5E5F4455430304300 wrote: The only scenario I wouldnt support signing an impact FA 3bman is if there's a young prospect 3bman that is having playing time blocked by the signing.
Since I know from past experience money "saved" during a rebuild wont be applied to future years payroll for any "push", I see no reason to support the cutting of salary for the sake of itself during a rebuild.
Frankly, I'd support the org dumping 20 million $1 bills into PNC park and having a bonfire rather than "saving" by dropping the measley payroll lower than it already is.
(I'd much prefer the org openly give it to the city than burn it, but would rather rit be burned than "saved")
I agree. When I see comments about trading Harrison to save money (don't know if that is true or not) I wonder "why?". They already have a low payroll and if they don't take on any significant additional salary what is there to gain by dealing Harrison? He's one of their best players and a positive influence on the younger, low priced guys who will likely make up the roster. They don't award prizes to the teams that get their payroll the lowest.
I think Harrison could be dealt as he has value and wanted by other teams and the Pirates have Adam Frazier to take over 2B. And of course, they have Sean Rodriguez too.
So, it could be a combination of a salary dump and selling high with a replacement(s) in place.
Nah. That argument fails.
JHay would substantially improve 3b. So while you could make your case (I would disagree) Frazier is his ready replacement at 2nd...jHay doesn't need to be traded for Frazier to start at 2b.
Unless jHay returned a prospect 3bman, it would make the current team worse. If they're trying to win this year or next, I don't see alot of ways trading Jhay helps that to happen. If they're selling off, by all means
Why would we need to cut salary at all?
If trading Harrison can help the future, current team and the Pirates feel they have a replacement to play second base, why not trade him? How high are the Pirates on Frazier? What about Moroff, Newman, Kramer who all can make appearances very soon?
Others move would have to be made to make the team better. I agree losing Harrison for no current 2018 player would make the team worse. But that can be made up in other trades too (Cole, McCutchen).
Don't get me wrong, I want to keep everyone and add to the current team. I just don't see that happening. After they do sell some players, I hope they buy too.
How is trading JHay going to help the 2018 team? It would not help at all. They need someone to play 2nd and 3rd he is the best option at either position that is currently on the roster.
Bold.
McCutchen Harrison rumors
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McCutchen Harrison rumors
4249414D4849521711665F474E4949084549260 wrote: The only scenario I wouldnt support signing an impact FA 3bman is if there's a young prospect 3bman that is having playing time blocked by the signing.
Since I know from past experience money "saved" during a rebuild wont be applied to future years payroll for any "push", I see no reason to support the cutting of salary for the sake of itself during a rebuild.
Frankly, I'd support the org dumping 20 million $1 bills into PNC park and having a bonfire rather than "saving" by dropping the measley payroll lower than it already is.
(I'd much prefer the org openly give it to the city than burn it, but would rather rit be burned than "saved")
I agree. When I see comments about trading Harrison to save money (don't know if that is true or not) I wonder "why?". They already have a low payroll and if they don't take on any significant additional salary what is there to gain by dealing Harrison? He's one of their best players and a positive influence on the younger, low priced guys who will likely make up the roster. They don't award prizes to the teams that get their payroll the lowest.
I think Harrison could be dealt as he has value and wanted by other teams and the Pirates have Adam Frazier to take over 2B. And of course, they have Sean Rodriguez too.
So, it could be a combination of a salary dump and selling high with a replacement(s) in place.
Nah. That argument fails.
JHay would substantially improve 3b. So while you could make your case (I would disagree) Frazier is his ready replacement at 2nd...jHay doesn't need to be traded for Frazier to start at 2b.
Unless jHay returned a prospect 3bman, it would make the current team worse. If they're trying to win this year or next, I don't see alot of ways trading Jhay helps that to happen. If they're selling off, by all means
Why would we need to cut salary at all?
If trading Harrison can help the future, current team and the Pirates feel they have a replacement to play second base, why not trade him? How high are the Pirates on Frazier? What about Moroff, Newman, Kramer who all can make appearances very soon?
Others move would have to be made to make the team better. I agree losing Harrison for no current 2018 player would make the team worse. But that can be made up in other trades too (Cole, McCutchen).
Don't get me wrong, I want to keep everyone and add to the current team. I just don't see that happening. After they do sell some players, I hope they buy too.
Trading Harrison doesn't help current team. They get prospects back. They don't get a ready made MLB player back. What value does he get back in return from say Toronto, who is interested? Don't say Bichette or Guerrero.
Of course you want to keep everyone. You are a status quo type of person. However, you are more likely to get your wish as this organization ill probably keep most of them, if not all, but add nothing significant to help.
