Very frustrating to continue to see Keller pitch one good start one bad start. The Pirates need him to be more consistent and figure some things out. Right now as we sit here today he is nowhere close to a top of the rotation type of pitcher.
Comparing him to Kip Wells as I saw someone did in another post I think is spot on. Keller has good stuff but he has no confidence in anything he throws and to be honest he just looks soft out there and just doesn’t have the look of a guy like a Gerrit Cole did for example that says when you see him pitch I’m gonna bring it each time and I wanna kick your ass. Until he can develop that sort of mentality as well he will continue to struggle.
Official Game Thread - 4/28 - Bucs vs Royals
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
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skinnyhorse
- Posts: 926
- Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2016 1:19 am
Official Game Thread - 4/28 - Bucs vs Royals
7B5C4D494C516E5A4D4C4C51280 wrote: Very frustrating to continue to see Keller pitch one good start one bad start. The Pirates need him to be more consistent and figure some things out. Right now as we sit here today he is nowhere close to a top of the rotation type of pitcher.
Comparing him to Kip Wells as I saw someone did in another post I think is spot on. Keller has good stuff but he has no confidence in anything he throws and to be honest he just looks soft out there and just doesn’t have the look of a guy like a Gerrit Cole did for example that says when you see him pitch I’m gonna bring it each time and I wanna kick your ass. Until he can develop that sort of mentality as well he will continue to struggle.
The problem is you can't fake it you have to be that guy and he's not that guy. He needs to learn how to pitch and you would have thought that's what his minor league years would have taught him some things. He doesn't have the stuff of a Glasnow, or Cole so he needs to learn how to pitch. Control the ball make it go where you want it to go. Just throwing a 96 mph won't get it done in the bigs. I don't see him ever as a top of the rotation pitcher. He's at best a #3.
Comparing him to Kip Wells as I saw someone did in another post I think is spot on. Keller has good stuff but he has no confidence in anything he throws and to be honest he just looks soft out there and just doesn’t have the look of a guy like a Gerrit Cole did for example that says when you see him pitch I’m gonna bring it each time and I wanna kick your ass. Until he can develop that sort of mentality as well he will continue to struggle.
The problem is you can't fake it you have to be that guy and he's not that guy. He needs to learn how to pitch and you would have thought that's what his minor league years would have taught him some things. He doesn't have the stuff of a Glasnow, or Cole so he needs to learn how to pitch. Control the ball make it go where you want it to go. Just throwing a 96 mph won't get it done in the bigs. I don't see him ever as a top of the rotation pitcher. He's at best a #3.
Official Game Thread - 4/28 - Bucs vs Royals
right now his potential is only top of the rotation starter. He isn't even pitching like a number 5 starter.
We should stop talking about him as potentially being a top of the rotation starter.
Let's see if he can pitch a season with an ERA under 4.50 first.
We should stop talking about him as potentially being a top of the rotation starter.
Let's see if he can pitch a season with an ERA under 4.50 first.
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bucs607179
- Posts: 1064
- Joined: Sat Apr 04, 2020 1:08 pm
Official Game Thread - 4/28 - Bucs vs Royals
If we were in NL East we'd be tied for first place.
April was an amazing month for our boys. Do not like the look of May's schedule.
April was an amazing month for our boys. Do not like the look of May's schedule.
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DemDog
Official Game Thread - 4/28 - Bucs vs Royals
2F382E3E7B7D7A7C7A744D0 wrote: If we were in NL East we'd be tied for first place.
April was an amazing month for our boys. Do not like the look of May's schedule.
The saying goes: April showers bring May flowers. In the Bucs case it is just the reverse. April flowers may bring May showers!
April was an amazing month for our boys. Do not like the look of May's schedule.
The saying goes: April showers bring May flowers. In the Bucs case it is just the reverse. April flowers may bring May showers!
