OnlyBucs

7E757D7174756E2B2D5A637B7275753479751A0 wrote: The power hitters didn't get the big deals last off season.  It was like the on-base guys got the deals, not the power bats.  Will that change?



Moustakas is the best available 3B this free agency, but that is based on one really good season.  Before this year, he had only one full season of an OPS over .800 and plus 20 HRs. 



I'd take him in a heart beat.  But I do think Kang is better.


We aren't getting Moustakas.  Is Kang better?  I don't think so.  We haven't seen him play in over a year.


Yeah based on early Winter League returns we're waiting for a ghost.



Also, I might be wrong (probably am) but don't think that Moustakas will have any more productive of a season than several of the other options here. 




I'm seeing all these names that Pittsburgh should look into that are all pipe dreams.  Bottom line, when was the last time this organization made a true splash relative toward free agency or a trade?  When was the last time the Pirates got someone still in their prime instead of on the downward turn?  We aren't getting Donaldson; we are getting Moustakas.  With the way this organization loves reclamation projects, I can see Pedro Alvarez coming back before either one of those two get contacted by Pittsburgh.


I'm ok with that.  Awesome.




Bad typo on my part. We aren't getting him either. Not close. Name the last young player still in his prime that we signed as a free agent or landed in a trade. It's naive to think we are going to get someone like this.

6878794E5858543B0 wrote: The power hitters didn't get the big deals last off season.  It was like the on-base guys got the deals, not the power bats.  Will that change?



Moustakas is the best available 3B this free agency, but that is based on one really good season.  Before this year, he had only one full season of an OPS over .800 and plus 20 HRs. 



I'd take him in a heart beat.  But I do think Kang is better.


We aren't getting Moustakas.  Is Kang better?  I don't think so.  We haven't seen him play in over a year.


Yeah based on early Winter League returns we're waiting for a ghost.



Also, I might be wrong (probably am) but don't think that Moustakas will have any more productive of a season than several of the other options here. 




I'm seeing all these names that Pittsburgh should look into that are all pipe dreams.  Bottom line, when was the last time this organization made a true splash relative toward free agency or a trade?  When was the last time the Pirates got someone still in their prime instead of on the downward turn?  We aren't getting Donaldson; we are getting Moustakas.  With the way this organization loves reclamation projects, I can see Pedro Alvarez coming back before either one of those two get contacted by Pittsburgh.


Uhhh.... have you already forgotten the Signing that signaled to the baseball world that the Pirates had arrived???? Derek Freaking Bell baby!!!!!! ;D ;D ;D

Oh, you got me excited. I thought you knew something that the rest of us did not know.



You are right. Besides Nova and Cervelli, everyone else in the starting line up or rotation has been home grown or at least spent time in the Pirates' minors. Now is a good time to bring in that final piece.



(I left Freese and Kang out because I don't know if they are really trying to upgrade third base or not. I don't expect Kang back this year and I hope Freese is moved to the bench. As of right now, Freese is penciled in as the starter.)

1F0F0E392F2F234C0 wrote: The power hitters didn't get the big deals last off season.  It was like the on-base guys got the deals, not the power bats.  Will that change?



Moustakas is the best available 3B this free agency, but that is based on one really good season.  Before this year, he had only one full season of an OPS over .800 and plus 20 HRs. 



I'd take him in a heart beat.  But I do think Kang is better.


We aren't getting Moustakas.  Is Kang better?  I don't think so.  We haven't seen him play in over a year.


Yeah based on early Winter League returns we're waiting for a ghost.



Also, I might be wrong (probably am) but don't think that Moustakas will have any more productive of a season than several of the other options here. 




I'm seeing all these names that Pittsburgh should look into that are all pipe dreams.  Bottom line, when was the last time this organization made a true splash relative toward free agency or a trade?  When was the last time the Pirates got someone still in their prime instead of on the downward turn?  We aren't getting Donaldson; we are getting Moustakas.  With the way this organization loves reclamation projects, I can see Pedro Alvarez coming back before either one of those two get contacted by Pittsburgh.


I'm ok with that.  Awesome.




Bad typo on my part.  We aren't getting him either.  Not close.  Name the last young player still in his prime that we signed as a free agent or landed in a trade.  It's naive to think we are going to get someone like this.


