OnlyBucs

110C282A24410 wrote: I would rush to my keyboard to commend Cherington if he acquired either Puig or Pillar.


A man your age shouldn't be rushing anywhere.


I support signing Puig and here's why.



I want this team to lose and lose bad this year.  Puig is a clubhouse cancer.  He can completely destroy a team while putting up great numbers (if healthy).  So, he will have a great first half and then we can trade him.  Meanwhile the team will suck.  Perfect scenario.




I kind of agree. This team is going to be terrible. Clubhouse cancer can’t kill it too much.



I’d bring in Puig because he’s proven once to have late July trade value.

I admit to having doubts about Puig fitting in when he was traded away from the bright lights of LA to Cleveland. But I didn't hear any clubhouse problems from him there.



Sometimes people change as they get older.

445F52535A5659370 wrote: I would rush to my keyboard to commend Cherington if he acquired either Puig or Pillar.


A man your age shouldn't be rushing anywhere.


I support signing Puig and here's why.



I want this team to lose and lose bad this year.  Puig is a clubhouse cancer.  He can completely destroy a team while putting up great numbers (if healthy).  So, he will have a great first half and then we can trade him.  Meanwhile the team will suck.  Perfect scenario.
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I am all for signing Puig or any other major league ball player rather than kicking the can down the road and blubbering about a future that never arrives in Pittsburgh,




I'm not sure what you mean by this. The Pirates aren't competitive this year and signing Puig or 3 others like him isn't going to change that. The drive for 80 wins is foolishness. The pattern that is successful in MLB is to stock the farm system and hope it comes to fruition. The Pirates had success doing that. They got away from that model when they wanted MLB ready guys. This new regime should be given every chance to do the same. They went and hired development and scouting pieces in the FO and management. Then they started acquiring high upside, low level prospects. They are doing the right things to win with the constraints they have.



Wanting/expecting to win this year or next with the state of the MLB team and high minors prospects is ignoring reality. They have some pieces, but not enough to get to the playoffs.

Instead of worrying about who we are going to "build around" 10 years from now and this suspect or that suspect, we need to be more like the Brewers and the Reds. Instead of philosophizing about it, go out and improve the club incrementally right now.

Puig is misunderstood. I kid ... he is a talented dude and is worth a shot. If he bombs, then you dump him. If he thrives, you trade him for more 19 year olds that won't be in the majors for five years. Fact is, this roster absent six players sucks. We need some flair.

2C373A3B323E315F0 wrote: Instead of worrying about who we are going to "build around" 10 years from now and this suspect or that suspect, we need to be more like the Brewers and the Reds.  Instead of philosophizing about it, go out and improve the club incrementally right now.


Adding Puig doesn't improve this team in any meaningful, incremental way. They will still lose badly with him on the roster. Then next year, he will be somewhere else. I think he is worth signing so that they can swap him for prospects at the deadline, but nothing more.

6E7357555B3E0 wrote: Instead of worrying about who we are going to "build around" 10 years from now and this suspect or that suspect, we need to be more like the Brewers and the Reds.  Instead of philosophizing about it, go out and improve the club incrementally right now.


Adding Puig doesn't improve this team in any meaningful, incremental way.  They will still lose badly with him on the roster.  Then next year, he will be somewhere else.  I think he is worth signing so that they can swap him for prospects at the deadline, but nothing more.
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Of course, Puig is a better OF than anyone other than Reynolds on the team so he improves the team incrementally. I couldn't care less where he is playing in 2021 or beyond.

504B46474E424D230 wrote: Instead of worrying about who we are going to "build around" 10 years from now and this suspect or that suspect, we need to be more like the Brewers and the Reds.  Instead of philosophizing about it, go out and improve the club incrementally right now.


Adding Puig doesn't improve this team in any meaningful, incremental way.  They will still lose badly with him on the roster.  Then next year, he will be somewhere else.  I think he is worth signing so that they can swap him for prospects at the deadline, but nothing more.
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Of course, Puig is a better OF than anyone other than Reynolds on the team so he improves the team incrementally.  I couldn't care less where he is playing in 2021 or beyond. 