Official Game Thread - 4/28 - Bucs vs Royals
A couple of thoughts about last night's game and the state of the Pirates:
1) Last night's game (unfortunately) was reminiscent of how the team was playing during its 1-6 start to the season: a starting pitcher who failed badly, several relievers being touched up for multiple runs, some poor defense (Diffo in RF, Frazier's failure on a 3-6-3, and Gonzalez trying to bare-hand ball that he didn't need to, et al), and a few too many failures at the plate. Gotta hope that this was just a short-term relapse and not a sign of what is to come.
2) Keller continues to disappoint. Hard to see how he rated so highly in numerous MLB top prospect polls. At present, things do not look good for counting on him being even a good MLB starter pitcher. That said, this is the year that the team needs to find out what he can do in a full season.
3) Watching Staumont close out the game for the Royals was impressive; 98 - 101 MPH fastballs combined with 80 MPH breaking balls. A momentary flash-back to watching Vasquez when he was at his best (his actions really hurt the redevelopment of the Pirates by eliminating the player who would have yielded the most in a trade).
4) The Pirates can field an entire starting line-up of players who have played 3rd in at least one major league game: T. Frazier, A. Frazier, Gonzalez, Hayes, Moran, Newman, Diffo, and Evans.
5) I am hoping that the Bucs keep Hayes on the DL until he is fully ready to return. In year's past, their decision to rush Aramis Ramirez back too soon really hurt his quality of play.
6) Diffo has had a few big hits, but he should not be starting any more games in the outfield. With the versatility of so many Pirate players, he appears to be the logical choice to send down when Hayes does return. Conversely, Evans has generally looked good in the OF, his misplay of the soft fly ball that he lost in the sun excepted.
7) Two of this year's starting pitchers have been lost to injury; Brault and Kuhl. At least one if not two others appear to be tettering on the edge of losing out because of effectiveness; Keller and even Cahill. Perhaps Yajure and Cahill can help out, but the Bucs also may want to consider further stretching out Holmes to see if he could again be a starter.
8) Hoping that Feliz does not recover too quickly. I understand not using Oviedo in a game (at least hopefully not using him), but trying to carry two pitchers who are slated for mop-up duty puts a real strain on the remainder of the staff.
9) Two off days in one week seems a bit excessive.
10) .500 after 24 games. Much better than anyone could have expected. I really enjoyed watching Tuesday night's win and anxiously looked forward to watching Wednesday night's game, only to be disappointed in the overall quality of play. I have to remember to temper my expectations.
1) Last night's game (unfortunately) was reminiscent of how the team was playing during its 1-6 start to the season: a starting pitcher who failed badly, several relievers being touched up for multiple runs, some poor defense (Diffo in RF, Frazier's failure on a 3-6-3, and Gonzalez trying to bare-hand ball that he didn't need to, et al), and a few too many failures at the plate. Gotta hope that this was just a short-term relapse and not a sign of what is to come.
2) Keller continues to disappoint. Hard to see how he rated so highly in numerous MLB top prospect polls. At present, things do not look good for counting on him being even a good MLB starter pitcher. That said, this is the year that the team needs to find out what he can do in a full season.
3) Watching Staumont close out the game for the Royals was impressive; 98 - 101 MPH fastballs combined with 80 MPH breaking balls. A momentary flash-back to watching Vasquez when he was at his best (his actions really hurt the redevelopment of the Pirates by eliminating the player who would have yielded the most in a trade).
4) The Pirates can field an entire starting line-up of players who have played 3rd in at least one major league game: T. Frazier, A. Frazier, Gonzalez, Hayes, Moran, Newman, Diffo, and Evans.
5) I am hoping that the Bucs keep Hayes on the DL until he is fully ready to return. In year's past, their decision to rush Aramis Ramirez back too soon really hurt his quality of play.
6) Diffo has had a few big hits, but he should not be starting any more games in the outfield. With the versatility of so many Pirate players, he appears to be the logical choice to send down when Hayes does return. Conversely, Evans has generally looked good in the OF, his misplay of the soft fly ball that he lost in the sun excepted.