None of the guys you mention - Moroff, Frazier, Neuman ... play third and we have a serious void there. So ... it shouldn't matter how the organization views them relative to Harrison.
If the Pirates feel they have a replacement for Harrison at second base, they could trade him. The guys I mentioned are middle infielders. Its like the circle of baseball player life, especially in the small market world. When a younger player comes along, the older veteran gets moved. This is how Harrison got his second base job.
Yes, I do think they have a good team with a few upgrades. I believe the Marte and Kang situations deprived the team big time and they can (and could have in 2017) compete with them. I want to add a third baseman as good as Kang.
I don't know if the Pirates are planning Harrison as the full time third baseman. Right now, I think it is Freese and Rodriguez. I sure hope that changes.
If Harrison can help the future and they feel they have a replacement for Harrison, I can see him being traded. Other trades can help the 2018 Pirates or a free agent singing, which I know is rare.
LOL ... you continue to throw stuff out there that no one else would. The guys you mentioned AREN'T Harrison. They WON'T bring Harrison type play. They ARREN'T ready. If the move is Frazier, then trading Harrison is a SALARY DUMP.
The Pirates thinking is lame. They probably think Freese and "core player" Srod are the answers. That is why we are stuck with the roster we have and the situation we are in.
Moving Harrison only possibly helps the FUTURE. It doesn't help anything with the 2018 roster. Why? Because they will be settling for a less experienced player who isn't ready just because of cost AND they wouldn't reinvest the saved money on other pieces.
Stop with the 2017 thing with Kang and Marte. We weren't good when Marte first got run. He wasn't going to have a WAR of 10. You can't make the excuses of Kang. He is a disaster relative to his problems. Pittsburgh NEVER EVER should have thought he was coming back. THAT WAS THEIR OWN FAULT.
This offseason is going to be GROUNDHOG DAY.
Since I know from past experience money "saved" during a rebuild wont be applied to future years payroll for any "push", I see no reason to support the cutting of salary for the sake of itself during a rebuild.
Frankly, I'd support the org dumping 20 million $1 bills into PNC park and having a bonfire rather than "saving" by dropping the measley payroll lower than it already is.
(I'd much prefer the org openly give it to the city than burn it, but would rather rit be burned than "saved")
I agree. When I see comments about trading Harrison to save money (don't know if that is true or not) I wonder "why?". They already have a low payroll and if they don't take on any significant additional salary what is there to gain by dealing Harrison? He's one of their best players and a positive influence on the younger, low priced guys who will likely make up the roster. They don't award prizes to the teams that get their payroll the lowest.
I think Harrison could be dealt as he has value and wanted by other teams and the Pirates have Adam Frazier to take over 2B. And of course, they have Sean Rodriguez too.
So, it could be a combination of a salary dump and selling high with a replacement(s) in place.
Nah. That argument fails.
JHay would substantially improve 3b. So while you could make your case (I would disagree) Frazier is his ready replacement at 2nd...jHay doesn't need to be traded for Frazier to start at 2b.
Unless jHay returned a prospect 3bman, it would make the current team worse. If they're trying to win this year or next, I don't see alot of ways trading Jhay helps that to happen. If they're selling off, by all means
Why would we need to cut salary at all?
If trading Harrison can help the future, current team and the Pirates feel they have a replacement to play second base, why not trade him? How high are the Pirates on Frazier? What about Moroff, Newman, Kramer who all can make appearances very soon?
Others move would have to be made to make the team better. I agree losing Harrison for no current 2018 player would make the team worse. But that can be made up in other trades too (Cole, McCutchen).
Don't get me wrong, I want to keep everyone and add to the current team. I just don't see that happening. After they do sell some players, I hope they buy too.
Trading Harrison doesn't help current team. They get prospects back. They don't get a ready made MLB player back. What value does he get back in return from say Toronto, who is interested? Don't say Bichette or Guerrero.
Of course you want to keep everyone. You are a status quo type of person. However, you are more likely to get your wish as this organization ill probably keep most of them, if not all, but add nothing significant to help.
None of the guys you mention - Moroff, Frazier, Neuman ... play third and we have a serious void there. So ... it shouldn't matter how the organization views them relative to Harrison.
If the Pirates feel they have a replacement for Harrison at second base, they could trade him. The guys I mentioned are middle infielders. Its like the circle of baseball player life, especially in the small market world. When a younger player comes along, the older veteran gets moved. This is how Harrison got his second base job.
Yes, I do think they have a good team with a few upgrades. I believe the Marte and Kang situations deprived the team big time and they can (and could have in 2017) compete with them. I want to add a third baseman as good as Kang.
I don't know if the Pirates are planning Harrison as the full time third baseman. Right now, I think it is Freese and Rodriguez. I sure hope that changes.
