696162554366414E200 wrote: I guess I'm okay with the fact that Hutchison got lit because (A) He's not very good and if you put him in the rotation you are just asking for trouble; and (B) I really think we need the lefty Brault in the 5 spot.
I can recall seasons when a ST "competition" was "won" by the pitcher who put up worse stats than the loser. I will be very surprised if Hutchison is not the 5th starter regardless of ST stats. The Liriano/McGwire, Ramirez deal was bad PR and a decision that Hutchison isn't good enough to be #5 will be more egg on the face for the FO that tried to say that deal was to acquire Hutchison rather than giving away prospects to get Toronto to pay Liriano's salary. Plus, the Pirates gave Hutchison 2 million this year. That's a lot for a AAA pitcher. I don't think anyone else has a chance.
I just don't think this is fair though. It seems to me that, if anything, this FO has shown a propensity to not give a rat's behind what public perception is. I don't think Hutchison is a lock by any means. My money's on Brault. Glasnow comes up whenever an inevitable injury happens.
Of course it's not fair. But they cared about the public's perception of the Liriano salary dump by insisting their primary goal was to obtain Hutchison (though few believed that). If NH wants us to believe he traded Liriano and 2 prospects because he wanted Hutchison so badly, having Hutchson lose out to an unproven pitcher would suggest that NH really overrated him. And overpaid him. I hope I'm wrong and that the best pitcher gets the #5 spot. But I suspect Hutchison has a scholarship.
2017 Bullpen
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
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OrlandoMerced
2017 Bullpen
060E0D3A2C092E214F0 wrote: On the plus side, it appears that NH fleeced the Nationals in the Melancon trade. Rivera may end up being one of the best relievers in baseball starting this year.
I actually like the flexibility of the setup role. Like how the Indians used Miller last year. Having your best reliever in that role might be better for team (that's assuming that Watson is at least competent in the closer role).
Yes. I'm not so sure he shouldn't be our closer now.
I actually like the flexibility of the setup role. Like how the Indians used Miller last year. Having your best reliever in that role might be better for team (that's assuming that Watson is at least competent in the closer role).
Yes. I'm not so sure he shouldn't be our closer now.
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UtahPirate
- Posts: 582
- Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2016 10:36 pm
2017 Bullpen
4F7D71716557747D70757A7D1C0 wrote: I think if Hutchison has a good start today you can pencil him as #5.
You mean like that?
Yikes.
Ha! Guess I cursed him. He got seriously lit up!
Webb also getting beat up...
You mean like that?
Yikes.
Ha! Guess I cursed him. He got seriously lit up!
Webb also getting beat up...
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ChitownBucco
- Posts: 492
- Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2016 9:10 pm
2017 Bullpen
I think josh Lindblom might end up helping us later this summer/fall
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Bobster21
2017 Bullpen
4160757C447D66756071140 wrote: I think if Hutchison has a good start today you can pencil him as #5.
You mean like that?
Yikes.
Ha! Guess I cursed him. He got seriously lit up!
Webb also getting beat up...
If they're considering keeping Webb via Rule 5, they probably expect him to get roughed up a little. But they won't make him a 5th LHP. On the other hand Bastardo and/or Watson could both be gone by mid season if not sooner. If they stockpile LHPs, that would be the reason.
You mean like that?
Yikes.
Ha! Guess I cursed him. He got seriously lit up!
Webb also getting beat up...
If they're considering keeping Webb via Rule 5, they probably expect him to get roughed up a little. But they won't make him a 5th LHP. On the other hand Bastardo and/or Watson could both be gone by mid season if not sooner. If they stockpile LHPs, that would be the reason.
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UtahPirate
- Posts: 582
- Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2016 10:36 pm
2017 Bullpen
5C717C6D6A7B6C2C2F1E0 wrote: I think if Hutchison has a good start today you can pencil him as #5.
You mean like that?
Yikes.
Ha! Guess I cursed him. He got seriously lit up!
Webb also getting beat up...
If they're considering keeping Webb via Rule 5, they probably expect him to get roughed up a little. But they won't make him a 5th LHP. On the other hand Bastardo and/or Watson could both be gone by mid season if not sooner. If they stockpile LHPs, that would be the reason.
Webb is 26. He is no young Rule 5 kid we are going to protect so we can send him back to the minors next year to develop. He can either help the BP, or they'll send him back. I do think they will be slightly more patient, but his ST so far hasn't been that great and today doesn't help.
You mean like that?
Yikes.
Ha! Guess I cursed him. He got seriously lit up!
Webb also getting beat up...
If they're considering keeping Webb via Rule 5, they probably expect him to get roughed up a little. But they won't make him a 5th LHP. On the other hand Bastardo and/or Watson could both be gone by mid season if not sooner. If they stockpile LHPs, that would be the reason.
Webb is 26. He is no young Rule 5 kid we are going to protect so we can send him back to the minors next year to develop. He can either help the BP, or they'll send him back. I do think they will be slightly more patient, but his ST so far hasn't been that great and today doesn't help.
2017 Bullpen
Hughes failing is a gift to Hutchison. It's getting near Impossible that he doesn't make the team either as #5 (was very likely scholarshiped regardless of performance) or long man in the pen.