7) Two of this year's starting pitchers have been lost to injury; Brault and Kuhl. At least one if not two others appear to be tettering on the edge of losing out because of effectiveness; Keller and even Cahill. Perhaps Yajure and Cahill can help out, but the Bucs also may want to consider further stretching out Holmes to see if he could again be a starter.
8) Hoping that Feliz does not recover too quickly. I understand not using Oviedo in a game (at least hopefully not using him), but trying to carry two pitchers who are slated for mop-up duty puts a real strain on the remainder of the staff.
9) Two off days in one week seems a bit excessive.
10) .500 after 24 games. Much better than anyone could have expected. I really enjoyed watching Tuesday night's win and anxiously looked forward to watching Wednesday night's game, only to be disappointed in the overall quality of play. I have to remember to temper my expectations.
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rucker59@gmail.com
Official Game Thread - 4/28 - Bucs vs Royals
765A52555E794E58483B0 wrote: A couple of thoughts about last night's game and the state of the Pirates:
1) Last night's game (unfortunately) was reminiscent of how the team was playing during its 1-6 start to the season: a starting pitcher who failed badly, several relievers being touched up for multiple runs, some poor defense (Diffo in RF, Frazier's failure on a 3-6-3, and Gonzalez trying to bare-hand ball that he didn't need to, et al), and a few too many failures at the plate. Gotta hope that this was just a short-term relapse and not a sign of what is to come.
2) Keller continues to disappoint. Hard to see how he rated so highly in numerous MLB top prospect polls. At present, things do not look good for counting on him being even a good MLB starter pitcher. That said, this is the year that the team needs to find out what he can do in a full season.
3) Watching Staumont close out the game for the Royals was impressive; 98 - 101 MPH fastballs combined with 80 MPH breaking balls. A momentary flash-back to watching Vasquez when he was at his best (his actions really hurt the redevelopment of the Pirates by eliminating the player who would have yielded the most in a trade).
4) The Pirates can field an entire starting line-up of players who have played 3rd in at least one major league game: T. Frazier, A. Frazier, Gonzalez, Hayes, Moran, Newman, Diffo, and Evans.
5) I am hoping that the Bucs keep Hayes on the DL until he is fully ready to return. In year's past, their decision to rush Aramis Ramirez back too soon really hurt his quality of play.
6) Diffo has had a few big hits, but he should not be starting any more games in the outfield. With the versatility of so many Pirate players, he appears to be the logical choice to send down when Hayes does return. Conversely, Evans has generally looked good in the OF, his misplay of the soft fly ball that he lost in the sun excepted.
7) Two of this year's starting pitchers have been lost to injury; Brault and Kuhl. At least one if not two others appear to be tettering on the edge of losing out because of effectiveness; Keller and even Cahill. Perhaps Yajure and Cahill can help out, but the Bucs also may want to consider further stretching out Holmes to see if he could again be a starter.
8) Hoping that Feliz does not recover too quickly. I understand not using Oviedo in a game (at least hopefully not using him), but trying to carry two pitchers who are slated for mop-up duty puts a real strain on the remainder of the staff.
9) Two off days in one week seems a bit excessive.
10) .500 after 24 games. Much better than anyone could have expected. I really enjoyed watching Tuesday night's win and anxiously looked forward to watching Wednesday night's game, only to be disappointed in the overall quality of play. I have to remember to temper my expectations.
Regarding 7,9 and 10:
7) Agree with you, especially about Holmes moving to the rotation. I’ve always liked Holmes.
9) two days off....don’t know what to do with myself!!!
10) I’m really torn. I like this team and am cheering like crazy. But next years draft is supposedly much stronger at the top than this year. I really want that #1 slot.
1) Last night's game (unfortunately) was reminiscent of how the team was playing during its 1-6 start to the season: a starting pitcher who failed badly, several relievers being touched up for multiple runs, some poor defense (Diffo in RF, Frazier's failure on a 3-6-3, and Gonzalez trying to bare-hand ball that he didn't need to, et al), and a few too many failures at the plate. Gotta hope that this was just a short-term relapse and not a sign of what is to come.
