775A57464150470704350 wrote: Glasnow won his fifth game today. Had 9 strikeouts,and gave up 2 runs.
It is okay with me to give up talent to get talent back.
It is poor management though if you misjudge the talent that you are giving up and the talent you are getting back.
Too early to say that is the case but trending in that direction.
I'm one of those who believes Glasnow was not going to succeed as a Pirate. But the question is 'why'? He was lights out in the minors, a disaster as a Pirate, and immediately resumed being lights out as soon as he went to TB. He seemed to have severe confidence issues with the Pirates. His pitches were too often not even close enough to the strike zone to tempt batters. And when he compensated by throwing strikes right down the middle, he got crushed and the batters who had walked scored. But it's an indictment of the Pirates that they were not able to bring out the ability that Glasnow showed immediately before and immediately after his time with the Pirates. This seems to be symptomatic of the Pirate organization that they have strongly hyped prospects who seem to fail to live up to expectations. But as soon as Glasnow went to a new team, all the talent the Pirates knew he had but never got to benefit from suddenly became the norm for him. And look at Polanco. he was hyped as a superior hitter and fielder. But as a Pirate, he's never hit better than .258 and has always been a liability in the OF. Newman was a #1 pick and the SS of the future. But now he's being groomed as a utility player. Bell is incapable of playing 1B at an acceptable level. Morton had to leave the Pirates to harness his talent. And where is #1 pick and catcher of the future Tony Sanchez? Selling cars maybe? What the heck is wrong in the Pirate organization?
my guess is that they are outsmarting themselves.
The Departed
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
-
Bobster21
The Departed
567071667060130 wrote: Glasnow won his fifth game today. Had 9 strikeouts,and gave up 2 runs.
It is okay with me to give up talent to get talent back.
It is poor management though if you misjudge the talent that you are giving up and the talent you are getting back.
Too early to say that is the case but trending in that direction.
I'm one of those who believes Glasnow was not going to succeed as a Pirate. But the question is 'why'? He was lights out in the minors, a disaster as a Pirate, and immediately resumed being lights out as soon as he went to TB. He seemed to have severe confidence issues with the Pirates. His pitches were too often not even close enough to the strike zone to tempt batters. And when he compensated by throwing strikes right down the middle, he got crushed and the batters who had walked scored. But it's an indictment of the Pirates that they were not able to bring out the ability that Glasnow showed immediately before and immediately after his time with the Pirates. This seems to be symptomatic of the Pirate organization that they have strongly hyped prospects who seem to fail to live up to expectations. But as soon as Glasnow went to a new team, all the talent the Pirates knew he had but never got to benefit from suddenly became the norm for him. And look at Polanco. he was hyped as a superior hitter and fielder. But as a Pirate, he's never hit better than .258 and has always been a liability in the OF. Newman was a #1 pick and the SS of the future. But now he's being groomed as a utility player. Bell is incapable of playing 1B at an acceptable level. Morton had to leave the Pirates to harness his talent. And where is #1 pick and catcher of the future Tony Sanchez? Selling cars maybe? What the heck is wrong in the Pirate organization?
my guess is that they are outsmarting themselves.
I believe you may be right. The Pirates seem to pride themselves on the use of analytics and modern thinking. But sometimes they get in their own way. For example, Hurdle seems to think he's a renaissance man for employing an NBA resting philosophy. But the physical demands of those 2 sports are extremely different and Hurdle often ends up resting key players in key games, especially when they just had or will have a day off. I suspect they utilize a lot of analytics and training philosophies in their player development. Yet, too often the players they develop lack the fundamentals and fail in the mental aspects of the game. It makes me wonder if there is too much emphasis on strategizing the players' development and not enough on just playing the game the right way.
It is okay with me to give up talent to get talent back.
It is poor management though if you misjudge the talent that you are giving up and the talent you are getting back.
Too early to say that is the case but trending in that direction.
