OnlyBucs

7275636B6572353940676D61696C2E636F6D000 wrote: That seems high. He got more than Solometo. Maybe they think Kellington will be a below slot deal?


He was also rated higher than Solometo, although they were close. Also had to buy him out of two sports, not just one.




Beginning 2016 I became the biggest critic of the FO that is possible.   I was ticked that they did nothing to make the 2015 team just a little bit better and furious about the off-season.  I believed the team had no intention to even try to be a WS team.



I was surprised when Ben and Williams were hired; why would they come here to ruin a career.  Maybe, just maybe Nutting, gave them a promise.  Still, I’ve been lukewarm until this draft - Ben impressed the heck out of me.  And suddenly there is a darn good farm system.  A few good players in Pittsburgh.  And I can start to see a plan coming together. 



I’m willing to treat next year as another throw away.  But by 2023 the Pirates will begin to look like a good MLB TEAM. Wild card outside chance.  But 2023 the plan will be coming together. 


I too am pleased with the draft picks and believe there is a plan.  Something I didn't see with NH the last several years of his tenure.  Another good draft next year and we should be well on our way to competing.  The concern I have right now is Shelton.  He does not look to be a manager of a good team.  Somehow he has to go or get a lot better real quick or we're not going to be a dominant team in the future.


I’m apparently in the minority, and I recognize he’s made some decisions that look bad, but I think he’s doing a pretty good job.  He’s kept this team tight and playing together.  He could easily have lost the club house, but we’re getting the most out of each player.  That’s what’s important to me right now.
I agree Shelton's made some bad decisions. Way too many in fact. But I disagree that he's done a good job. As far as keeping them tight and playing together, what other choice do they have? And fundamentally, they are consistently poor. The majority of his players are castoffs from other teams or just up from the minors and all have the incentive to make something of this chance for the sake of their own careers. I don't think there should be the threat of losing the clubhouse when most of his players are just glad they are getting this opportunity. Clubhouse issues are more likely to occur when a team underperforms and players start pointing fingers. Shelton's got a roster of guys who realize the won't contend but want to prove they belong in MLB. So I'm not going to give him credit for not having clubhouse issues. At least none that we know of.



And I don't know that he's getting the most out of each player. His best players spend too much time resting on the bench instead of being able to do more to help the team try to win games. Newman is hitting 100 points less than he did 2 years ago. And it seems whenever Shelton has a starting pitcher having a strong outing, he pulls him after 75 or so pitchers to put in struggling relievers. I wish there were only 1 or 2 things I could say I think Shelton has been poor at but unfortunately I think he has been bad in all facets of his job.

092429383F2E39797A4B0 wrote: That seems high. He got more than Solometo. Maybe they think Kellington will be a below slot deal?


He was also rated higher than Solometo, although they were close. Also had to buy him out of two sports, not just one.




Beginning 2016 I became the biggest critic of the FO that is possible.   I was ticked that they did nothing to make the 2015 team just a little bit better and furious about the off-season.  I believed the team had no intention to even try to be a WS team.



I was surprised when Ben and Williams were hired; why would they come here to ruin a career.  Maybe, just maybe Nutting, gave them a promise.  Still, I’ve been lukewarm until this draft - Ben impressed the heck out of me.  And suddenly there is a darn good farm system.  A few good players in Pittsburgh.  And I can start to see a plan coming together. 



I’m willing to treat next year as another throw away.  But by 2023 the Pirates will begin to look like a good MLB TEAM. Wild card outside chance.  But 2023 the plan will be coming together. 


I too am pleased with the draft picks and believe there is a plan.  Something I didn't see with NH the last several years of his tenure.  Another good draft next year and we should be well on our way to competing.  The concern I have right now is Shelton.  He does not look to be a manager of a good team.  Somehow he has to go or get a lot better real quick or we're not going to be a dominant team in the future.


I’m apparently in the minority, and I recognize he’s made some decisions that look bad, but I think he’s doing a pretty good job.  He’s kept this team tight and playing together.  He could easily have lost the club house, but we’re getting the most out of each player.  That’s what’s important to me right now.
I agree Shelton's made some bad decisions. Way too many in fact. But I disagree that he's done a good job. As far as keeping them tight and playing together, what other choice do they have? And fundamentally, they are consistently poor. The majority of his players are castoffs from other teams or just up from the minors and all have the incentive to make something of this chance for the sake of their own careers. I don't think there should be the threat of losing the clubhouse when most of his players are just glad they are getting this opportunity. Clubhouse issues are more likely to occur when a team underperforms and players start pointing fingers. Shelton's got a roster of guys who realize the won't contend but want to prove they belong in MLB. So I'm not going to give him credit for not having clubhouse issues. At least none that we know of.



And I don't know that he's getting the most out of each player. His best players spend too much time resting on the bench instead of being able to do more to help the team try to win games. Newman is hitting 100 points less than he did 2 years ago. And it seems whenever Shelton has a starting pitcher having a strong outing, he pulls him after 75 or so pitchers to put in struggling relievers. I wish there were only 1 or 2 things I could say I think Shelton has been poor at but unfortunately I think he has been bad in all facets of his job.     


