OnlyBucs

2A21292520213A7F790E372F262121602D214E0 wrote: I have nothing against the Indians, but they do the same thing the Pirates get ripped on.  They made the playoffs many times and never built on their success.  They have just as much money and the team is worth more than the Pirates too.  They have a nice ballpark and a fan base who wants to win (longest WS drought in baseball).



If the Pirates three year playoff run wasn't good enough, why are the Indians'?  The Indians haven't made the playoffs two years in a row since 1998-99.



I think the Indians have been very good over the years and usually have a very competitive team.  But when I think that about the Pirates the last few years, it's just isn't good enough.  Of course, I want to go to the World Series.   Of course, I want to win the World Series.  I know how hard it is.  The Indians are proof of that too.   






Why do you throw stuff out there that is just BS?  You say the Indians have more money and fans that "want a WS too"....   Here you go.



Even in this season of total discontent the Pirates are averaging 1100+ more fans this year per game.



According to Forbes the Pirates are the 17th most valuable franchise, the Indians 27th.



Value of the pirates $1.25 Bi!!ion Do!!ars

Value of the Indians $920M



Percentage increase over part year: Pirates 28%, Indians 12%.



And finally payroll - notwithstanding all of the above, reviewing all the different projections, the Indians payroll is somewhere around $25M - $35M more than the Pirates. 



Your absolute blind loyalty to Bob Nutting is completely baffling.




It's not blind loyalty. It's defending stupid critism. Saying the Indians owner cares more is a false using the same criteria for the Pirates. "The Pirates didn't invest after winning 98 games". Well, the Indians never have either making the playoffs as they haven't made the playoffs two years in a row since 1999.



You know those Forbes numbers aren't exact and change daily. Many sources have different team worths. Even so, you know the Indians have just as much worth and money as the Pirates. They are the hot team right now just as the Pirates were in 2013-2015.
OMG Dog!!! So you're discounting the Indians' trip to the WS last year because the haven't made the playoffs 2 years consecutively??????? So I suppose that if someone could guarantee you the Pirates would go to the WS but not make the playoff's 2 consecutive years, you would decline the offer?

No, it's the Pirates playoffs trips didn't matter. It's why they didn't get further. That is the question.



Yet, when another team doesn't build on previous seasons, it's overlooked.



The Indians are an example of how they have been very good many times over the years but didn't build upon those seasons. The Pirates get criticized yet the Indians are the better ownership?



Both ownerships have been guilty of the same thing.

Your "argument" is boarding on the  absurd.



$152M

$125M (low estimate)

$100M (high estimate)



You know what this represents.  And yet you say other contending "small mkt" teams don't build upon initial success.  Right.  Those guys are spending $30M - $50M more than the Pieates for no reason at all.



Before you discount the significance of these ## as having no meaning at all, let me say....

My earlier comment stands - for some completely baffling reason you'd rather be an apologist for BobNutting rather than see him invest some more cash into his $1,250,000,000 cash making machine.

Again, nope.



Just fair criticism. That's all it is. People want to jump on the Indians bandwagon yet they haven't built on their success. Do you disagree with that? 



When the Indians win 96 games in 2007 and then go .500 the next year and under .500 the next four years after that, they are being run properly with their great ownership that cares? 



The Pirates lose after winning 98 games, they have the worst owner in all of sports?  Do you not see the hypocrisy?  It's a silly argument/discussion. Nutting's team have made the playoffs at a higher rate than Dolan's Indians. Yet, Dolan is praised as a great owner. Again, do you see the hypocrisy?