PNC Park RF Clemente logo replaced by ad.

[Surgnbuck]

I guess everyone jumps on a bash train yet unless someone led you by the nose, not a single one of you would have known anything changed.

Williams apologized, but quite honestly, he need only to talk with the Clementes. Even Bobby Jr. overreacted to this.

Something that was done indiscriminately all of a sudden became a sacred cow. 99.99 percent of the people making this out to be sitting on his legacy not only have no clue what was ever on the wall, a good majority of those people are just trolls anyhow.

So all you bleating sheep, just accept the apology and quit with your faux(ny) outrage.

[Bobster]

I guess everyone jumps on a bash train yet unless someone led you by the nose, not a single one of you would have known anything changed.

Williams apologized, but quite honestly, he need only to talk with the Clementes. Even Bobby Jr. overreacted to this.

Something that was done indiscriminately all of a sudden became a sacred cow. 99.99 percent of the people making this out to be sitting on his legacy not only have no clue what was ever on the wall, a good majority of those people are just trolls anyhow.

So all you bleating sheep, just accept the apology and quit with your faux(ny) outrage.

I hate to break it to you, but you don’t have the right to decide what should upset me or anyone else. It’s hard to see this as anything other than an insensitive insult to a beloved franchise icon by an incompetent organization. I’m glad it didn’t bother you. Oddly, what seems to bother you is that it bothered other people. But don’t lecture us on what should or shouldn’t bother us. And take your bleating sheep reference and stuff it where the sun don’t shine.

[Surgnbuck]

I hate to break it to you, you and all the others don't have a right to tell me I should be outraged.

Go yell at some more clouds.

[Bobster]

I hate to break it to you, you and all the others don't have a right to tell me I should be outraged.

Go yell at some more clouds.

What an incredibly stupid response. But I'm not surprised. No one told you to be outraged. You weren't even part of the discussion. We can give our opinions without a direct link to you. Everything isn't about you. You're not that special. In fact, there's nothing special about you at all. You're just an arrogant POS who thinks he should chastise people if they have an opinion you don't share.

You could have said nothing. Or you could have said you disagreed and presented your reasons. Instead, you attacked us as being "trolls," "led by the nose," "bleating sheep" and " faux(ny) outrage." That's a lot of insults for comments that had nothing to do with you and were not directed to you. WTF is your problem?

[icantwatch2]

I’m not sure about anyone else but Clemente was more than a baseball player to me. I was a child during his last years. I was just beginning to notice the Pirates the summer of 1971. My brother, who was at best a casual enthusiast, talked of a guy, Stargell, who belted monstrous homers. But, in the fall of that season, my lifelong love for baseball blossomed as I watched this magnificent player from Pittsburgh who seemingly played the game at a different speed than all the others. It was Roberto. And he was unreal. His passion for the game became mine.
So, when an owner known to squeeze a penny from any source decides to remove a tribute to my childhood hero I become that 8- year old boy again. And that boy hurts for his lost hero and the perceived setting aside of his memory to make a buck.

[JollyRoger8]

As I stated earlier; this was a blatant desecration of a civic treasure for greed. The ownership Willians in particular deserved to be called out for their insensitivity. Willians apologized and made a stupid excuse stating the Clemente RF tribute was only temporary. He obviously has no concept of what our Pittsburgh sports legends mean to the fans.

[Surgnbuck]

I hate to break it to you, you and all the others don't have a right to tell me I should be outraged.

Go yell at some more clouds.

What an incredibly stupid response. But I'm not surprised. No one told you to be outraged. You weren't even part of the discussion. We can give our opinions without a direct link to you. Everything isn't about you. You're not that special. In fact, there's nothing special about you at all. You're just an arrogant POS who thinks he should chastise people if they have an opinion you don't share.

You could have said nothing. Or you could have said you disagreed and presented your reasons. Instead, you attacked us as being "trolls," "led by the nose," "bleating sheep" and " faux(ny) outrage." That's a lot of insults for comments that had nothing to do with you and were not directed to you. WTF is your problem?

Between the two of us, only one person mentioned anyone esle by name, and only one person directly insulted the other. That would be you.

Speaking personally as an arrogant POS, maybe you shouldn't think everything is about you. I stand by what I said, and if you think it's applying to you, that's on you. Maybe it hits a nerve. That comment is for anyone that just breezes the board and posts elsewhere, here, anywhere or just shares it and jumps on that bash bandwagon. You do realize that people read the board and don't post right?

So now, you as an admin, have gone and made it directly personal, I can only assume now, being the arrogant POS that I am, that I can now call you whatever I want, and there should be no repurcussions, right?

The facts of the matter are this:
As someone who goes to the games, quite frequently, things get noticed. I've voiced my displeasure about the degradation of the kids area, all the while the Pirates claiming that little climbing area was an upgrade. it would have been, had the other stuff been left in place. But hey, that didn't make any press. A poster on this board made a comment about that kind of stuff shouldn't have been there in the first place. I highly disagree, but hey, their view on it. didn't call me an arrogant POS for disagreeing with him. I brought it up on a talk show, and the host was unaware there even was a kids area, and had no comment on it.

