at times the Covid interruption makes us forget that he came in late 2019. But this is the third season he's had his hands on the steering wheel. And I've been surprised that he has avoided being under the microscope much from the fans.
Not feeling great this August 2022. My boys have picked their own teams as they grew up (no regional baseball bias in Utah and the Bucs where never good enough for them to get too excited), one (27) is a Cards fan because at 7 he started loving Pujols, another was a big Ripkin fan (42), and the last (43) has turned into a huge M's fan after moving to Seattle.
So Cards are always there, O's are surprising everyone and getting better, and M's pulled off a huge winning streak, looking for a WC spot and have a generational rookie in Julio Rodriguez. And dad's passion for the Pirates, heaven help me!
Anybody want to cheer me up about our current status in the baseball world and the guy at the helm?
I can’t offer you any cheer about our Bucs as your observations are accurate. However you can at least enjoy some world class ski resorts you have in Utah!
;D
Some good golf too, which is not overly expensive.
I'll keep that in mind as I do have control over those things!
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2drfischer@gmail.c
Is BC Building a Better Organization?
Utah, I get your frustration. We see other organizations go through rebuilds and come out on the other end in really good shape. I think we forget, or even don't know, how long it took those orgs to go through that because we're distracted by our own nightmare going on here in Pittsburgh.
It's evident that BC has spent the vast majority of his time replenishing the minor league system at the expense of the major league roster. Those players are easier to attain than legit major league players, especially when the owner throws up the roadblocks he does. Unfortunately, none of those players has been like Ronald Acuna or Juan Soto, guys who are both really young and historically great at the same time. So we have to wait even longer for the major league team to improve.
I'm still being patient, at least for another year. After that, all bets are off. I'll always believe the Pirates are in better hands than the franchise was under Huntington so, if BC fails, the org will be in better shape for the next GM. (Talk about damning with feint praise!)
It's evident that BC has spent the vast majority of his time replenishing the minor league system at the expense of the major league roster. Those players are easier to attain than legit major league players, especially when the owner throws up the roadblocks he does. Unfortunately, none of those players has been like Ronald Acuna or Juan Soto, guys who are both really young and historically great at the same time. So we have to wait even longer for the major league team to improve.
I'm still being patient, at least for another year. After that, all bets are off. I'll always believe the Pirates are in better hands than the franchise was under Huntington so, if BC fails, the org will be in better shape for the next GM. (Talk about damning with feint praise!)
Is BC Building a Better Organization?
406D60717667703033020 wrote: In the MLB prospect rankings, 9 of the Pirates top 30 are pitchers. we can only hope they get a few good ones out of that and that a few of what they already have are serviceable or better. I doubt that there are many teams with a bunch of can't miss pitching prospects. There are a lot of promising position players too. So I'll give BC the benefit of the doubt as to the organization he's building. But without owner support there is only so much he can do. Filling out the roster with VanMeters instead of more expensive, more productive players won't help. Trading off key players because they don't want to pay them won't help. Putting the roster in the hands of Shelton won't help. So it's going to take more than just promoting prospects to the roster.
https://www.mlb.com/prospects/pirates
I would have to think at some point we are going to have some of the SP prospects connect when they get promoted. The run they have had just can't continue. Someone has to come through at some point. That being said, they have quite a few position players that seem to be intriguing and am unsure why they don't trade from that position of strength rather than let them flame out in the minors/AAAA. Tucker for example should have been jettisoned long before as it was fairly apparent he wasn't going to work out here a couple years back.
https://www.mlb.com/prospects/pirates
I would have to think at some point we are going to have some of the SP prospects connect when they get promoted. The run they have had just can't continue. Someone has to come through at some point. That being said, they have quite a few position players that seem to be intriguing and am unsure why they don't trade from that position of strength rather than let them flame out in the minors/AAAA. Tucker for example should have been jettisoned long before as it was fairly apparent he wasn't going to work out here a couple years back.