Kang and Martin. No there aren't a lot, but there aren't none like you seem to be implying.

5D6F63637745666F6267686F0E0 wrote: The power hitters didn't get the big deals last off season.  It was like the on-base guys got the deals, not the power bats.  Will that change?



Moustakas is the best available 3B this free agency, but that is based on one really good season.  Before this year, he had only one full season of an OPS over .800 and plus 20 HRs. 



I'd take him in a heart beat.  But I do think Kang is better.


We aren't getting Moustakas.  Is Kang better?  I don't think so.  We haven't seen him play in over a year.


Yeah based on early Winter League returns we're waiting for a ghost.



Also, I might be wrong (probably am) but don't think that Moustakas will have any more productive of a season than several of the other options here. 




I'm seeing all these names that Pittsburgh should look into that are all pipe dreams.  Bottom line, when was the last time this organization made a true splash relative toward free agency or a trade?  When was the last time the Pirates got someone still in their prime instead of on the downward turn?  We aren't getting Donaldson; we are getting Moustakas.  With the way this organization loves reclamation projects, I can see Pedro Alvarez coming back before either one of those two get contacted by Pittsburgh.


I'm ok with that.  Awesome.




Bad typo on my part.  We aren't getting him either.  Not close.  Name the last young player still in his prime that we signed as a free agent or landed in a trade.  It's naive to think we are going to get someone like this.


Kang and Martin.  No there aren't a lot, but there aren't none like you seem to be implying. 


Kang was an unknown commodity. The Korean pitching was likened to AA and it was not a certainty that he would be productive. In fact, when he got off to a slow start in 2015 I recall fans saying he should go to the minors for seasoning. Martin was a proven catcher but in the years preceding the trade his BA had fallen each year from .293 to .280 to .250 to .248 to .237 and then to .211 at the time he was acquired. So the speculation was that the Pirates were getting a strong defensive catcher and leader but someone who was not expected to contribute offensively. So I don't think I would classify either Kang or Martin as players being obtained in their prime. Both exceeded expectations offensively although Martin was still in his prime defensively.

I think I'm confused but what people mean by "in their prime." I guess it means at their personal best level unless it's the Pirates that do it and then it doesn't count

4A7874746052717875707F78190 wrote: I think I'm confused but what people mean by "in their prime."  I guess it means at their personal best level unless it's the Pirates that do it and then it doesn't count


The standard age is 28-31 for players to be in their prime. At least, that was what I have always been told, believed.

4D7F73736755767F7277787F1E0 wrote: I think I'm confused but what people mean by "in their prime."  I guess it means at their personal best level unless it's the Pirates that do it and then it doesn't count
What players do you feels were acquired by the Pirates at their personal best level? At the time Kang was obtained no one knew how he would do against ML pitching. It worked out well but it was not as if they had signed or traded for a productive major league star. I think Martin turned out to be the best acquisition NH has made (at least until Rivero). But to be fair, they weren't getting the 24 year old Martin who hit .293 with .843 OPS in 2007. They were getting the 29 year old Martin who hit .211 with .713 OPS in 2012 and whose hitting had been deteriorating 5 straight years. I think it worked out fine but I wouldn't cite it as an example of acquiring a player in his prime unless we're only talking about defense.

69626A666362793C3A4D746C656262236E620D0 wrote: I think I'm confused but what people mean by "in their prime."  I guess it means at their personal best level unless it's the Pirates that do it and then it doesn't count


The standard age is 28-31 for players to be in their prime.  At least, that was what I have always been told, believed.
That seems reasonable as a guideline. But "prime" isn't just a matter of age. It's relative to their best years of performance. Some players' prime years are earlier and some are later. For example, Bill Robinson was a 16 year veteran whose career essentially began as a Yankee at age 24. But his prime years were with the Pirates in his mid 30s when he was at his most productive.

59525A565352490C0A7D445C555252135E523D0 wrote: I think I'm confused but what people mean by "in their prime."  I guess it means at their personal best level unless it's the Pirates that do it and then it doesn't count


The standard age is 28-31 for players to be in their prime.  At least, that was what I have always been told, believed.


to me it is a acquiring a player who has had a good season and you expect him to continue to have good seasons.



Nova, Martin, A.J., Cervelli, Freese, Jaso and Niese don't fit that definition.