I made a huge stink about Legacy Square being taken out, and complained constantly to my STH rep, and was able to voice my displeasure directly to Coonelly, not once, not twice, but three separate occasions. He spun it off about utilizing space, and it not being a proper honor because of where it was located, and that they didn't have the dedicated space to give it the proper display it should have. I'll give him credit that he was consistent each time he answered me, because I knew there was no way he'd remember me. Of course, they just took the stuff out without anyone saying they were going to. No one made a stink about it, because it didn't get any press until one of the grandchildren just wanted to know what happened to the bust. then it became a big deal to people. Hence, in that case also, faux outrage. Hard to be outraged about something you didn't know existed unless someone led you by the nose to it.

I complained when they took the Pepsi signs out, that would light up for home runs. A lot of people liked that, I'm certain a lot of people didn't. But pepsi stopped the sponsorship, and from an aesthetic, there was no need to keep the support posts up. Again, most people wouldn't have noticed unless they were told.

I noticed long ago they quit making burgers on barbeque grills right in front of you at Manny's Bar B Que. I thought it was a nice touch, depending on the wind it would blow smoke onto the field, and gave the place some immediate character. People didn't like that though, and eventually, there were no grills at all, and the stuff deterioated like all the other food options at the park.

Speaking of which, there was the elft field lounge, which was originally the steak house. Nothing is being done with that. Some people notice, but most people could care less. Because they have no clue unless they're told about it, and unless it's a way to bash the organization, it's trivial.

Things also go unnoticed that finally do make a big press stink. First off, if you take the time and read a lot of the reports, it's nothing more than just jump on the bash bandwagon. One report has them having removed a "mural". It was a small logo, with 21 on it. As the Pirates mentioned, it wasn't there before, and coming out of Covid in 2022, they put it up there because they had no ads to put there.

Were you there with the band, and the huge celebration and dedication ceremony? No you weren't. You know how I know? Because that never happened. it was done without any fanfare. None whatsoever. Like the kids area, the left field lounge, legacy square, the exploding pepsi signs, the vast majority of people have no clue they existed, or had any use for it if they did know.

So they finally had someone that wanted some ad space. They probably paid a nice premium having it on the wall. The Clemente Wall is the monument, the honorarium the dedicated memorial to Clemente. Not some small little logo.

Which brings me to Bobby Jr. He made a bigger deal out of it then he needed to. I guaran damn tee you that he had no clue there was a number 21 on that wall. None. And I will say it again, neither did 99.99 percent of the people. Until of course they were shown a picture. Just because a "21" gets removed, or moved, isn't always an insult.

Hence, the faux outrage, because it just dovetails nicely into all the sell the team stuff going on, and the team's horrific record of botched public relations. This wasn't one of them. Williams shouldn't have had to explain stuff to people as if they were toddlers about what happened. Yet, there he was, had the egg on his face, took the medicine, and moved on. Yet even then, people can't accept an apology (that never needed issued), and just can't say, "Okay, our voice was heard, and we made the change happen." That should have been the end of it.

And people can also spare me their love of Clemente, and saying shit like some sacred shrine was desecrated. I take at face value anyone older than me professing their love of Clemente, because I know the 6-12 year old me heard the vast majority of men who are now in their 70''s and older make nothing but racially motivated, disparaging comments about the team, and that the only reason they won is because they brought Murtaugh back because "he knew how to deal with those ____________". And that included Clemente.

But I would not say you or anyone else DIRECTLY were one of them. But I will sure as shit say it as a generalization of people of that age, because me and a dear passed friend used to call people out that we KNEW would say shit like, "No way I'd ever go pay to see that black magic". All the while listening on radio or watching television. Which makes sense, because the Pirates, for all their success in the 60's and 70's, didn't exactly draw them in. Funny, they always at or near the top ratings for television viewing and radio ratings.

So, thanks again for giving me a board nickname. Instead of making everyone spell out "arrogant POS", let's just go with APOS.

I'll continue to post what I feel, and if it rankles some feathers, too bad. Because I recall that being posted to me before by an admin. Unless I missed some board rule that is, where only admins can say anything they want without repercussions.

[Bobster]

Go reread what you wrote:

I guess everyone jumps on a bash train yet unless someone led you by the nose, not a single one of you would have known anything changed.

Williams apologized, but quite honestly, he need only to talk with the Clementes. Even Bobby Jr. overreacted to this.

Something that was done indiscriminately all of a sudden became a sacred cow. 99.99 percent of the people making this out to be sitting on his legacy not only have no clue what was ever on the wall, a good majority of those people are just trolls anyhow.

So all you bleating sheep, just accept the apology and quit with your faux(ny) outrage.

You were rude and inappropriate regardless of who you were referring to, which appears to be anyone in that thread who doesn't feel the same way you do. It's not the first time you've been rude and I've overlooked it in the past. I'm not tolerating it anymore. Then when I called you on it, you played the victim: "you and all the others don't have a right to tell me I should be outraged." No one was doing that. You weren't even in the discussion. If you don't want to be called a APOS, then stop acting like one. Now go ahead and write another novel in response. I'm not impressed.