Colin Moran
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
Colin Moran
I have to admit, I'm fine with Moran's bat at this juncture. 16 HRs and 74 RBI or something like that might not be great numbers people envisioned, but those would be better than I initially thought he would get. Let's see what the second half says. His glove isn't good.
Colin Moran
525B53424C360 wrote: In 1969 rookie Richie Hebner hit .301 8 homers 47 rbi and 23 doubles. As of today Colin Moran is hitting.274 with 8 homers 37 rbi and 13 doubles. Moran is not hitting for the high batting average as did Hebner, but the other stats should be very comparable at seasons end.
moran is a replacement level player. He's doing the things he needs to do in order to succeed worse now than a month ago.
But sure. Somebody back in 1960 did something and that's all we need to know
He had a total of 34 MLB at bats going into this season. He is a bit old for a rookie at 25, but he basically had no major league experience. I think he is having a really solid season as he is figuring it all out. There is certainly lots of room for improvement.
If he was in his 3rd or 4th season in the majors I'd be ready to call him replacement level. Not at this point.
Solid season? He's replacement level now and what you're saying is that there's "certainly room for improvement"? His production is interchangable with a generic AAAA player!
If he gets better, you're right, he may not be replacement level. How much better does he have to get in order to be a good starter?
What do his minor league lines point to him doing?
Can we wait around for 3 years while a guy sucks for hopes that he justifies a trade? This isn't A ball. Best thing that could happen is for us to trade him so we don't waste a season on a backup at best trying to justify a trade. I fully expect we will not move on because of how he was acquired. If Moran was an internal guy, we would be moving or moving him to 1st where there may be some future if he can field it.
I do think there are signs that the FO gets it since they won't let him hit vs LHP and they've been playing Freese more often. They recognize the defensive incomptance.
I'm naively hoping they move on quickly.
Yep. Solid season. He is on pace for mid teens HRs and 70+ RBIs as a rookie. I'd say that is solid.
When you say "replacement level," do you mean in terms of WAR? What metric are you using? Because he is well above replacement level offensively in WAR. OTOH, his defensive WAR is negative and that negates his offense. As far as I'm concerned, WAR doesn't get this right. His defense is not so bad that it neutralizes his offense.
You are right that much of his minor league stats don't point to him being better. Except for last year. Something was different and demonstrated a new potential. With his "solid" offensive showing so far this year, there is certainly reason to think there is more in him.
And they don't have a better option at the moment.
My main point was that he is really early in his career. If this is his best year, let's move on. But it's his first full season and he certainly has the potential to put up better stats.
moran is a replacement level player. He's doing the things he needs to do in order to succeed worse now than a month ago.
But sure. Somebody back in 1960 did something and that's all we need to know
He had a total of 34 MLB at bats going into this season. He is a bit old for a rookie at 25, but he basically had no major league experience. I think he is having a really solid season as he is figuring it all out. There is certainly lots of room for improvement.
If he was in his 3rd or 4th season in the majors I'd be ready to call him replacement level. Not at this point.
Solid season? He's replacement level now and what you're saying is that there's "certainly room for improvement"? His production is interchangable with a generic AAAA player!
If he gets better, you're right, he may not be replacement level. How much better does he have to get in order to be a good starter?
What do his minor league lines point to him doing?
Can we wait around for 3 years while a guy sucks for hopes that he justifies a trade? This isn't A ball. Best thing that could happen is for us to trade him so we don't waste a season on a backup at best trying to justify a trade. I fully expect we will not move on because of how he was acquired. If Moran was an internal guy, we would be moving or moving him to 1st where there may be some future if he can field it.
I do think there are signs that the FO gets it since they won't let him hit vs LHP and they've been playing Freese more often. They recognize the defensive incomptance.
I'm naively hoping they move on quickly.
Yep. Solid season. He is on pace for mid teens HRs and 70+ RBIs as a rookie. I'd say that is solid.
When you say "replacement level," do you mean in terms of WAR? What metric are you using? Because he is well above replacement level offensively in WAR. OTOH, his defensive WAR is negative and that negates his offense. As far as I'm concerned, WAR doesn't get this right. His defense is not so bad that it neutralizes his offense.
You are right that much of his minor league stats don't point to him being better. Except for last year. Something was different and demonstrated a new potential. With his "solid" offensive showing so far this year, there is certainly reason to think there is more in him.
And they don't have a better option at the moment.
My main point was that he is really early in his career. If this is his best year, let's move on. But it's his first full season and he certainly has the potential to put up better stats.
-
DemDog
Colin Moran
Unfortunately some of us hoped for Moran to be another Brooks Robinson in the field and a Mike Schmidt at bat.
Colin Moran
4A5773717F1A0 wrote: In 1969 rookie Richie Hebner hit .301 8 homers 47 rbi and 23 doubles. As of today Colin Moran is hitting.274 with 8 homers 37 rbi and 13 doubles. Moran is not hitting for the high batting average as did Hebner, but the other stats should be very comparable at seasons end.
moran is a replacement level player. He's doing the things he needs to do in order to succeed worse now than a month ago.