I guess I'd say, why? Why should they be incrementally better this year? What's the point in signing Puig for this year (or half of a year)? IMO, it is not better to win 78 games over 74 games. Rather, 74 wins probably gets you a better draft position. Being incrementally better and not being a playoff team is not a better thing for the future of the organization.

4C517577791C0 wrote: Instead of worrying about who we are going to "build around" 10 years from now and this suspect or that suspect, we need to be more like the Brewers and the Reds.  Instead of philosophizing about it, go out and improve the club incrementally right now.


Adding Puig doesn't improve this team in any meaningful, incremental way.  They will still lose badly with him on the roster.  Then next year, he will be somewhere else.  I think he is worth signing so that they can swap him for prospects at the deadline, but nothing more.
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Of course, Puig is a better OF than anyone other than Reynolds on the team so he improves the team incrementally.  I couldn't care less where he is playing in 2021 or beyond. 




I guess I'd say, why?  Why should they be incrementally better this year?  What's the point in signing Puig for this year (or half of a year)?  IMO, it is not better to win 78 games over 74 games.  Rather, 74 wins probably gets you a better draft position.  Being incrementally better and not being a playoff team is not a better thing for the future of the organization.


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There is the crux of the problem. You believe that they are better off planning for the future by acquiring prospects and then when the time is right they will spend the money to make a run at a championship. I believe none of that. They have never won even one Division Championship and the time will never be right to spend any money. I have no interest in any A ball prospects/suspects, I would MUCH rather acquire a player that gets us to 78 wins this year rather than 74. Then, I would immediately be looking to acquire another player that gets us to 82 wins this year. I am a lifelong Pirate fan and I just don't care how many zeros they add to Bob Nutting's net worth.

79626F6E676B640A0 wrote: Instead of worrying about who we are going to "build around" 10 years from now and this suspect or that suspect, we need to be more like the Brewers and the Reds.  Instead of philosophizing about it, go out and improve the club incrementally right now.


Adding Puig doesn't improve this team in any meaningful, incremental way.  They will still lose badly with him on the roster.  Then next year, he will be somewhere else.  I think he is worth signing so that they can swap him for prospects at the deadline, but nothing more.
---

Of course, Puig is a better OF than anyone other than Reynolds on the team so he improves the team incrementally.  I couldn't care less where he is playing in 2021 or beyond. 




I guess I'd say, why?  Why should they be incrementally better this year?  What's the point in signing Puig for this year (or half of a year)?  IMO, it is not better to win 78 games over 74 games.  Rather, 74 wins probably gets you a better draft position.  Being incrementally better and not being a playoff team is not a better thing for the future of the organization.


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There is the crux of the problem.  You believe that they are better off planning for the future by acquiring prospects and then when the time is right they will spend the money to make a run at a championship.  I believe none of that.  They have never won even one Division Championship and the time will never be right to spend any money.  I have no interest in any A ball prospects/suspects, I would MUCH rather acquire a player that gets us to 78 wins this year rather than 74.  Then, I would immediately be looking to acquire another player that gets us to 82 wins this year.  I am a lifelong Pirate fan and I just don't care how many zeros they add to Bob Nutting's net worth.




I'm with you on your last statement. I don't care how much Nutting pays. It isn't my money. But you gotta be realistic. He is going to spend an embarrassingly low amount. That's the truth and we have to deal with it. As does the new FO. And so, one needs to plan accordingly. If they had a roster this year that was a playoff team but just missing a piece or two, then I'd sign Puig or the like. But doing that now is a waste. They aren't close. And in the current model of MLB, there are no rewards for winning 78 games over 74. In fact, there are clear incentives for losing more.



And to make another point, they have spent when they had a core of younger, cost controlled players. They spent $100-110 million compared to $50-60 million now. That amount is a joke across the industry, but it seems to be the budget. Like it or not, NH managed to field one of the best teams in baseball over a 3 year period on that budget. Other teams have found a way to do it also. Again, like it or not, that's the budget and the model.



The whole division/championships thing is a dumb argument, IMO. The playoffs are a crapshoot. Especially one game playoffs. The Pirates had one of the best winning percentages over that time. They did it with a bunch of prospects (who they drafted/traded for and developed) who came to fruition, some great trades, and signing some key, low cost free agents.