Well, the pace of signings by other teams appears to be ramping up.
While some of the premier talent remains on the market, Harper, Machado, and Kimbrell, and to a lesser extent Kuechler (sp?), folks like Markakis, Brach, and even Oliver Perez are now flying off the shelves.
That said, little movement on most of the available SS's or even Harrison, but the ranks of Relief Pitchers and Very Suspect So Called Starting Pitchers is getting very thin.
I remain hopeful (not optimistic, but hopeful) that the team will sign Hechevaria, and bring in at one other pitcher to help out in the pen or be a starting pitching candidate. Like others, I am hoping that the trades for both Archer and Kela were done for a purpose. While I am generally down on the composition of the team at the present time, if Tallion, Williams and Archer all click, and Musgrove holds his own, the staring pitching could be good enough to give the team a chance if there is some other talent assembled around it.
A Second Slow Free Agent Offseason
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
A Second Slow Free Agent Offseason
I think there are more shortstops like Hech out there than there are jobs. I'm convinced the Pirates are simply waiting to see which one will sign for the amount they have decided they are willing to spend.
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fjk090852-7
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A Second Slow Free Agent Offseason
ATT Sports just did a show previewing Piratesfest tomorrow, and Neal Huntington was a guest for a segment, and he indicated if a trade or free agent situation could improve the team and it met their offer it could happen. I took it from his response they don’t want to bring a veteran player on board which would hinder the playing time of one of their prospects. He did not give any examples, but I am thinking if one of the free agent shortstops want a 2 or 3 year deal they are not going to get that deal from the Pirates with Newman possibly MLB ready, and Tucker on the horizon. That is just how interpreted his response. Just my opinion, I don’t think any roster additions will be made until ST commences.
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Bobster21
A Second Slow Free Agent Offseason
707C7D262F262E23243B21160 wrote: ATT Sports just did a show previewing Piratesfest tomorrow, and Neal Huntington was a guest for a segment, and he indicated if a trade or free agent situation could improve the team and it met their offer it could happen. I took it from his response they don’t want to bring a veteran player on board which would hinder the playing time of one of their prospects. He did not give any examples, but I am thinking if one of the free agent shortstops want a 2 or 3 year deal they are not going to get that deal from the Pirates with Newman possibly MLB ready, and Tucker on the horizon. That is just how interpreted his response. Just my opinion, I don’t think any roster additions will be made until ST commences.
I agree with that although as long as there was not a no trade clause, they could deal that shortstop a year later if Newman or Tucker was ready. What is harder to explain is their failure to upgrade over Brault as the LH reliever. Vazquez is reserved for the closer role so they actually need 2 other LH relievers. Brault is inadequate and the only other LHP they signed was Tyler Lyons, who was a combination of injured and ineffective last year until he was DFA'd. I'm sure there are a lot of LHPs who would improve the BP but the sticking point is the "met their offer" part.
I agree with that although as long as there was not a no trade clause, they could deal that shortstop a year later if Newman or Tucker was ready. What is harder to explain is their failure to upgrade over Brault as the LH reliever. Vazquez is reserved for the closer role so they actually need 2 other LH relievers. Brault is inadequate and the only other LHP they signed was Tyler Lyons, who was a combination of injured and ineffective last year until he was DFA'd. I'm sure there are a lot of LHPs who would improve the BP but the sticking point is the "met their offer" part.
A Second Slow Free Agent Offseason
when and where did Neal make the statement about goal to project a team that will get 78-82 wins?
Did he say this on the FAN? I was trying to find with google and couldn't.
Did he say this on the FAN? I was trying to find with google and couldn't.
A Second Slow Free Agent Offseason
406667706676050 wrote: when and where did Neal make the statement about goal to project a team that will get 78-82 wins?
Did he say this on the FAN? I was trying to find with google and couldn't.
I heard something slightly different. In several of his Sunday pre-game interviews on the FAN he said that their pre-season internal modeling projected the team at 78-82 wins. I don't remember him saying that was a goal.
Did he say this on the FAN? I was trying to find with google and couldn't.
I heard something slightly different. In several of his Sunday pre-game interviews on the FAN he said that their pre-season internal modeling projected the team at 78-82 wins. I don't remember him saying that was a goal.
A Second Slow Free Agent Offseason
50777C5F120 wrote: when and where did Neal make the statement about goal to project a team that will get 78-82 wins?
Did he say this on the FAN? I was trying to find with google and couldn't.
I heard something slightly different. In several of his Sunday pre-game interviews on the FAN he said that their pre-season internal modeling projected the team at 78-82 wins. I don't remember him saying that was a goal.
thanks, I thought I had read where that was the objective for off seasons year in and year out. Then if team over performed they would be possible serious contender.
Did he say this on the FAN? I was trying to find with google and couldn't.
I heard something slightly different. In several of his Sunday pre-game interviews on the FAN he said that their pre-season internal modeling projected the team at 78-82 wins. I don't remember him saying that was a goal.
thanks, I thought I had read where that was the objective for off seasons year in and year out. Then if team over performed they would be possible serious contender.
