Off Season Roster Discussion

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Doc
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Re: Off Season Roster Discussion

Post by Doc »

Surgnbuck wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 6:06 pm
I can only imagine what he might be thinking if he signs in Pittsburgh, and the "Cueto" chants start.
I see the Royals, who call major metropolis Kansas City home, can agree to a major contract for a young, proven star for better than $26 million per season over the next 11 years. So the Pirates can't offer Cody Bellinger, who's just 28 years old, a six year deal that would pay him as much as $30 million per year?
Doc
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Re: Off Season Roster Discussion

Post by Doc »

JollyRoger8 wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 7:16 pm
Doc wrote: Sun Feb 04, 2024 2:21 am
Bobster wrote: Sun Feb 04, 2024 1:13 am
Yes, Davis can only do what he can do. His resume of being #1 draft pick doesn't help him play ball any better. He has to be used to the best of his ability, whatever that may be. The problem is that the Pirates count on building from within and treasure the opportunity to add #1 overall talent. So if they whiff on the pick and end up with a utility player instead of a franchise player, it's disastrous to the organization's building plan.
No argument from me. It’s hard to over estimate the value of that high of a pick. But once the pick is made, as you mentioned, his draft position means nothing. The list of first round picks who never worked out is long. And there are lots and lots of guys chosen in the second half of the draft who became outstanding players. It’s that proverbial crap shoot.
Keep in mind that drafting Davis #1 and paying him under slot money allowed the Pirates to draft and sign Solometo, Chandler, White and Bishop. The 2021 draft may pan out to be the best the Pirates have had
"May pan out" are the key words. They may all contribute in great ways in the future. They might also fail to make any impact at all.
Bobster
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Re: Off Season Roster Discussion

Post by Bobster »

Doc wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 10:18 pm
Surgnbuck wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 6:06 pm
I can only imagine what he might be thinking if he signs in Pittsburgh, and the "Cueto" chants start.
I see the Royals, who call major metropolis Kansas City home, can agree to a major contract for a young, proven star for better than $26 million per season over the next 11 years. So the Pirates can't offer Cody Bellinger, who's just 28 years old, a six year deal that would pay him as much as $30 million per year?
Bellinger will turn 29 in July and is coming off an outstanding season. Since he hasn't yet signed with anyone, it's probably because he wants more than is being offered. It's hard to imagine that he wants to parlay that great season into a 5 or 6 year contract that would tie him to the lowly Pirates through the best remaining years of his career. There's no incentive for star players to sign with the Pirates. Even if the Pirates made a competitive offer, players don't want to hitch their playoff hopes to a perennial bottom dweller. And Bellinger has played in the big markets of LA and Chicago. That creates more endorsement opportunities than when playing for a small market team that lacks national attention. So a player's situation can increase his income beyond his salary. We know Nutting would never offer Bellinger what he could get from other teams. But even if Nutting did, there's no incentive for Bellinger to choose to sign with the Pirates.
There's no basement in the Alamo.
Doc
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Re: Off Season Roster Discussion

Post by Doc »

Bobster wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 11:38 pm
Doc wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 10:18 pm
Surgnbuck wrote: Mon Feb 05, 2024 6:06 pm
I can only imagine what he might be thinking if he signs in Pittsburgh, and the "Cueto" chants start.
I see the Royals, who call major metropolis Kansas City home, can agree to a major contract for a young, proven star for better than $26 million per season over the next 11 years. So the Pirates can't offer Cody Bellinger, who's just 28 years old, a six year deal that would pay him as much as $30 million per year?
Bellinger will turn 29 in July and is coming off an outstanding season. Since he hasn't yet signed with anyone, it's probably because he wants more than is being offered. It's hard to imagine that he wants to parlay that great season into a 5 or 6 year contract that would tie him to the lowly Pirates through the best remaining years of his career. There's no incentive for star players to sign with the Pirates. Even if the Pirates made a competitive offer, players don't want to hitch their playoff hopes to a perennial bottom dweller. And Bellinger has played in the big markets of LA and Chicago. That creates more endorsement opportunities than when playing for a small market team that lacks national attention. So a player's situation can increase his income beyond his salary. We know Nutting would never offer Bellinger what he could get from other teams. But even if Nutting did, there's no incentive for Bellinger to choose to sign with the Pirates.
All of what you said is true, but if the Pirates don’t even try, they’ll never know if Bellinger is inspired by other things. Perhaps he might be incentivized by being the catalyst to lead a group of young, talented players to a championship, whereby he’d be idolized in a way like the other greatest Pittsburgh sports heroes are. He might like being a very big fish in the small pond that is Pittsburgh. He’d own this town.