I'm one of those who believes Glasnow was not going to succeed as a Pirate. But the question is 'why'? He was lights out in the minors, a disaster as a Pirate, and immediately resumed being lights out as soon as he went to TB. He seemed to have severe confidence issues with the Pirates. His pitches were too often not even close enough to the strike zone to tempt batters. And when he compensated by throwing strikes right down the middle, he got crushed and the batters who had walked scored. But it's an indictment of the Pirates that they were not able to bring out the ability that Glasnow showed immediately before and immediately after his time with the Pirates. This seems to be symptomatic of the Pirate organization that they have strongly hyped prospects who seem to fail to live up to expectations. But as soon as Glasnow went to a new team, all the talent the Pirates knew he had but never got to benefit from suddenly became the norm for him. And look at Polanco. he was hyped as a superior hitter and fielder. But as a Pirate, he's never hit better than .258 and has always been a liability in the OF. Newman was a #1 pick and the SS of the future. But now he's being groomed as a utility player. Bell is incapable of playing 1B at an acceptable level. Morton had to leave the Pirates to harness his talent. And where is #1 pick and catcher of the future Tony Sanchez? Selling cars maybe? What the heck is wrong in the Pirate organization?
my guess is that they are outsmarting themselves.
I believe you may be right. The Pirates seem to pride themselves on the use of analytics and modern thinking. But sometimes they get in their own way. For example, Hurdle seems to think he's a renaissance man for employing an NBA resting philosophy. But the physical demands of those 2 sports are extremely different and Hurdle often ends up resting key players in key games, especially when they just had or will have a day off. I suspect they utilize a lot of analytics and training philosophies in their player development. Yet, too often the players they develop lack the fundamentals and fail in the mental aspects of the game. It makes me wonder if there is too much emphasis on strategizing the players' development and not enough on just playing the game the right way.
-
DemDog
The Departed
7B565B4A4D5C4B0B08390 wrote: Glasnow won his fifth game today. Had 9 strikeouts,and gave up 2 runs.
It is okay with me to give up talent to get talent back.
It is poor management though if you misjudge the talent that you are giving up and the talent you are getting back.
Too early to say that is the case but trending in that direction.
I'm one of those who believes Glasnow was not going to succeed as a Pirate. But the question is 'why'? He was lights out in the minors, a disaster as a Pirate, and immediately resumed being lights out as soon as he went to TB. He seemed to have severe confidence issues with the Pirates. His pitches were too often not even close enough to the strike zone to tempt batters. And when he compensated by throwing strikes right down the middle, he got crushed and the batters who had walked scored. But it's an indictment of the Pirates that they were not able to bring out the ability that Glasnow showed immediately before and immediately after his time with the Pirates. This seems to be symptomatic of the Pirate organization that they have strongly hyped prospects who seem to fail to live up to expectations. But as soon as Glasnow went to a new team, all the talent the Pirates knew he had but never got to benefit from suddenly became the norm for him. And look at Polanco. he was hyped as a superior hitter and fielder. But as a Pirate, he's never hit better than .258 and has always been a liability in the OF. Newman was a #1 pick and the SS of the future. But now he's being groomed as a utility player. Bell is incapable of playing 1B at an acceptable level. Morton had to leave the Pirates to harness his talent. And where is #1 pick and catcher of the future Tony Sanchez? Selling cars maybe? What the heck is wrong in the Pirate organization?
my guess is that they are outsmarting themselves.
I believe you may be right. The Pirates seem to pride themselves on the use of analytics and modern thinking. But sometimes they get in their own way. For example, Hurdle seems to think he's a renaissance man for employing an NBA resting philosophy. But the physical demands of those 2 sports are extremely different and Hurdle often ends up resting key players in key games, especially when they just had or will have a day off. I suspect they utilize a lot of analytics and training philosophies in their player development. Yet, too often the players they develop lack the fundamentals and fail in the mental aspects of the game. It makes me wonder if there is too much emphasis on strategizing the players' development and not enough on just playing the game the right way.