He has no options, we paid him arb. Traded Liriano, mcGuire and Ramirez for him. (That's NHs claim anyway)
Barring an injury, there's no doubt he's on the team. I guess I should believe and state that there's maybe a 1 in 50 chance Brault gets the #5 while drew hutch goes into the bullpen. So there it is. I give it a 2% chance that he's not in the rotation, if healthy.
Where he should be is in AAA getting SUCCESSFUL innings with whatever changes mythical Searage has him working on. Then called up if he's able to show progress with the changes.
That's not possible
He has no options, we paid him arb. Traded Liriano, mcGuire and Ramirez for him. (That's NHs claim anyway)
Barring an injury, there's no doubt he's on the team. I guess I should believe and state that there's maybe a 1 in 50 chance Brault gets the #5 while drew hutch goes into the bullpen. So there it is. I give it a 2% chance that he's not in the rotation, if healthy.
Where he should be is in AAA getting SUCCESSFUL innings with whatever changes mythical Searage has him working on. Then called up if he's able to show progress with the changes.
That's not possible
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Bobster21
2017 Bullpen
69485D546C554E5D48593C0 wrote: I think if Hutchison has a good start today you can pencil him as #5.
You mean like that?
Yikes.
Ha! Guess I cursed him. He got seriously lit up!
Webb also getting beat up...
If they're considering keeping Webb via Rule 5, they probably expect him to get roughed up a little. But they won't make him a 5th LHP. On the other hand Bastardo and/or Watson could both be gone by mid season if not sooner. If they stockpile LHPs, that would be the reason.
Webb is 26. He is no young Rule 5 kid we are going to protect so we can send him back to the minors next year to develop. He can either help the BP, or they'll send him back. I do think they will be slightly more patient, but his ST so far hasn't been that great and today doesn't help.
Webb's had 2 years at AAA, a high K rate, good control and is a LHP so they probably feel he's worth a shot. I don't think they'd be looking to send him back to the minors next year. On the other hand, considering he has zero MLB experience, less would be expected of him in ST and he'd probably start the season as the last guy out of the BP. If he's not working out as the season progresses they can waive him. But I think they would like to keep him and, as you said, will be more patient with him than they would be with an experienced pitcher putting up the same ST stats.
You mean like that?
Yikes.
Ha! Guess I cursed him. He got seriously lit up!
Webb also getting beat up...
If they're considering keeping Webb via Rule 5, they probably expect him to get roughed up a little. But they won't make him a 5th LHP. On the other hand Bastardo and/or Watson could both be gone by mid season if not sooner. If they stockpile LHPs, that would be the reason.
Webb is 26. He is no young Rule 5 kid we are going to protect so we can send him back to the minors next year to develop. He can either help the BP, or they'll send him back. I do think they will be slightly more patient, but his ST so far hasn't been that great and today doesn't help.
Webb's had 2 years at AAA, a high K rate, good control and is a LHP so they probably feel he's worth a shot. I don't think they'd be looking to send him back to the minors next year. On the other hand, considering he has zero MLB experience, less would be expected of him in ST and he'd probably start the season as the last guy out of the BP. If he's not working out as the season progresses they can waive him. But I think they would like to keep him and, as you said, will be more patient with him than they would be with an experienced pitcher putting up the same ST stats.
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dogknot17@yahoo.co
2017 Bullpen
082528393E2F38787B4A0 wrote: I guess I'm okay with the fact that Hutchison got lit because (A) He's not very good and if you put him in the rotation you are just asking for trouble; and (B) I really think we need the lefty Brault in the 5 spot.
I can recall seasons when a ST "competition" was "won" by the pitcher who put up worse stats than the loser. I will be very surprised if Hutchison is not the 5th starter regardless of ST stats. The Liriano/McGwire, Ramirez deal was bad PR and a decision that Hutchison isn't good enough to be #5 will be more egg on the face for the FO that tried to say that deal was to acquire Hutchison rather than giving away prospects to get Toronto to pay Liriano's salary. Plus, the Pirates gave Hutchison 2 million this year. That's a lot for a AAA pitcher. I don't think anyone else has a chance.
I just don't think this is fair though. It seems to me that, if anything, this FO has shown a propensity to not give a rat's behind what public perception is. I don't think Hutchison is a lock by any means. My money's on Brault. Glasnow comes up whenever an inevitable injury happens.
Of course it's not fair. But they cared about the public's perception of the Liriano salary dump by insisting their primary goal was to obtain Hutchison (though few believed that). If NH wants us to believe he traded Liriano and 2 prospects because he wanted Hutchison so badly, having Hutchson lose out to an unproven pitcher would suggest that NH really overrated him. And overpaid him. I hope I'm wrong and that the best pitcher gets the #5 spot. But I suspect Hutchison has a scholarship.
No, that is how you are looking at it. Also how others who are so against the front office is looking at it too.
In order for Toronto to get the two prospects for Hutchison, they had to take Liriano. This was explained. It is just something that some don't believe. Like, they pick and choose what they want to believe so they are right in their own mind.