If Harrison can help the future and they feel they have a replacement for Harrison, I can see him being traded. Other trades can help the 2018 Pirates or a free agent singing, which I know is rare.
LOL ... you continue to throw stuff out there that no one else would. The guys you mentioned AREN'T Harrison. They WON'T bring Harrison type play. They ARREN'T ready. If the move is Frazier, then trading Harrison is a SALARY DUMP.
The Pirates thinking is lame. They probably think Freese and "core player" Srod are the answers. That is why we are stuck with the roster we have and the situation we are in.
Moving Harrison only possibly helps the FUTURE. It doesn't help anything with the 2018 roster. Why? Because they will be settling for a less experienced player who isn't ready just because of cost AND they wouldn't reinvest the saved money on other pieces.
Stop with the 2017 thing with Kang and Marte. We weren't good when Marte first got run. He wasn't going to have a WAR of 10. You can't make the excuses of Kang. He is a disaster relative to his problems. Pittsburgh NEVER EVER should have thought he was coming back. THAT WAS THEIR OWN FAULT.
This offseason is going to be GROUNDHOG DAY.
McCutchen Harrison rumors
4D4C5746501017230 wrote: The only scenario I wouldnt support signing an impact FA 3bman is if there's a young prospect 3bman that is having playing time blocked by the signing.
Since I know from past experience money "saved" during a rebuild wont be applied to future years payroll for any "push", I see no reason to support the cutting of salary for the sake of itself during a rebuild.
Frankly, I'd support the org dumping 20 million $1 bills into PNC park and having a bonfire rather than "saving" by dropping the measley payroll lower than it already is.
(I'd much prefer the org openly give it to the city than burn it, but would rather rit be burned than "saved")
I agree. When I see comments about trading Harrison to save money (don't know if that is true or not) I wonder "why?". They already have a low payroll and if they don't take on any significant additional salary what is there to gain by dealing Harrison? He's one of their best players and a positive influence on the younger, low priced guys who will likely make up the roster. They don't award prizes to the teams that get their payroll the lowest.
I think Harrison could be dealt as he has value and wanted by other teams and the Pirates have Adam Frazier to take over 2B. And of course, they have Sean Rodriguez too.
So, it could be a combination of a salary dump and selling high with a replacement(s) in place.
Nah. That argument fails.
JHay would substantially improve 3b. So while you could make your case (I would disagree) Frazier is his ready replacement at 2nd...jHay doesn't need to be traded for Frazier to start at 2b.
Unless jHay returned a prospect 3bman, it would make the current team worse. If they're trying to win this year or next, I don't see alot of ways trading Jhay helps that to happen. If they're selling off, by all means
Why would we need to cut salary at all?
If trading Harrison can help the future, current team and the Pirates feel they have a replacement to play second base, why not trade him? How high are the Pirates on Frazier? What about Moroff, Newman, Kramer who all can make appearances very soon?
Others move would have to be made to make the team better. I agree losing Harrison for no current 2018 player would make the team worse. But that can be made up in other trades too (Cole, McCutchen).
Don't get me wrong, I want to keep everyone and add to the current team. I just don't see that happening. After they do sell some players, I hope they buy too.
How is trading JHay going to help the 2018 team? It would not help at all. They need someone to play 2nd and 3rd he is the best option at either position that is currently on the roster.
It doesn't. It's pretty simple.
Since I know from past experience money "saved" during a rebuild wont be applied to future years payroll for any "push", I see no reason to support the cutting of salary for the sake of itself during a rebuild.
Frankly, I'd support the org dumping 20 million $1 bills into PNC park and having a bonfire rather than "saving" by dropping the measley payroll lower than it already is.
(I'd much prefer the org openly give it to the city than burn it, but would rather rit be burned than "saved")
I agree. When I see comments about trading Harrison to save money (don't know if that is true or not) I wonder "why?". They already have a low payroll and if they don't take on any significant additional salary what is there to gain by dealing Harrison? He's one of their best players and a positive influence on the younger, low priced guys who will likely make up the roster. They don't award prizes to the teams that get their payroll the lowest.
I think Harrison could be dealt as he has value and wanted by other teams and the Pirates have Adam Frazier to take over 2B. And of course, they have Sean Rodriguez too.
So, it could be a combination of a salary dump and selling high with a replacement(s) in place.
Nah. That argument fails.
JHay would substantially improve 3b. So while you could make your case (I would disagree) Frazier is his ready replacement at 2nd...jHay doesn't need to be traded for Frazier to start at 2b.
Unless jHay returned a prospect 3bman, it would make the current team worse. If they're trying to win this year or next, I don't see alot of ways trading Jhay helps that to happen. If they're selling off, by all means
Why would we need to cut salary at all?