2) Keller continues to disappoint. Hard to see how he rated so highly in numerous MLB top prospect polls. At present, things do not look good for counting on him being even a good MLB starter pitcher. That said, this is the year that the team needs to find out what he can do in a full season.
3) Watching Staumont close out the game for the Royals was impressive; 98 - 101 MPH fastballs combined with 80 MPH breaking balls. A momentary flash-back to watching Vasquez when he was at his best (his actions really hurt the redevelopment of the Pirates by eliminating the player who would have yielded the most in a trade).
4) The Pirates can field an entire starting line-up of players who have played 3rd in at least one major league game: T. Frazier, A. Frazier, Gonzalez, Hayes, Moran, Newman, Diffo, and Evans.
5) I am hoping that the Bucs keep Hayes on the DL until he is fully ready to return. In year's past, their decision to rush Aramis Ramirez back too soon really hurt his quality of play.
6) Diffo has had a few big hits, but he should not be starting any more games in the outfield. With the versatility of so many Pirate players, he appears to be the logical choice to send down when Hayes does return. Conversely, Evans has generally looked good in the OF, his misplay of the soft fly ball that he lost in the sun excepted.
7) Two of this year's starting pitchers have been lost to injury; Brault and Kuhl. At least one if not two others appear to be tettering on the edge of losing out because of effectiveness; Keller and even Cahill. Perhaps Yajure and Cahill can help out, but the Bucs also may want to consider further stretching out Holmes to see if he could again be a starter.
8) Hoping that Feliz does not recover too quickly. I understand not using Oviedo in a game (at least hopefully not using him), but trying to carry two pitchers who are slated for mop-up duty puts a real strain on the remainder of the staff.
9) Two off days in one week seems a bit excessive.
10) .500 after 24 games. Much better than anyone could have expected. I really enjoyed watching Tuesday night's win and anxiously looked forward to watching Wednesday night's game, only to be disappointed in the overall quality of play. I have to remember to temper my expectations.
Regarding 7,9 and 10:
7) Agree with you, especially about Holmes moving to the rotation. I’ve always liked Holmes.
9) two days off....don’t know what to do with myself!!!
10) I’m really torn. I like this team and am cheering like crazy. But next years draft is supposedly much stronger at the top than this year. I really want that #1 slot.
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DemDog
Official Game Thread - 4/28 - Bucs vs Royals
2C2B3D353B2C6B671E39333F3732703D31335E0 wrote: A couple of thoughts about last night's game and the state of the Pirates:
1) Last night's game (unfortunately) was reminiscent of how the team was playing during its 1-6 start to the season: a starting pitcher who failed badly, several relievers being touched up for multiple runs, some poor defense (Diffo in RF, Frazier's failure on a 3-6-3, and Gonzalez trying to bare-hand ball that he didn't need to, et al), and a few too many failures at the plate. Gotta hope that this was just a short-term relapse and not a sign of what is to come.
2) Keller continues to disappoint. Hard to see how he rated so highly in numerous MLB top prospect polls. At present, things do not look good for counting on him being even a good MLB starter pitcher. That said, this is the year that the team needs to find out what he can do in a full season.
3) Watching Staumont close out the game for the Royals was impressive; 98 - 101 MPH fastballs combined with 80 MPH breaking balls. A momentary flash-back to watching Vasquez when he was at his best (his actions really hurt the redevelopment of the Pirates by eliminating the player who would have yielded the most in a trade).
4) The Pirates can field an entire starting line-up of players who have played 3rd in at least one major league game: T. Frazier, A. Frazier, Gonzalez, Hayes, Moran, Newman, Diffo, and Evans.
5) I am hoping that the Bucs keep Hayes on the DL until he is fully ready to return. In years past, their decision to rush Aramis Ramirez back too soon really hurt his quality of play.
6) Diffo has had a few big hits, but he should not be starting any more games in the outfield. With the versatility of so many Pirate players, he appears to be the logical choice to send down when Hayes does return. Conversely, Evans has generally looked good in the OF, his misplay of the soft fly ball that he lost in the sun excepted.