Obviously, I don’t know what kind of person Bellinger is but I wouldn’t rule out that he might be open to coming here for any of the above reasons. The Pirates won't know, either, if they never meet with him to find out. Just offer him a contract. What’s the worst that can happen? If he accepts, only Nutting will be angry, and who cares about that? He’ll get his money back, and then some. The rest of this city would be euphoric.
fjk090852-7
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Re: Off Season Roster Discussion

Post by fjk090852-7 »

Just a guess, but a Pirate trade may be in the works. On their MLB Site there is a Running Back segment. They have done one for Peguero and Cutch. Last week on the site there was a segment for Nick Gonzales which I didn’t find tonight on their site. Maybe it was removed, or possibly I just can’t find it. Just some food for thought!
Osushawn
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Re: Off Season Roster Discussion

Post by Osushawn »

fjk090852-7 wrote: Tue Feb 06, 2024 3:42 am Just a guess, but a Pirate trade may be in the works. On their MLB Site there is a Running Back segment. They have done one for Peguero and Cutch. Last week on the site there was a segment for Nick Gonzales which I didn’t find tonight on their site. Maybe it was removed, or possibly I just can’t find it. Just some food for thought!
I saw some rumors floating that one of our glut of infielders was going to SF for either Keaton Winn or Joey Bart.
Ecbucs
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Re: Off Season Roster Discussion

Post by Ecbucs »

Osushawn wrote: Wed Feb 07, 2024 12:36 pm
fjk090852-7 wrote: Tue Feb 06, 2024 3:42 am Just a guess, but a Pirate trade may be in the works. On their MLB Site there is a Running Back segment. They have done one for Peguero and Cutch. Last week on the site there was a segment for Nick Gonzales which I didn’t find tonight on their site. Maybe it was removed, or possibly I just can’t find it. Just some food for thought!
I saw some rumors floating that one of our glut of infielders was going to SF for either Keaton Winn or Joey Bart.
looked up their stats:
Bart:

https://www.baseball-reference.com/regi ... rt--000joe

Winn:
https://www.baseball-reference.com/regi ... nn--000kea

Joey Bart should not bring the Giants much of a haul. Winn is listed on mlb.com as Giants 15th ranked prospect.
3pirates3
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Re: Off Season Roster Discussion

Post by 3pirates3 »

fjk090852-7 wrote: Tue Feb 06, 2024 3:42 am Just a guess, but a Pirate trade may be in the works. On their MLB Site there is a Running Back segment. They have done one for Peguero and Cutch. Last week on the site there was a segment for Nick Gonzales which I didn’t find tonight on their site. Maybe it was removed, or possibly I just can’t find it. Just some food for thought!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCwcMkZDVMQ
fjk090852-7
Posts: 3364
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2016 2:52 pm

Re: Off Season Roster Discussion

Post by fjk090852-7 »

3pirates3 wrote: Wed Feb 07, 2024 6:05 pm
fjk090852-7 wrote: Tue Feb 06, 2024 3:42 am Just a guess, but a Pirate trade may be in the works. On their MLB Site there is a Running Back segment. They have done one for Peguero and Cutch. Last week on the site there was a segment for Nick Gonzales which I didn’t find tonight on their site. Maybe it was removed, or possibly I just can’t find it. Just some food for thought!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCwcMkZDVMQ
Yes that is the segment which previously was on the Bucs MLB Site. The segments for Peguero and Cutch are still noted on the main page of the Pirates website. Not so Gonzales! It just made me wonder if something was up regarding his future status with the team.
Wildwoodcoach
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Re: Off Season Roster Discussion

Post by Wildwoodcoach »

With Johnson probably a year away, and Triolo, I can see either
Gonzales or Peguero being involved in a trade for a Starting Pitcher
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