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UtahPirate
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- Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2016 10:36 pm
A Second Slow Free Agent Offseason
0439272A252F24062E39282E2F4B0 wrote: It seems like they are pained at the thought of moving payroll over 70 MM -- no way they offer any top free agent.
I would say that their payroll ceiling is more like $100M. the reason it's so low in 2019 is the number of pre-arb players occupying prominent roles on the team. It's a matter of timing, Taillon, Williams, Bell, Musgrove, Diaz and Frazier will all be arbitration eligible in 2020. If Taillon and Williams repeat 2018, they would be looking at very large raises.
I think this is how they are viewing things internally -- we have this good core that we are going to need to pay a lot more money to in the very near future.
But we have to start moving that $100 million up into the $120 to $130 range to be somewhat competitive. That's what they wouldn't do after 2015 when they had a real chance to improve a 98 win team. Somehow $100 - $105 is the absolute ceiling and we just won't budge past that.
You would think they learned their lesson in 15. Last year's team was pretty good and could be much better with just a couple of incremental additions.
I would say that their payroll ceiling is more like $100M. the reason it's so low in 2019 is the number of pre-arb players occupying prominent roles on the team. It's a matter of timing, Taillon, Williams, Bell, Musgrove, Diaz and Frazier will all be arbitration eligible in 2020. If Taillon and Williams repeat 2018, they would be looking at very large raises.
I think this is how they are viewing things internally -- we have this good core that we are going to need to pay a lot more money to in the very near future.
But we have to start moving that $100 million up into the $120 to $130 range to be somewhat competitive. That's what they wouldn't do after 2015 when they had a real chance to improve a 98 win team. Somehow $100 - $105 is the absolute ceiling and we just won't budge past that.
You would think they learned their lesson in 15. Last year's team was pretty good and could be much better with just a couple of incremental additions.
A Second Slow Free Agent Offseason
5776636A526B70637667020 wrote: It seems like they are pained at the thought of moving payroll over 70 MM -- no way they offer any top free agent.
I would say that their payroll ceiling is more like $100M. the reason it's so low in 2019 is the number of pre-arb players occupying prominent roles on the team. It's a matter of timing, Taillon, Williams, Bell, Musgrove, Diaz and Frazier will all be arbitration eligible in 2020. If Taillon and Williams repeat 2018, they would be looking at very large raises.
I think this is how they are viewing things internally -- we have this good core that we are going to need to pay a lot more money to in the very near future.
But we have to start moving that $100 million up into the $120 to $130 range to be somewhat competitive. That's what they wouldn't do after 2015 when they had a real chance to improve a 98 win team. Somehow $100 - $105 is the absolute ceiling and we just won't budge past that.
You would think they learned their lesson in 15. Last year's team was pretty good and could be much better with just a couple of incremental additions.
I may be too cynical but it is also easy to say that you have a great (and cheap) young core and then if they turn out to not be great it is the players fault.
The Astros didn't wait for Colin Moran to turn into a very good player. They found someone else to play third (just using him as an easy example).
The Indians decided that it was better to get Luplow than to keep Gonzalez as a back up. A question is whether the Indians evaluated him as a nothing more than a utility player (which sort of matches up with what they got for him in trade). It doesn't appear that a lot of teams where looking at Indians and saying that Gonzalez was a very good player blocked by great players.
We'll find out this season I guess. His 9 walks in 275 plate appearances are not evidence that he is going to be effective at the plate at all.
I would say that their payroll ceiling is more like $100M. the reason it's so low in 2019 is the number of pre-arb players occupying prominent roles on the team. It's a matter of timing, Taillon, Williams, Bell, Musgrove, Diaz and Frazier will all be arbitration eligible in 2020. If Taillon and Williams repeat 2018, they would be looking at very large raises.
I think this is how they are viewing things internally -- we have this good core that we are going to need to pay a lot more money to in the very near future.
But we have to start moving that $100 million up into the $120 to $130 range to be somewhat competitive. That's what they wouldn't do after 2015 when they had a real chance to improve a 98 win team. Somehow $100 - $105 is the absolute ceiling and we just won't budge past that.
You would think they learned their lesson in 15. Last year's team was pretty good and could be much better with just a couple of incremental additions.
I may be too cynical but it is also easy to say that you have a great (and cheap) young core and then if they turn out to not be great it is the players fault.
The Astros didn't wait for Colin Moran to turn into a very good player. They found someone else to play third (just using him as an easy example).
The Indians decided that it was better to get Luplow than to keep Gonzalez as a back up. A question is whether the Indians evaluated him as a nothing more than a utility player (which sort of matches up with what they got for him in trade). It doesn't appear that a lot of teams where looking at Indians and saying that Gonzalez was a very good player blocked by great players.
We'll find out this season I guess. His 9 walks in 275 plate appearances are not evidence that he is going to be effective at the plate at all.
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fjk090852-7
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A Second Slow Free Agent Offseason
Spring Training is about to begin and as it now appears the Pirates are not going to add to their team. After the July trade deadline when they acquired Archer and Kela, one would think they would be interested in adding a veteran shortstop , a true number #5 starting pitcher, or another player to add to their bench. As a longtime fan, I am disappointed that they have not done more this offseason to strengthen their team.