When I was active in SCCA (Sports Car Club of America) road rally years ago I was told by a 2 time National Champion not keep it simple do not use 3rd level logic. As I look at it MLB and the Bucs seem to find new ways to use statistical analytics and modern thinking to scout and develop players it seems to me that they are using that 3rd level logic and not keeping things simple. The Bucs need to develop a pitcher based on his strengths and then try to help him develop another pitch that he can use to work off his strongest pitch. Such a case is Glasnow. As for hitters who gives a crap about launch angle etc. If the guy can hit let him refine that hitting ability to maximize his given talent. More HRs and more Ks do not compute in my book. I go for the guy who drives in runs. I hate it when I see a guy with 25 - 30 HRs and only 60 or so RBI's I wonder how many times that hitter made an out swinging for the fences when a simple flare might have scored a winning or tying run.
It is okay with me to give up talent to get talent back.
It is poor management though if you misjudge the talent that you are giving up and the talent you are getting back.
Too early to say that is the case but trending in that direction.
I'm one of those who believes Glasnow was not going to succeed as a Pirate. But the question is 'why'? He was lights out in the minors, a disaster as a Pirate, and immediately resumed being lights out as soon as he went to TB. He seemed to have severe confidence issues with the Pirates. His pitches were too often not even close enough to the strike zone to tempt batters. And when he compensated by throwing strikes right down the middle, he got crushed and the batters who had walked scored. But it's an indictment of the Pirates that they were not able to bring out the ability that Glasnow showed immediately before and immediately after his time with the Pirates. This seems to be symptomatic of the Pirate organization that they have strongly hyped prospects who seem to fail to live up to expectations. But as soon as Glasnow went to a new team, all the talent the Pirates knew he had but never got to benefit from suddenly became the norm for him. And look at Polanco. he was hyped as a superior hitter and fielder. But as a Pirate, he's never hit better than .258 and has always been a liability in the OF. Newman was a #1 pick and the SS of the future. But now he's being groomed as a utility player. Bell is incapable of playing 1B at an acceptable level. Morton had to leave the Pirates to harness his talent. And where is #1 pick and catcher of the future Tony Sanchez? Selling cars maybe? What the heck is wrong in the Pirate organization?
my guess is that they are outsmarting themselves.
I believe you may be right. The Pirates seem to pride themselves on the use of analytics and modern thinking. But sometimes they get in their own way. For example, Hurdle seems to think he's a renaissance man for employing an NBA resting philosophy. But the physical demands of those 2 sports are extremely different and Hurdle often ends up resting key players in key games, especially when they just had or will have a day off. I suspect they utilize a lot of analytics and training philosophies in their player development. Yet, too often the players they develop lack the fundamentals and fail in the mental aspects of the game. It makes me wonder if there is too much emphasis on strategizing the players' development and not enough on just playing the game the right way.
When I was active in SCCA (Sports Car Club of America) road rally years ago I was told by a 2 time National Champion not keep it simple do not use 3rd level logic. As I look at it MLB and the Bucs seem to find new ways to use statistical analytics and modern thinking to scout and develop players it seems to me that they are using that 3rd level logic and not keeping things simple. The Bucs need to develop a pitcher based on his strengths and then try to help him develop another pitch that he can use to work off his strongest pitch. Such a case is Glasnow. As for hitters who gives a crap about launch angle etc. If the guy can hit let him refine that hitting ability to maximize his given talent. More HRs and more Ks do not compute in my book. I go for the guy who drives in runs. I hate it when I see a guy with 25 - 30 HRs and only 60 or so RBI's I wonder how many times that hitter made an out swinging for the fences when a simple flare might have scored a winning or tying run.