7) Two of this year's starting pitchers have been lost to injury; Brault and Kuhl. At least one if not two others appear to be tettering on the edge of losing out because of effectiveness; Keller and even Cahill. Perhaps Yajure and Cahill can help out, but the Bucs also may want to consider further stretching out Holmes to see if he could again be a starter.
8) Hoping that Feliz does not recover too quickly. I understand not using Oviedo in a game (at least hopefully not using him), but trying to carry two pitchers who are slated for mop-up duty puts a real strain on the remainder of the staff.
9) Two off days in one week seems a bit excessive.
10) .500 after 24 games. Much better than anyone could have expected. I really enjoyed watching Tuesday night's win and anxiously looked forward to watching Wednesday night's game, only to be disappointed in the overall quality of play. I have to remember to temper my expectations.
Regarding 7,9 and 10:
7) Agree with you, especially about Holmes moving to the rotation. I’ve always liked Holmes.
9) two days off....don’t know what to do with myself!!!
10) I’m really torn. I like this team and am cheering like crazy. But next years draft is supposedly much stronger at the top than this year. I really want that #1 slot.
Let's not be too greedy about next year's draft. If it is much better than this one then I think if the Bucs are in the top 5 or so slots that they will be just fine.
1) Last night's game (unfortunately) was reminiscent of how the team was playing during its 1-6 start to the season: a starting pitcher who failed badly, several relievers being touched up for multiple runs, some poor defense (Diffo in RF, Frazier's failure on a 3-6-3, and Gonzalez trying to bare-hand ball that he didn't need to, et al), and a few too many failures at the plate. Gotta hope that this was just a short-term relapse and not a sign of what is to come.
2) Keller continues to disappoint. Hard to see how he rated so highly in numerous MLB top prospect polls. At present, things do not look good for counting on him being even a good MLB starter pitcher. That said, this is the year that the team needs to find out what he can do in a full season.
3) Watching Staumont close out the game for the Royals was impressive; 98 - 101 MPH fastballs combined with 80 MPH breaking balls. A momentary flash-back to watching Vasquez when he was at his best (his actions really hurt the redevelopment of the Pirates by eliminating the player who would have yielded the most in a trade).
4) The Pirates can field an entire starting line-up of players who have played 3rd in at least one major league game: T. Frazier, A. Frazier, Gonzalez, Hayes, Moran, Newman, Diffo, and Evans.
5) I am hoping that the Bucs keep Hayes on the DL until he is fully ready to return. In years past, their decision to rush Aramis Ramirez back too soon really hurt his quality of play.
6) Diffo has had a few big hits, but he should not be starting any more games in the outfield. With the versatility of so many Pirate players, he appears to be the logical choice to send down when Hayes does return. Conversely, Evans has generally looked good in the OF, his misplay of the soft fly ball that he lost in the sun excepted.
7) Two of this year's starting pitchers have been lost to injury; Brault and Kuhl. At least one if not two others appear to be tettering on the edge of losing out because of effectiveness; Keller and even Cahill. Perhaps Yajure and Cahill can help out, but the Bucs also may want to consider further stretching out Holmes to see if he could again be a starter.
8) Hoping that Feliz does not recover too quickly. I understand not using Oviedo in a game (at least hopefully not using him), but trying to carry two pitchers who are slated for mop-up duty puts a real strain on the remainder of the staff.
9) Two off days in one week seems a bit excessive.
10) .500 after 24 games. Much better than anyone could have expected. I really enjoyed watching Tuesday night's win and anxiously looked forward to watching Wednesday night's game, only to be disappointed in the overall quality of play. I have to remember to temper my expectations.
Regarding 7,9 and 10:
7) Agree with you, especially about Holmes moving to the rotation. I’ve always liked Holmes.
9) two days off....don’t know what to do with myself!!!
10) I’m really torn. I like this team and am cheering like crazy. But next years draft is supposedly much stronger at the top than this year. I really want that #1 slot.
Let's not be too greedy about next year's draft. If it is much better than this one then I think if the Bucs are in the top 5 or so slots that they will be just fine.