OnlyBucs

On his MLBNR interview going on as I type this, Shelty was asked if Davis would be catching?



We'll keep him in the OF.



I consider Hedges and Delay two of the top two or three catchers in the game......





Do the math.

I'll be nice. I think that was what he said, but I stopped listening immediately.



He might....might have said "league."



Still....

Shelton will day whatever he needs to say to support his boss to keep his job. Cherington hired Shelton although Shelton is obviously not capable of being a competent MLB manager. This is it for Shelton. He'll never get another managing job. Cherington signed Hedges for $5 million of tightwad Nutting's money. So Cherington has to pretend that signing Shelton and Hedges were good moves. And Shelton is happy to play along.

Spot on.



We're not being played for fools, at least on this board. The dog won't hunt anymore around here.



Out there? Maybe. Here? No way.



I just wish that it was Chris Russo who did the interview. He would've gone off on that.

SQOD, with the obligatory nickname:



"The tandem of Hedges & Delay, [highlight]defensively they are the best defensive tandem in baseball. It's by a wide margin.[/highlight] That's why we signed Hedgey. That's what we said out of Spring Training, making sure we were very defensive based at that position."

536671717A4371717A7D71140 wrote: SQOD, with the obligatory nickname:



"The tandem of Hedges & Delay, [highlight]defensively they are the best defensive tandem in baseball. It's by a wide margin.[/highlight] That's why we signed Hedgey. That's what we said out of Spring Training, making sure we were very defensive based at that position."
In catcher metrics, Hedges is first in the NL as being worth 6 runs above average due to framing. Delay is tied for 4th at 3 runs above average.



That's the good news. Another category rates runs above or below average based on the plays made. At the top is Gabriel Moreno (Az) at +10 and Realmuto (Phi) at +6. Hedges is 35th out of 45 catchers with a -2. Delay is 41st at -4. Their combined -6 makes them 1 run better than the SF tandem of Bart and Sabol. But Sabol splits his time between C and OF.



So while Shelton says they are the best defensive tandem in baseball by a wide margin, a case could be made that they are next to the worst defensive tandem by a narrow margin.



Catchers defensive stats.

I'd like to consider myself open-minded enough to consider a lot of factors to rate people in just about any profession, but I'm not sure that we can come up with metrics to consider every single aspect into the skill of baseball catchers.



Sometimes pitchers do what they're told by a catcher, only to see a ball leave the park. How much of that was the catchers fault? How much was the catcher's fault for perhaps a bad judgment?



Tags missed, passed balls, errors, catching pretty bad pitches that other catchers might not have....how much weight is placed on each of them.....I'm just not that wise.



I saw a website when I searched for "2023, MLB, catchers, caught stealing" and was admittedly so confused that I didn't bother to post the link.



And, to Shelton's point, this takes only defense into consideration. When I judge players, I judge all of their contributions by considering their offensive production and the defense.



I'll go along with your findings because I don't know any better.

I believe that Hedges leads either leads the league or maybe even all MLB in catchers interference.

132631313A0331313A3D31540 wrote: I'd like to consider myself open-minded enough to consider a lot of factors to rate people in just about any profession, but I'm not sure that we can come up with metrics to consider every single aspect into the skill of baseball catchers.



Sometimes pitchers do what they're told by a catcher, only to see a ball leave the park.  How much of that was the catchers fault?  How much was the catcher's fault for perhaps a bad judgment?



Tags missed, passed balls, errors, catching pretty bad pitches that other catchers might not have....how much weight is placed on each of them.....I'm just not that wise. 



I saw a website when I searched for "2023, MLB, catchers, caught stealing" and was admittedly so confused that I didn't bother to post the link.



And, to Shelton's point, this takes only defense into consideration.  When I judge players, I judge all of their contributions by considering their offensive production and the defense. 



I'll go along with your findings because I don't know any better.


I'm no expert on all these metrics either. It seems pretty abstract to me when they declare exactly how many runs someone is worth base on a math equation. In reality, runs are not determined by pencils. But what I tried to show is that Shelton can cherry pick 1 stat and say they are the best defensive tandem by a wide margin while another stat (that he somehow overlooked) suggests just the opposite. What I see from the eye test watching every game is that the catching situation leaves a lot to be desired. There are a lot of MLB catchers who don't rate as high as Hedges or Delay in pitch framing who I would rather have.

I think the knowledgeable fans and the players know who the finest are.  The players compete with them or are on their own team.



I have no idea what this site says or how guys rank, but here it is:  https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/leaderbo ... eam_only=1



I think that general managers and managers need to be the team's head cheerleaders.  Comes with the job.



Players don't look favorably upon when they're not spoken highly of in public....and, competitors are less likely to make offers for them.  It's part of The Game.



They don't want Homeless Hank to catch, so he's not catching.  That's all there is to it.