OnlyBucs

5E6C60607446656C61646B6C0D0 wrote: Tim Benz with a good turn of the phrase here:



If these alleged plans to improve the roster don't materialize, and players are subtracted once the wild card becomes out of reach, the chasm of distrust between the fan base and the front office will become even more vast.



http://triblive.com/sports/columnists/t ... irates-hed




I don't know how much I'd give to add right now:  .500 is still .500.  They'd have to go on a hell of a tear in the next several weeks for me to believe they're going anywhere other than mediocrity.  No trade we can make makes this team a legitimate threat IMHO.
I agree. This is not a team a player or 2 away from contending. Which is why it was foolish for NH to comment about adding players. Just another marketing ploy to make fans think the team is better than it is and on the verge of getting to the post season. Benz' point is well taken. They tell the fans they are (or might) do something and then they don't. They have lost all trust with the fans who are staying away in droves.

I mean I could see some edge tinkering but it was still the wrong thing to say (or at least a bad way of saying it).

This is not the year you sell the farm for rentals, but it's definitely a time were you could consider moving long term assets, for shorter term ones. Just about their entire pitching staff is in their pre-arb years, and they have Kingham and Keller ready, and soon to be ready respectively for a rotation spot.



I think they have some pitching depth to deal from, They have Cervelli and Dickerson for next year, I don't think selling them is a good idea.

6E5C50504476555C51545B5C3D0 wrote: Tim Benz with a good turn of the phrase here:



If these alleged plans to improve the roster don't materialize, and players are subtracted once the wild card becomes out of reach, the chasm of distrust between the fan base and the front office will become even more vast.



http://triblive.com/sports/columnists/t ... irates-hed




I don't know how much I'd give to add right now:  .500 is still .500.  They'd have to go on a hell of a tear in the next several weeks for me to believe they're going anywhere other than mediocrity.  No trade we can make makes this team a legitimate threat IMHO.






I agree with this in general, however, it seems like the Bucs could have afforded to get the reliever from KC (downside only a rental). If team didn't improve he could still have been moved later in the summer. There may be another reliever or two out there that would improve the team. Can't see them dealing for help anywhere but pitching.



I guess the question is whether NH is ready to throw in the towel if team doesn't win over the next couple of weeks (by win I mean at least go 9-7)

I’m not selling a lot of guys yet either. I know Jordy and JHay will probably be moved, but I would hold off on moving guys like Cervelli and Dickerson. Their pitching depth is decent with guys like Taillon,Williams, Kuhl, Musgrove, Glasnow,Kingham,Brault and a guy like Keller in the Minors. So there is depth there and an opportunity still for a lot of these young pitchers to all get good at the same time in the next few years. I just don’t trust this management team to do anything in terms of adding payroll if the team is in contention. Look at the move the Nats made yesterday trading away 4 mid level prospects for Herrera from the Royals. Why couldn’t the Pirates make a move like that?? He only costs 4 million dollars and they wouldn’t have had to give up much toget a guy like this. Not making moves like this is what turns fans off more and more.

4F7D71716557747D70757A7D1C0 wrote: Tim Benz with a good turn of the phrase here:



If these alleged plans to improve the roster don't materialize, and players are subtracted once the wild card becomes out of reach, the chasm of distrust between the fan base and the front office will become even more vast.



http://triblive.com/sports/columnists/t ... irates-hed




I don't know how much I'd give to add right now:  .500 is still .500.  They'd have to go on a hell of a tear in the next several weeks for me to believe they're going anywhere other than mediocrity.  No trade we can make makes this team a legitimate threat IMHO.




It’s funny that we were one game over .500 when Melancon was traded and the fanbase was mad because we didn’t go all in. I think this team is better than the previous two seasons, and the central isn’t as good.

I hope we win a few games and make a trade to get better.



If we fade, I would want a kings ransom for Dickerson

1C21263C2126480 wrote: Tim Benz with a good turn of the phrase here:



If these alleged plans to improve the roster don't materialize, and players are subtracted once the wild card becomes out of reach, the chasm of distrust between the fan base and the front office will become even more vast.



http://triblive.com/sports/columnists/t ... irates-hed




I don't know how much I'd give to add right now:  .500 is still .500.  They'd have to go on a hell of a tear in the next several weeks for me to believe they're going anywhere other than mediocrity.  No trade we can make makes this team a legitimate threat IMHO.




It’s funny that we were one game over .500 when Melancon was traded and the fanbase was mad because we didn’t go all in.  I think this team is better than the previous two seasons, and the central isn’t as good.

I hope we win a few games and make a trade to get better.



If we fade, I would want a kings ransom for Dickerson


I’m with you. This team is a decent bullpen away from being in or near first place.  Still real potential here IMHO.  But that only makes the Nats/KC trade sting all the more: exactly what we need at a Decent price.



Tim Benz is right: the Pirate FO is driving a wedge between itself and the fans that I’m not sure even winning will resolve.  When Neal makes pronouncements like Sunday 1) the fans don’t appreciate being blamed, and 2) they don’t believe Neal about additions.  Then when Neal doesn’t add, fans have a reason to think they were right in not believing.



I think a trade at this time would be “brilliant”. It’s still early, it would give the fans a different narrative and they can be sellers at the deadline if they are not contending. This is potentially a good team. If one or two core players would produce (Bell and Polanco and Tallion) it IS a good team.  Rebuild the bullpen and ideally add one high end starter and this team can contend.

605D5A405D5A340 wrote: Tim Benz with a good turn of the phrase here:



If these alleged plans to improve the roster don't materialize, and players are subtracted once the wild card becomes out of reach, the chasm of distrust between the fan base and the front office will become even more vast.



http://triblive.com/sports/columnists/t ... irates-hed




I don't know how much I'd give to add right now:  .500 is still .500.  They'd have to go on a hell of a tear in the next several weeks for me to believe they're going anywhere other than mediocrity.  No trade we can make makes this team a legitimate threat IMHO.




It’s funny that we were one game over .500 when Melancon was traded and the fanbase was mad because we didn’t go all in.  I think this team is better than the previous two seasons, and the central isn’t as good.

I hope we win a few games and make a trade to get better.



If we fade, I would want a kings ransom for Dickerson


I don't recall the fan base being mad at the Melancon trade. I was certainly mad at the Melancon trade and still am mad. I haven't spent a dime on the Pirates since that trade. In an industry based upon competition, you never give up when there remains a reasonable opportunity for a banner. I said that trade would have far-reaching impacts among the players and fans, and I believe it has. Nevertheless, at the time, most fans seemed to disagree with my opinion and argue that we needed to get something for Malancon. It was a loser mentality that made Bob Nutting grin.

There's four games that I can think of just off the top of my head that the bullpen blew that should have been wins.



May 20 vs. SD

May 27 vs. StL

May 31 vs. StL

June 11 vs Ariz



There's probably a half dozen more that easily could have gone in the W column (e.g. May 29 vs. the Cubs. Bucs were up 3-0 after 4, 4-2 after 5). You can't change the past, and the Bucs probably need to play .600 baseball the rest of the year to sniff a WC, but I also don't think this team is that bad. If the four games above were swapped, the Bucs are two games out in the central and would be in possession of the second WC spot.

Yeah, we're not that bad, but we're also not that good. I bet most teams can play the "what if" game with a few games to get their team into a playoff spot.