OnlyBucs

You don't think they will ever compete?  Don't forget, the Astros recently lost 100 games a season for three straight years.  They built it back up with great draft picks having some top picks.  The Astros give me hope.  They were pretty bad and their top picks panned out.  Every team, in my opinion, can do the same thing.  The Royals just did it too.  They can get that window of opportunity.  Maybe it is best to tank it and get those high picks? 



I don't see too many MVPs on the farm.  I also never thought McCutchen would be an MVP either watching him come through the minors.  I have hope for Austin Meadows to replace McCutchen, but injuries are derailing him a bit.



I also don't think this team is far removed from contending.  Any team can win once they make the Playoffs.  Things need to fall in place as that happens for many teams.  The Astros certainly didn't think Jose Altuve  was a future MVP as he was cut the first day and then later signed for $15,000.



Modify (we were posting at the same time):



Did you think there was no hope for the Astros in 2009 - 2013 to never compete again?  They lost close to 500 games in that time period.   

040F070B0E0F145157201901080F0F4E030F600 wrote: You don't think they will ever compete?  Don't forget, the Astros recently lost 100 games a season for three straight years.  They built it back up with great draft picks having some top picks.  The Astros give me hope.  They were pretty bad and their top picks panned out.  Every team, in my opinion, can do the same thing.  The Royals just did it too.  They can get that window of opportunity.  Maybe it is best to tank it and get those high picks? 



I don't see too many MVPs on the farm.  I also never thought McCutchen would be an MVP either watching him come through the minors.  I have hope for Austin Meadows to replace McCutchen, but injuries are derailing him a bit.



I also don't think this team is far removed from contending.  Any team can win once they make the Playoffs.  Things need to fall in place as that happens for many teams.  The Astros certainly didn't think Jose Altuve  was a future MVP as he was cut the first day and then later signed for $15,000.



Modify (we were posting at the same time):



Did you think there was no hope for the Astros in 2009 - 2013 to never compete again?  They lost close to 500 games in that time period.   


the Pirates aren't going to follow the Astros model and sign players like Beltran and Gurriel. If there was hope that they could afford a couple players in that price range I would feel more confident that NH could make upgrades to the team.



Instead, we need to hope that Josh Bell, Luplow or Will Craig turns into at least a Clay Bellinger or Aaron Judge type player on offense.

7C5A5B4C5A4A390 wrote: You don't think they will ever compete?  Don't forget, the Astros recently lost 100 games a season for three straight years.  They built it back up with great draft picks having some top picks.  The Astros give me hope.  They were pretty bad and their top picks panned out.  Every team, in my opinion, can do the same thing.  The Royals just did it too.  They can get that window of opportunity.  Maybe it is best to tank it and get those high picks? 



I don't see too many MVPs on the farm.  I also never thought McCutchen would be an MVP either watching him come through the minors.  I have hope for Austin Meadows to replace McCutchen, but injuries are derailing him a bit.



I also don't think this team is far removed from contending.  Any team can win once they make the Playoffs.  Things need to fall in place as that happens for many teams.  The Astros certainly didn't think Jose Altuve  was a future MVP as he was cut the first day and then later signed for $15,000.



Modify (we were posting at the same time):



Did you think there was no hope for the Astros in 2009 - 2013 to never compete again?  They lost close to 500 games in that time period.   


the Pirates aren't going to follow the Astros model and sign players like Beltran and Gurriel.  If there was hope that they could afford a couple players in that price range I would feel more confident that NH could make upgrades to the team. 



Instead, we need to hope that Josh Bell, Luplow or Will Craig turns into at least a Clay Bellinger or Aaron Judge type player on offense. 


What do you think Eduardo Nunez will make? Not a superstar I know.

073539392D1F3C35383D3235540 wrote: You don't think they will ever compete?  Don't forget, the Astros recently lost 100 games a season for three straight years.  They built it back up with great draft picks having some top picks.  The Astros give me hope.  They were pretty bad and their top picks panned out.  Every team, in my opinion, can do the same thing.  The Royals just did it too.  They can get that window of opportunity.  Maybe it is best to tank it and get those high picks? 



I don't see too many MVPs on the farm.  I also never thought McCutchen would be an MVP either watching him come through the minors.  I have hope for Austin Meadows to replace McCutchen, but injuries are derailing him a bit.



I also don't think this team is far removed from contending.  Any team can win once they make the Playoffs.  Things need to fall in place as that happens for many teams.  The Astros certainly didn't think Jose Altuve  was a future MVP as he was cut the first day and then later signed for $15,000.



