Official Game Thread - 7/21 Bucs vs Phillies

[Doc]

In response to Doc about Cruz. Many of us don't want him extended unless he gives full effort. You just never know which Cruz you are getting any given game. We saw a HOF talent previously just like Cruz who wasted a shot at greatness because he could care less about being great
Starling Marye was the same way. What a shame we are seeing a gifted player who doesn't seem to want to excel. Just play, have fun, and just get by on exceptional talent. A double and HR off a LHP last night, I thought he was ready to take off.

Back to reality

I don’t want to sound like the “get off my lawn” old man, but having the gift Cruz has, and not getting everything out of it everyday, is sickening to me. He has a job so many men in this country, indeed the baseball-playing world, would give their eye teeth to have, and he goes about as if he’s at a family picnic. How hard is it to play at full speed for the small amount of time he’s physically on the field? And I find it inexcusable that his teammates, coaches and the management don’t expect hard play from him.

If he doesn’t change, I’d just as soon they deal him. If he won’t use his talent to its fullest, the positives of having him are outweighed by the negatives he brings. Let some other club be fooled and send us players who will end up giving us more even if they don’t have his talent.

[Bobster]

Regarding Cruz, people like to compliment managers by saying they motivate players. But that's a rather generic compliment applied to any manager whose team wins games and/or doesn't blatantly quit when they're losing. But players don't have to be motivated to play the game. It's their livelihood. It's their attempt to establish lucrative careers. Where real motivation is needed is when a player like Cruz plays below the level of his ability. Playing lazy or nonchalant or lacking focus is a situation that needs to be dealt with. If Shelton can't motivate Cruz to play up to the full level of his ability, then that's a very poor reflection on Shelton.

There are 26 active players on 30 teams for a total of 780. There are additional players who are injured or who move up and down between MLB and AAA. So there are over 1,000 MLB players in any given season. There are always going to be some who unfortunately don't have the drive to always give it their best. Those players need to be taught the right way and motivated to want to do it right. When you watch players like Cutch or Reynolds, they don't seem to need motivation. But when you see players consistently jogging to 1B or standing at the plate admiring long drives that fail to clear the fence or lacking effort or focus, then the manager is either not trying to motivate or not very good at it. I don't think motivation is Shelton's strong suit.

[bucs607179]

We can’t be too disappointed with a series win against that club. Being shutout, however, does magnify the issue the Pirates have. They have to do something. The fans’ interest has been heightened. If the club does nothing, more fans will turn away and may never come back.

I wonder what the breaking point is for some fans. I thought they broke me a few times but they are in my blood bad or decent.

[Surgnbuck]

We can’t be too disappointed with a series win against that club. Being shutout, however, does magnify the issue the Pirates have. They have to do something. The fans’ interest has been heightened. If the club does nothing, more fans will turn away and may never come back.

I'm not convinced there's been much heigtening of fans interest yet, other than when Skenes pitches.

[Wildwoodcoach]

In response to Doc about Cruz. Many of us don't want him extended unless he gives full effort. You just never know which Cruz you are getting any given game. We saw a HOF talent previously just like Cruz who wasted a shot at greatness because he could care less about being great
Starling Marye was the same way. What a shame we are seeing a gifted player who doesn't seem to want to excel. Just play, have fun, and just get by on exceptional talent. A double and HR off a LHP last night, I thought he was ready to take off.

Back to reality

I don’t want to sound like the “get off my lawn” old man, but having the gift Cruz has, and not getting everything out of it everyday, is sickening to me. He has a job so many men in this country, indeed the baseball-playing world, would give their eye teeth to have, and he goes about as if he’s at a family picnic. How hard is it to play at full speed for the small amount of time he’s physically on the field? And I find it inexcusable that his teammates, coaches and the management don’t expect hard play from him.

If he doesn’t change, I’d just as soon they deal him. If he won’t use his talent to its fullest, the positives of having him are outweighed by the negatives he brings. Let some other club be fooled and send us players who will end up giving us more even if they don’t have his talent.

I was watching the clip about JIm Leyland and his induction into the Hall of Fame. I know he wouldn't put up with Cruz's nonchalant attitude.

[Doc]

We can’t be too disappointed with a series win against that club. Being shutout, however, does magnify the issue the Pirates have. They have to do something. The fans’ interest has been heightened. If the club does nothing, more fans will turn away and may never come back.

I wonder what the breaking point is for some fans. I thought they broke me a few times but they are in my blood bad or decent.

Good question. Of course, it's different for everyone. I know they've chipped away at me, little by little, over the past 25-30 years to the point that my interest isn't what it used to be. I don't go to near as many games as before, even though I absolutely love that park. I'll aways support the players, but the owner is the one who's driven me further away. I can't get past his dishonesty.

[Doc]

We can’t be too disappointed with a series win against that club. Being shutout, however, does magnify the issue the Pirates have. They have to do something. The fans’ interest has been heightened. If the club does nothing, more fans will turn away and may never come back.

I'm not convinced there's been much heigtening of fans interest yet, other than when Skenes pitches.

I sense it by how many more people I know who are paying more attention this season, and are wanting to talk about them than in recent years. I'm sure Skenes has everything to do with it but he's only been here a short while and he also doesn't pitch everyday.

[Doc]

In response to Doc about Cruz. Many of us don't want him extended unless he gives full effort. You just never know which Cruz you are getting any given game. We saw a HOF talent previously just like Cruz who wasted a shot at greatness because he could care less about being great
Starling Marye was the same way. What a shame we are seeing a gifted player who doesn't seem to want to excel. Just play, have fun, and just get by on exceptional talent. A double and HR off a LHP last night, I thought he was ready to take off.

Back to reality

I don’t want to sound like the “get off my lawn” old man, but having the gift Cruz has, and not getting everything out of it everyday, is sickening to me. He has a job so many men in this country, indeed the baseball-playing world, would give their eye teeth to have, and he goes about as if he’s at a family picnic. How hard is it to play at full speed for the small amount of time he’s physically on the field? And I find it inexcusable that his teammates, coaches and the management don’t expect hard play from him.

If he doesn’t change, I’d just as soon they deal him. If he won’t use his talent to its fullest, the positives of having him are outweighed by the negatives he brings. Let some other club be fooled and send us players who will end up giving us more even if they don’t have his talent.

I was watching the clip about JIm Leyland and his induction into the Hall of Fame. I know he wouldn't put up with Cruz's nonchalant attitude.

If he went after Bonds the way he did, he'd have no problem ripping Cruz a new one.