But sure. Somebody back in 1960 did something and that's all we need to know
He had a total of 34 MLB at bats going into this season. He is a bit old for a rookie at 25, but he basically had no major league experience. I think he is having a really solid season as he is figuring it all out. There is certainly lots of room for improvement.
If he was in his 3rd or 4th season in the majors I'd be ready to call him replacement level. Not at this point.
Solid season? He's replacement level now and what you're saying is that there's "certainly room for improvement"? His production is interchangable with a generic AAAA player!
If he gets better, you're right, he may not be replacement level. How much better does he have to get in order to be a good starter?
What do his minor league lines point to him doing?
Can we wait around for 3 years while a guy sucks for hopes that he justifies a trade? This isn't A ball. Best thing that could happen is for us to trade him so we don't waste a season on a backup at best trying to justify a trade. I fully expect we will not move on because of how he was acquired. If Moran was an internal guy, we would be moving or moving him to 1st where there may be some future if he can field it.
I do think there are signs that the FO gets it since they won't let him hit vs LHP and they've been playing Freese more often. They recognize the defensive incomptance.
I'm naively hoping they move on quickly.
Yep. Solid season. He is on pace for mid teens HRs and 70+ RBIs as a rookie. I'd say that is solid.
When you say "replacement level," do you mean in terms of WAR? What metric are you using? Because he is well above replacement level offensively in WAR. OTOH, his defensive WAR is negative and that negates his offense. As far as I'm concerned, WAR doesn't get this right. His defense is not so bad that it neutralizes his offense.
You are right that much of his minor league stats don't point to him being better. Except for last year. Something was different and demonstrated a new potential. With his "solid" offensive showing so far this year, there is certainly reason to think there is more in him.
And they don't have a better option at the moment.
My main point was that he is really early in his career. If this is his best year, let's move on. But it's his first full season and he certainly has the potential to put up better stats.
His OPS+ is only 105. The glove is so bad that if he isn't putting up a 120+ OPS, he isn't valuable enough. The other parts of his game aren't good enough. Below average glove, way below average speed, below average range. Barely above average offense. I just don't see how he can improve enough to be an impact player. Kang would be much better both offensively and defensively. If they want to use Moran as a spot starter, pinch hitter fine. As any every day 3B he will be below average. Of course he will get a long look because of how he was acquired.
moran is a replacement level player. He's doing the things he needs to do in order to succeed worse now than a month ago.
But sure. Somebody back in 1960 did something and that's all we need to know
He had a total of 34 MLB at bats going into this season. He is a bit old for a rookie at 25, but he basically had no major league experience. I think he is having a really solid season as he is figuring it all out. There is certainly lots of room for improvement.
If he was in his 3rd or 4th season in the majors I'd be ready to call him replacement level. Not at this point.
Solid season? He's replacement level now and what you're saying is that there's "certainly room for improvement"? His production is interchangable with a generic AAAA player!
If he gets better, you're right, he may not be replacement level. How much better does he have to get in order to be a good starter?
What do his minor league lines point to him doing?
Can we wait around for 3 years while a guy sucks for hopes that he justifies a trade? This isn't A ball. Best thing that could happen is for us to trade him so we don't waste a season on a backup at best trying to justify a trade. I fully expect we will not move on because of how he was acquired. If Moran was an internal guy, we would be moving or moving him to 1st where there may be some future if he can field it.
I do think there are signs that the FO gets it since they won't let him hit vs LHP and they've been playing Freese more often. They recognize the defensive incomptance.
I'm naively hoping they move on quickly.
Yep. Solid season. He is on pace for mid teens HRs and 70+ RBIs as a rookie. I'd say that is solid.
When you say "replacement level," do you mean in terms of WAR? What metric are you using? Because he is well above replacement level offensively in WAR. OTOH, his defensive WAR is negative and that negates his offense. As far as I'm concerned, WAR doesn't get this right. His defense is not so bad that it neutralizes his offense.
You are right that much of his minor league stats don't point to him being better. Except for last year. Something was different and demonstrated a new potential. With his "solid" offensive showing so far this year, there is certainly reason to think there is more in him.
And they don't have a better option at the moment.
My main point was that he is really early in his career. If this is his best year, let's move on. But it's his first full season and he certainly has the potential to put up better stats.
His OPS+ is only 105. The glove is so bad that if he isn't putting up a 120+ OPS, he isn't valuable enough. The other parts of his game aren't good enough. Below average glove, way below average speed, below average range. Barely above average offense. I just don't see how he can improve enough to be an impact player. Kang would be much better both offensively and defensively. If they want to use Moran as a spot starter, pinch hitter fine. As any every day 3B he will be below average. Of course he will get a long look because of how he was acquired.
Colin Moran
14353D143F37500 wrote: Unfortunately some of us hoped for Moran to be another Brooks Robinson in the field and a Mike Schmidt at bat.
If he can bring a Schmidt bat, I have handle him having an Alvarez glove. Ok ... maybe not, but ...
If he can bring a Schmidt bat, I have handle him having an Alvarez glove. Ok ... maybe not, but ...