Modify (we were posting at the same time):



Did you think there was no hope for the Astros in 2009 - 2013 to never compete again?  They lost close to 500 games in that time period.   


the Pirates aren't going to follow the Astros model and sign players like Beltran and Gurriel.  If there was hope that they could afford a couple players in that price range I would feel more confident that NH could make upgrades to the team. 



Instead, we need to hope that Josh Bell, Luplow or Will Craig turns into at least a Clay Bellinger or Aaron Judge type player on offense. 


What do you think Eduardo Nunez will make?  Not a superstar I know.


He made 4 million this year. Don't know if he will be signed somewhere to be a regular or to bounce between a couple positions. My guess is 3 or 4 years at 6 or 7 million a year.



Will be interesting to see. Just had a career year in terms of OPS.

795F5E495F4F3C0 wrote: You don't think they will ever compete?  Don't forget, the Astros recently lost 100 games a season for three straight years.  They built it back up with great draft picks having some top picks.  The Astros give me hope.  They were pretty bad and their top picks panned out.  Every team, in my opinion, can do the same thing.  The Royals just did it too.  They can get that window of opportunity.  Maybe it is best to tank it and get those high picks? 



I don't see too many MVPs on the farm.  I also never thought McCutchen would be an MVP either watching him come through the minors.  I have hope for Austin Meadows to replace McCutchen, but injuries are derailing him a bit.



I also don't think this team is far removed from contending.  Any team can win once they make the Playoffs.  Things need to fall in place as that happens for many teams.  The Astros certainly didn't think Jose Altuve  was a future MVP as he was cut the first day and then later signed for $15,000.



Modify (we were posting at the same time):



Did you think there was no hope for the Astros in 2009 - 2013 to never compete again?  They lost close to 500 games in that time period.   


the Pirates aren't going to follow the Astros model and sign players like Beltran and Gurriel.  If there was hope that they could afford a couple players in that price range I would feel more confident that NH could make upgrades to the team. 



Instead, we need to hope that Josh Bell, Luplow or Will Craig turns into at least a Clay Bellinger or Aaron Judge type player on offense. 


What do you think Eduardo Nunez will make?  Not a superstar I know.


He made 4 million this year.  Don't know if he will be signed somewhere to be a regular or to bounce between a couple positions.  My guess is 3 or 4 years at 6 or 7 million a year. 



Will be interesting to see. Just had a career year in terms of OPS.


Yeah, not a sexy move but I think would be an upgrade.



Looking at a 3B FA list there wasn't much there, Moustakas and a bunch of eh.

745850575C7B4C5A4A390 wrote: In addition, when the Astros need pitching help in July, they go out and get Verlander, and the Dodgers get Darvish.   In contrast, the Pirates get Benoit and Kontos.



Astros may have some issues with the pen, but they have a great core of young players who can smack the ball around and who play well. 



With their current cast of talent, the Pirates need everything to go well to be able to compete.  In short, things don't look good for the Bucs in the near-term.




I vividly remember a boar member taking shots at Houston for not going out and making a deal to help the bullpen at the TDL. That was Dog. Well, Dog, they didn't help that, but they went full Verlander and that was a major add. He could be the MVP if they win this thing. Bottom line, Houston went out and addressed a need. Gave up a lot to get him, but realized they need to go for it. This is something Pittsburgh didn't do. Three good years as a wild card, but didn't build on that in any way. Utter fail.



We aren't close, but some will continue to be delusional thinking we can compete. We can't.

4C474F4346475C191F685149404747064B47280 wrote: You don't think they will ever compete?  Don't forget, the Astros recently lost 100 games a season for three straight years.  They built it back up with great draft picks having some top picks.  The Astros give me hope.  They were pretty bad and their top picks panned out.  Every team, in my opinion, can do the same thing.  The Royals just did it too.  They can get that window of opportunity.  Maybe it is best to tank it and get those high picks? 



I don't see too many MVPs on the farm.  I also never thought McCutchen would be an MVP either watching him come through the minors.  I have hope for Austin Meadows to replace McCutchen, but injuries are derailing him a bit.



I also don't think this team is far removed from contending.  Any team can win once they make the Playoffs.  Things need to fall in place as that happens for many teams.  The Astros certainly didn't think Jose Altuve  was a future MVP as he was cut the first day and then later signed for $15,000.



Modify (we were posting at the same time):



Did you think there was no hope for the Astros in 2009 - 2013 to never compete again?  They lost close to 500 games in that time period.   


Again, you need a reality check.  Houston lost 100 games recently, but had a heck of a lot of talent in the minors - way more than what we have.  They added good pieces in deals too-like a Verlander. We aren't even close.  The more you post secures my thinking you are NH or Nutting based on your continued optimism when there is zero evidence to have any.