-
fjk090852-7
- Posts: 3495
- Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2016 2:52 pm
The Departed
Glasnow has pitched 7 innings of shutout ball tonight. No walks 8 strikeouts and 3 hits. It is absolutely amazing, he has become the pitcher the Pirates expected. Is it a change of scenery, the instruction from a different coach, or finally has he developed the confidence which he did not have here ? I recall a couple games he pitched here, and he walked batters, and then they would steal second and even third base. He was a wreck with the Pirates.
-
Bobster21
The Departed
2A26277C757C74797E617B4C0 wrote: Glasnow has pitched 7 innings of shutout ball tonight. No walks 8 strikeouts and 3 hits. It is absolutely amazing, he has become the pitcher the Pirates expected. Is it a change of scenery, the instruction from a different coach, or finally has he developed the confidence which he did not have here ? I recall a couple games he pitched here, and he walked batters, and then they would steal second and even third base. He was a wreck with the Pirates.
He says it was mental. He says he now has confidence and trusts his stuff. Why our pitching guru coach couldn't straighten him out is the question. I watched some of his game last night. He was challenging batters with a high 90s FB right down the middle to start his counts. They weren't hitting it so he was consistently ahead in the count. He was generally around the plate even with his curve, which he was throwing for strikes. There were still several pitches that were wild high or wild outside but those were the exception; not the rule. With the Pirates, he was seldom anywhere near the plate. He looked afraid to throw anything close enough to the plate to get hit. He was consistently wild high and wild outside and batters took or missed what few strikes they saw and then walked. He didn't throw his curve for strikes and after he put men on base with walks, batters sat on his FB and hit it. He's confident now. He throws his FB and dares them to hit it, which gets him ahead in the count. He keeps them off balance with a curve he throws for strikes. It's a shame Searage could not get through to him to trust his stuff.
He says it was mental. He says he now has confidence and trusts his stuff. Why our pitching guru coach couldn't straighten him out is the question. I watched some of his game last night. He was challenging batters with a high 90s FB right down the middle to start his counts. They weren't hitting it so he was consistently ahead in the count. He was generally around the plate even with his curve, which he was throwing for strikes. There were still several pitches that were wild high or wild outside but those were the exception; not the rule. With the Pirates, he was seldom anywhere near the plate. He looked afraid to throw anything close enough to the plate to get hit. He was consistently wild high and wild outside and batters took or missed what few strikes they saw and then walked. He didn't throw his curve for strikes and after he put men on base with walks, batters sat on his FB and hit it. He's confident now. He throws his FB and dares them to hit it, which gets him ahead in the count. He keeps them off balance with a curve he throws for strikes. It's a shame Searage could not get through to him to trust his stuff.
The Departed
Robbie Grossman had an RBI against us today. Remind me, he was traded for whom? Wandy Rodriguez sticks in my mind.
-
fjk090852-7
- Posts: 3495
- Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2016 2:52 pm
The Departed
Max Moroff was designated for assignment by the Indians yesterday. He is out of options so if a team claims him he has to remain in the Majors.
-
fjk090852-7
- Posts: 3495
- Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2016 2:52 pm
The Departed
It is only a small sample size, , but Casey Sadler has pitched in 3 games for a total of 6 innings for Tampa and has not been scored upon.
-
Bobster21
The Departed
242829727B727A77706F75420 wrote: Max Moroff was designated for assignment by the Indians yesterday. He is out of options so if a team claims him he has to remain in the Majors.
It sure doesn't say much for Erik Gonzalez that the Indians accepted Moroff and Luplow (on the bench with 8 starts in 33 games) in exchange for Gonzalez and 2 pitchers.
It sure doesn't say much for Erik Gonzalez that the Indians accepted Moroff and Luplow (on the bench with 8 starts in 33 games) in exchange for Gonzalez and 2 pitchers.
-
Bobster21
The Departed
Luplow hit 2 HRs today for Cleveland. Good for him! He hasn't played much and those are his first HRs of the season.