I can recall seasons when a ST "competition" was "won" by the pitcher who put up worse stats than the loser. I will be very surprised if Hutchison is not the 5th starter regardless of ST stats. The Liriano/McGwire, Ramirez deal was bad PR and a decision that Hutchison isn't good enough to be #5 will be more egg on the face for the FO that tried to say that deal was to acquire Hutchison rather than giving away prospects to get Toronto to pay Liriano's salary. Plus, the Pirates gave Hutchison 2 million this year. That's a lot for a AAA pitcher. I don't think anyone else has a chance.
I just don't think this is fair though. It seems to me that, if anything, this FO has shown a propensity to not give a rat's behind what public perception is. I don't think Hutchison is a lock by any means. My money's on Brault. Glasnow comes up whenever an inevitable injury happens.
Of course it's not fair. But they cared about the public's perception of the Liriano salary dump by insisting their primary goal was to obtain Hutchison (though few believed that). If NH wants us to believe he traded Liriano and 2 prospects because he wanted Hutchison so badly, having Hutchson lose out to an unproven pitcher would suggest that NH really overrated him. And overpaid him. I hope I'm wrong and that the best pitcher gets the #5 spot. But I suspect Hutchison has a scholarship.
No, that is how you are looking at it. Also how others who are so against the front office is looking at it too.
In order for Toronto to get the two prospects for Hutchison, they had to take Liriano. This was explained. It is just something that some don't believe. Like, they pick and choose what they want to believe so they are right in their own mind.
2017 Bullpen
2E252D2124253E7B7D0A332B2225256429254A0 wrote: I guess I'm okay with the fact that Hutchison got lit because (A) He's not very good and if you put him in the rotation you are just asking for trouble; and (B) I really think we need the lefty Brault in the 5 spot.
I can recall seasons when a ST "competition" was "won" by the pitcher who put up worse stats than the loser. I will be very surprised if Hutchison is not the 5th starter regardless of ST stats. The Liriano/McGwire, Ramirez deal was bad PR and a decision that Hutchison isn't good enough to be #5 will be more egg on the face for the FO that tried to say that deal was to acquire Hutchison rather than giving away prospects to get Toronto to pay Liriano's salary. Plus, the Pirates gave Hutchison 2 million this year. That's a lot for a AAA pitcher. I don't think anyone else has a chance.
I just don't think this is fair though. It seems to me that, if anything, this FO has shown a propensity to not give a rat's behind what public perception is. I don't think Hutchison is a lock by any means. My money's on Brault. Glasnow comes up whenever an inevitable injury happens.
Of course it's not fair. But they cared about the public's perception of the Liriano salary dump by insisting their primary goal was to obtain Hutchison (though few believed that). If NH wants us to believe he traded Liriano and 2 prospects because he wanted Hutchison so badly, having Hutchson lose out to an unproven pitcher would suggest that NH really overrated him. And overpaid him. I hope I'm wrong and that the best pitcher gets the #5 spot. But I suspect Hutchison has a scholarship.
No, that is how you are looking at it. Also how others who are so against the front office is looking at it too.
In order for Toronto to get the two prospects for Hutchison, they had to take Liriano. This was explained. It is just something that some don't believe. Like, they pick and choose what they want to believe so they are right in their own mind.
Dogknot is right in his statement. The Pirates could likely have gotten Hutchison for just McGuire or Ramierez. Since the Bucs wanted the Jays to take Liriano the Pirates had to throw in more.
I can recall seasons when a ST "competition" was "won" by the pitcher who put up worse stats than the loser. I will be very surprised if Hutchison is not the 5th starter regardless of ST stats. The Liriano/McGwire, Ramirez deal was bad PR and a decision that Hutchison isn't good enough to be #5 will be more egg on the face for the FO that tried to say that deal was to acquire Hutchison rather than giving away prospects to get Toronto to pay Liriano's salary. Plus, the Pirates gave Hutchison 2 million this year. That's a lot for a AAA pitcher. I don't think anyone else has a chance.
I just don't think this is fair though. It seems to me that, if anything, this FO has shown a propensity to not give a rat's behind what public perception is. I don't think Hutchison is a lock by any means. My money's on Brault. Glasnow comes up whenever an inevitable injury happens.
Of course it's not fair. But they cared about the public's perception of the Liriano salary dump by insisting their primary goal was to obtain Hutchison (though few believed that). If NH wants us to believe he traded Liriano and 2 prospects because he wanted Hutchison so badly, having Hutchson lose out to an unproven pitcher would suggest that NH really overrated him. And overpaid him. I hope I'm wrong and that the best pitcher gets the #5 spot. But I suspect Hutchison has a scholarship.
No, that is how you are looking at it. Also how others who are so against the front office is looking at it too.
In order for Toronto to get the two prospects for Hutchison, they had to take Liriano. This was explained. It is just something that some don't believe. Like, they pick and choose what they want to believe so they are right in their own mind.
Dogknot is right in his statement. The Pirates could likely have gotten Hutchison for just McGuire or Ramierez. Since the Bucs wanted the Jays to take Liriano the Pirates had to throw in more.