3222231402020E610 wrote: You don't think they will ever compete?  Don't forget, the Astros recently lost 100 games a season for three straight years.  They built it back up with great draft picks having some top picks.  The Astros give me hope.  They were pretty bad and their top picks panned out.  Every team, in my opinion, can do the same thing.  The Royals just did it too.  They can get that window of opportunity.  Maybe it is best to tank it and get those high picks? 



I don't see too many MVPs on the farm.  I also never thought McCutchen would be an MVP either watching him come through the minors.  I have hope for Austin Meadows to replace McCutchen, but injuries are derailing him a bit.



I also don't think this team is far removed from contending.  Any team can win once they make the Playoffs.  Things need to fall in place as that happens for many teams.  The Astros certainly didn't think Jose Altuve  was a future MVP as he was cut the first day and then later signed for $15,000.



Modify (we were posting at the same time):



Did you think there was no hope for the Astros in 2009 - 2013 to never compete again?  They lost close to 500 games in that time period.   


Again, you need a reality check.  Houston lost 100 games recently, but had a heck of a lot of talent in the minors - way more than what we have.  They added good pieces in deals too-like a Verlander. We aren't even close.  The more you post secures my thinking you are NH or Nutting based on your continued optimism when there is zero evidence to have any.


I don't think Dog is NH, but it wouldn't surprise me if there are people from the organization that read this site, Bucs Dugout, certainly Pirates Prospects. It's an easy way to get a read on what the fanbase is thinking.

121A192E381D3A355B0 wrote: As a follow up, look at how the Astros build their team.



Here is a list of the FAs (not International FAs) who signed with the Astros:



Charlie Morton

Luke Gregorson

Will Harris

Juan Centeno

Carlos Beltran



That's it.  Not exactly an All Star team.  Every other player on their 25 man WS roster was either A) drafted by the Astros, B) acquired in a trade, C) signed as an IFA (notably includes Altuve and Gurriel) or D) picked up on waivers. The one that sticks out to me is Dallas Keuchel, drafted in the 7th round in 2009. Where is our Keuchel? Everyone knew to expect great things from Correa and Springer. Even McCullers was a first round pick. But Keuchel?



https://www.si.com/mlb/2017/10/27/how-a ... -assembled


That list certainly isn't much. Morton pitched over his head. That said, they didn't need much. When you have the lineup they have, you are looking for depth - backups. They got their ace in a deal after the trade deadline in Verlander. Then you go Keuchel ... could be vice versa, but we are along way away from having that. McCullers being a three. He is way over Nova. The funny thing is their fifth - Peacock - the way he pitched this year, he would have been our ace.



We don't have a Keuchel. Cole was supposed to be our Keuchel. He isn't. Could he be? Sure - he did it one year. Absent that one year, he has been a #3 at best. Heck, Cole would be the #4 in that rotation and he is our presumed ace.



We don't have a Bregman. They have a big advantage at every position on the field with exception of first (pretty even). All three outfield positions as far as hitters kill our's.

7E6E6F584E4E422D0 wrote: As a follow up, look at how the Astros build their team.



Here is a list of the FAs (not International FAs) who signed with the Astros:



Charlie Morton

Luke Gregorson

Will Harris

Juan Centeno

Carlos Beltran



That's it.  Not exactly an All Star team.  Every other player on their 25 man WS roster was either A) drafted by the Astros, B) acquired in a trade, C) signed as an IFA (notably includes Altuve and Gurriel) or D) picked up on waivers. The one that sticks out to me is Dallas Keuchel, drafted in the 7th round in 2009. Where is our Keuchel? Everyone knew to expect great things from Correa and Springer. Even McCullers was a first round pick. But Keuchel?



https://www.si.com/mlb/2017/10/27/how-a ... -assembled


That list certainly isn't much.  Morton pitched over his head.  That said, they didn't need much.  When you have the lineup they have, you are looking for depth - backups.  They got their ace in a deal after the trade deadline in Verlander.  Then you go Keuchel ... could be vice versa, but we are along way away from having that.  McCullers being a three.  He is way over Nova.  The funny thing is their fifth - Peacock - the way he pitched this year, he would have been our ace.



We don't have a Keuchel.  Cole was supposed to be our Keuchel.  He isn't.  Could he be?  Sure - he did it one year.  Absent that one year, he has been a #3 at best.  Heck, Cole would be the #4 in that rotation and he is our presumed ace.



We don't have a Bregman.  They have a big advantage at every position on the field with exception of first (pretty even).  All three outfield positions as far as hitters kill our's.


from watching this Series, the Astros players not only hit better than the Pirates they are better defensively too.