Well, when you put it that way! ;D



I can't disagree with you on any of this, yet I tend to think there are other factors involved. For instance, I gotta think that BC is calling a lot of the shots on playing time. Show-casing and keeping them healthy for trade purposes is probably getting more consideration that the Pirates winning a WC this year. And regarding the tight clubhouse, I see what you're saying, but each of these guys have a lot at stake and only 8 can play at a time. Remember Kindle and Giles - they were part of a horrible clubhouse. Simply put, I put more stock into things like chemistry and puling together than most people.

535B586F795C7B741A0 wrote: So, by my count, here's where we're at:



Regardless...put all this together, and they're over slot by $100,200. Which also means they can spend an additional $619,500 over their allotted amount (at a 75% tax) without losing draft picks.



In other words, they have $2,241,200 to play with to sign White, Kellington, and Bishop. I assume those three are the priority. But hey...so far, so good.



Many, many thanks to this site for keeping things up to date. https://pirates.pittsburghbaseball.com/2021draft/


I think they have a little more ($125k) if you count Bishop and the $125k they can pay him before using up bonus pool.  But at this point, I think our most likely outcomes are that we get White, or we get Kellington and Bishop.  Given what they had to know going into day 2 of the draft about the bonuses to be paid to Solometo and Chandler, it doesn't seem possible they could have believed they would have enough to get White and Bishop.  I think Kellington's ask might have increased too complicating matters more.  I'll be happy to see all three signed and be absolutely wrong.


Difficulty is that with Kellington and White both being in the top ten, if they don't sign, they lose that bonus money. I actually think Kellington could be key here. He's a high school guy, so an underslot deal could be difficult. But, he was also the 386th best prospect according to BA. That would have put him in the 11th round or so. Hopefully, he'll sign for around $250,000. That would save around $320,000 off his slot value, and still be twice as much as he would have expected pre-draft.



He could always chance it and go to college, but that's a risk, too.



My guess...White signs for ~$1.5 million, Kellington for $300,000, Bishop for $500,000


I think your numbers are spot on. Hopefully we get all 3

4A4D5B535D4A0D01785F55595154165B5755380 wrote: That seems high. He got more than Solometo. Maybe they think Kellington will be a below slot deal?


He was also rated higher than Solometo, although they were close. Also had to buy him out of two sports, not just one.




Beginning 2016 I became the biggest critic of the FO that is possible.   I was ticked that they did nothing to make the 2015 team just a little bit better and furious about the off-season.  I believed the team had no intention to even try to be a WS team.



I was surprised when Ben and Williams were hired; why would they come here to ruin a career.  Maybe, just maybe Nutting, gave them a promise.  Still, I’ve been lukewarm until this draft - Ben impressed the heck out of me.  And suddenly there is a darn good farm system.  A few good players in Pittsburgh.  And I can start to see a plan coming together. 



I’m willing to treat next year as another throw away.  But by 2023 the Pirates will begin to look like a good MLB TEAM. Wild card outside chance.  But 2023 the plan will be coming together. 


I too am pleased with the draft picks and believe there is a plan.  Something I didn't see with NH the last several years of his tenure.  Another good draft next year and we should be well on our way to competing.  The concern I have right now is Shelton.  He does not look to be a manager of a good team.  Somehow he has to go or get a lot better real quick or we're not going to be a dominant team in the future.


I’m apparently in the minority, and I recognize he’s made some decisions that look bad, but I think he’s doing a pretty good job.  He’s kept this team tight and playing together.  He could easily have lost the club house, but we’re getting the most out of each player.  That’s what’s important to me right now.


You have a right to your opinion. However I couldn’t disagree more.

I think Shelton is perhaps our worst manager only above John Russell the zombie. Granted, he did not inherit much talent. But his game management has been awful

A lot of people used to complain about Hurdle. I would take Hurdle back in a heartbeat over this Shelton dude. Within 2 years Hurdle helped turn a perennial loser of 20 years into a contender. Had the front office given him even a modest upgrade at the trade deadline we may have had a World Series winner. He was also a huge presence in the Community.

Okay this seems to have gone a bit off topic so let's get back to what the thread is supposed to be about - Bubba Chandler signing is official and he apparently got $3M.

How good is the draft if they don't sign white?

I can not fathom a kid walking away from ~$1.5M.   So I gotta think he will sign.  But if he doesn’t, that will free up more than enough to ensure they sign Kellington and Bishop plus the few remaining in the 10-20 draft.



If White is the only piece missing, I gotta think the Pirates exceeded expectations (there were a few picks that were considered to be long shots to sign).  But I’m betting all three sign.

I'm seeing reports tonight that the Pirates and Lonnie White have agreed on a contract.

6B555A5A50595E5D505074594E533C0 wrote: I'm seeing reports tonight that the Pirates and Lonnie White have agreed on a contract.


Good news. Where are you seeing this?



Edit…NM. I’m seeing it in a couple of places, including from Whitr himself. Excellent news!

The Pittsburgh Post Gazette is reporting that he will sign on Monday

White informed Penn State that he has chosen baseball and will sign with the Pirates. The article said it was an over slot deal that included future educational support