-
Bobster21
Colin Moran
I agree that it's too soon to say he's reached his ceiling as a hitter. But it's not a bad start for a rookie. On the other hand, his defense is very bad and he'll have to become a much better hitter to compensate for being so bad in the field. I suspect he's going to have a long career bouncing around multiple teams but probably not as a starting 3Bman for long. He probably already hits well enough to be a utility 1B/3B guy. If Kang returns and is productive both at bat and at 3B, Moran could be dealt. I know TBMTIB doesn't want to lose face in the Cole deal but if Musgrove, Jason Martin (currently .325 with 9 HRs in AA) and maybe Feliz pan out and they get something else for Moran, the Cole deal doesn't look awful, especially considering how mediocre he had become for 2 years before the trade.
-
UtahPirate
- Posts: 582
- Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2016 10:36 pm
Colin Moran
2019
Kang back at 3B bringing more pop and better defense
Moran replaces Feese with occasional starts at 1B/3B and LH bat off bench which is a role I think he would fit better
Pablo Reyes now super utility (putting up nice AAA numbers in the same role right now)
Newman/Kramer replace Mercer/Harrison at SS/2B improving middle defense with equivalent offensive #s
Kang back at 3B bringing more pop and better defense
Moran replaces Feese with occasional starts at 1B/3B and LH bat off bench which is a role I think he would fit better
Pablo Reyes now super utility (putting up nice AAA numbers in the same role right now)
Newman/Kramer replace Mercer/Harrison at SS/2B improving middle defense with equivalent offensive #s
Colin Moran
OPS+ isn't position adjusted. He's not hitting well. He plays 3b. Also, Hes platooning, so his numbers are inflated because he's being hidden from lefties. If he was a real everyday 3bman, he would have to face lefties. Otherwise what are we talking about here?
Imo as can be seen down thread, his hitting is all wrong for what he needs to be doing. Moran is choosing to not pull and hes too unatheltic to have opposite field power to turn the flyballs into center and LF into dingers. He can get in the weight room and turn that 6'3" 205 into 220? (The Elias Diaz method, perhaps?) Or he can start pulling the ball significantly more and duplicate what he did in AAA for a few months last year instead of what he's done in the minors the rest of his career (I.E. what he's doing now)
Freese is a better option right now. No doubt about that in my mind. Kang is on the near horizon (please). ke'bryan Hayes looks like a significantly better future prospect and has already hit well in AA. Moran doesn't need to be a part of this clubs future, as a 3bman anyway.
Imo as can be seen down thread, his hitting is all wrong for what he needs to be doing. Moran is choosing to not pull and hes too unatheltic to have opposite field power to turn the flyballs into center and LF into dingers. He can get in the weight room and turn that 6'3" 205 into 220? (The Elias Diaz method, perhaps?) Or he can start pulling the ball significantly more and duplicate what he did in AAA for a few months last year instead of what he's done in the minors the rest of his career (I.E. what he's doing now)
Freese is a better option right now. No doubt about that in my mind. Kang is on the near horizon (please). ke'bryan Hayes looks like a significantly better future prospect and has already hit well in AA. Moran doesn't need to be a part of this clubs future, as a 3bman anyway.
Colin Moran
48697C754D746F7C69781D0 wrote: 2019
Kang back at 3B bringing more pop and better defense
Moran replaces Feese with occasional starts at 1B/3B and LH bat off bench which is a role I think he would fit better
Pablo Reyes now super utility (putting up nice AAA numbers in the same role right now)
Newman/Kramer replace Mercer/Harrison at SS/2B improving middle defense with equivalent offensive #s
I'm in.
Kang back at 3B bringing more pop and better defense
Moran replaces Feese with occasional starts at 1B/3B and LH bat off bench which is a role I think he would fit better
Pablo Reyes now super utility (putting up nice AAA numbers in the same role right now)
Newman/Kramer replace Mercer/Harrison at SS/2B improving middle defense with equivalent offensive #s
I'm in.
-
DemDog
Colin Moran
dmetz,
You remind me a bit about an old time OBNer back in the days of Jack Wilson playing SS. He was in love with Abraham Nunez and made such a fuss about Noonie being the better guy. He got so intense that he was obnoxious and got banned for life.
So glad you are making your point with some facts and not being obnoxious. You do post about other facets of the Buccos. Not to worry I have not received and complaints about you. Just mentioning this cause you kinda make me laugh with your less that sterling ideas about Moran. What are you doing trying to make NH and the BMTIB look bad with what they got back for Cole? ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
You remind me a bit about an old time OBNer back in the days of Jack Wilson playing SS. He was in love with Abraham Nunez and made such a fuss about Noonie being the better guy. He got so intense that he was obnoxious and got banned for life.
So glad you are making your point with some facts and not being obnoxious. You do post about other facets of the Buccos. Not to worry I have not received and complaints about you. Just mentioning this cause you kinda make me laugh with your less that sterling ideas about Moran. What are you doing trying to make NH and the BMTIB look bad with what they got back for Cole? ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D