If trading Harrison can help the future, current team and the Pirates feel they have a replacement to play second base, why not trade him? How high are the Pirates on Frazier? What about Moroff, Newman, Kramer who all can make appearances very soon?
Others move would have to be made to make the team better. I agree losing Harrison for no current 2018 player would make the team worse. But that can be made up in other trades too (Cole, McCutchen).
Don't get me wrong, I want to keep everyone and add to the current team. I just don't see that happening. After they do sell some players, I hope they buy too.
How is trading JHay going to help the 2018 team? It would not help at all. They need someone to play 2nd and 3rd he is the best option at either position that is currently on the roster.
It doesn't. It's pretty simple.
McCutchen Harrison rumors
the argument just makes no sense. Trading any player at any time can benefit the future.
Anybody can put any name into the following sentence: "If trading ______ can help the future, current team, and the Pirates feel they have a replacement to play (position of player above), why not trade him? "
If you can trade a player an improve the future, improve the present, and save money you're going to trade the player every time. Maybe if the player has risque photos of the GM, he isn't traded. I don't get the point to that statement at all.
I'm not opposed to trading Harrison. I'm adamantly opposed to the Pirates cutting payroll from what it is currently. If they trade harrison and cutch and cole and gut the team, I still would prefer they go sign a couple FA's and keep payroll at the meager comparative level it is while the team is rebuilt.
Fold the money into paper boats and float them down the Ohio for all I care. DO NOT REDUCE THE PAYROLL because I know it will not be used. the margin will be pocketed, just like it was last time we rebuilt. And we're getting 50 million dollars first quarter 2018 all the more reason to stop this windfall profit taking
Anybody can put any name into the following sentence: "If trading ______ can help the future, current team, and the Pirates feel they have a replacement to play (position of player above), why not trade him? "
If you can trade a player an improve the future, improve the present, and save money you're going to trade the player every time. Maybe if the player has risque photos of the GM, he isn't traded. I don't get the point to that statement at all.
I'm not opposed to trading Harrison. I'm adamantly opposed to the Pirates cutting payroll from what it is currently. If they trade harrison and cutch and cole and gut the team, I still would prefer they go sign a couple FA's and keep payroll at the meager comparative level it is while the team is rebuilt.
Fold the money into paper boats and float them down the Ohio for all I care. DO NOT REDUCE THE PAYROLL because I know it will not be used. the margin will be pocketed, just like it was last time we rebuilt. And we're getting 50 million dollars first quarter 2018 all the more reason to stop this windfall profit taking
McCutchen Harrison rumors
242D25343A400 wrote: the argument just makes no sense. Trading any player at any time can benefit the future.
Anybody can put any name into the following sentence: "If trading ______ can help the future, current team, and the Pirates feel they have a replacement to play (position of player above), why not trade him? "
If you can trade a player an improve the future, improve the present, and save money you're going to trade the player every time. Maybe if the player has risque photos of the GM, he isn't traded. I don't get the point to that statement at all.
I'm not opposed to trading Harrison. I'm adamantly opposed to the Pirates cutting payroll from what it is currently. If they trade harrison and cutch and cole and gut the team, I still would prefer they go sign a couple FA's and keep payroll at the meager comparative level it is while the team is rebuilt.
Fold the money into paper boats and float them down the Ohio for all I care. DO NOT REDUCE THE PAYROLL because I know it will not be used. the margin will be pocketed, just like it was last time we rebuilt. And we're getting 50 million dollars first quarter 2018 all the more reason to stop this windfall profit taking
You know if they make those trades, they will feel there is no reason to re-invest that money in capable players. It's not in their MO to reinvest money on teams that can compete.
Anybody can put any name into the following sentence: "If trading ______ can help the future, current team, and the Pirates feel they have a replacement to play (position of player above), why not trade him? "
If you can trade a player an improve the future, improve the present, and save money you're going to trade the player every time. Maybe if the player has risque photos of the GM, he isn't traded. I don't get the point to that statement at all.
I'm not opposed to trading Harrison. I'm adamantly opposed to the Pirates cutting payroll from what it is currently. If they trade harrison and cutch and cole and gut the team, I still would prefer they go sign a couple FA's and keep payroll at the meager comparative level it is while the team is rebuilt.
Fold the money into paper boats and float them down the Ohio for all I care. DO NOT REDUCE THE PAYROLL because I know it will not be used. the margin will be pocketed, just like it was last time we rebuilt. And we're getting 50 million dollars first quarter 2018 all the more reason to stop this windfall profit taking
You know if they make those trades, they will feel there is no reason to re-invest that money in capable players. It's not in their MO to reinvest money on teams that can compete.