OnlyBucs

3C6A7C68677D6D666B7C4E69636F6762206D0E0 wrote: Arenado is one of my favorite players and it's great that I'll be able to see more of him now that he's in the division.  But I'm so frustrated that the Pirates, under this owner, never make moves like this, not because Nutting doesn't have the money, but because he refuses to use it in this fashion. 



It just further erodes my interest in major league baseball.  He's not going to change, he showed that after 2015.  Either MLB has to change by creating equity among the franchises (and I see little incentive for the owners to do that as they're all profitable), or Nutting has to either sell or be forced out.  I don't see that happening, either.  It's a terrible feeling being a Pirates fan knowing this is our lot, and will be for years and years to come.


A lot of us share your feeling but are willing to give BC and BOB one more chance. My concern is that if BOB sells or is forced to by MLB what will happen to the Pirates franchise. Will MLB allow a new owner to move the team to a new market once the PNC Park lease expires? Will a new owner who wants to move the team be able and willing to buy out the remaining lease on PNC Park? Do you really believe that MLB will move toward equality in its franchises?

012028012A22450 wrote: Arenado is one of my favorite players and it's great that I'll be able to see more of him now that he's in the division.  But I'm so frustrated that the Pirates, under this owner, never make moves like this, not because Nutting doesn't have the money, but because he refuses to use it in this fashion. 



It just further erodes my interest in major league baseball.  He's not going to change, he showed that after 2015.  Either MLB has to change by creating equity among the franchises (and I see little incentive for the owners to do that as they're all profitable), or Nutting has to either sell or be forced out.  I don't see that happening, either.  It's a terrible feeling being a Pirates fan knowing this is our lot, and will be for years and years to come.


A lot of us share your feeling but are willing to give BC and BOB one more chance.  My concern is that if BOB sells or is forced to by MLB what will happen to the Pirates franchise.  Will MLB allow a new owner to move the team to a new market once the PNC Park lease expires?  Will a new owner who wants to move the team be able and willing to buy out the remaining lease on PNC Park?  Do you really believe that MLB will move toward equality in its franchises?




I'm all for giving Cherington a chance to build his own team, but not Nutting.  I'll never believe he'll do what it takes to win a title.



As for moving the franchise, I'm not naive enough to think that couldn't happen.  Money talks, and the league will feel no guilt about abandoning Pittsburgh, not caring at all that the area's residents paid for the ballpark, if it's in their best interests.



Do I think the league will move towards equity?  Not really.  Even the franchises earning the least revenue are profitable without taking much risk.  They're virtually guaranteed to succeed because the wealthy franchises help keep them afloat.  They have little incentive to change the current system.



At this point, teams like the Pirates are just there to provide the rich teams someone to play.  For an owner like Nutting, who avoids most risks, that's fine with him.  He gets to be part of a very exclusive club, coming with little cost.  It's the fans of teams like the Pirates who are the big losers, but when did major league baseball ever care about its fans?



The wealthy owners stopped caring that guys like Nutting take shared league revenues and don't use them to win.  Those franchises will receive the money anyway regardless of who owns them.  The wealthy have concluded it's better to give that money to an owner like Nutting, who won't try to win, leaving the path to a World Series title easier to travel as there will be fewer legitimate competitors.

1244524649534348455260474D41494C0E43200 wrote: Arenado is one of my favorite players and it's great that I'll be able to see more of him now that he's in the division.  But I'm so frustrated that the Pirates, under this owner, never make moves like this, not because Nutting doesn't have the money, but because he refuses to use it in this fashion. 



It just further erodes my interest in major league baseball.  He's not going to change, he showed that after 2015.  Either MLB has to change by creating equity among the franchises (and I see little incentive for the owners to do that as they're all profitable), or Nutting has to either sell or be forced out.  I don't see that happening, either.  It's a terrible feeling being a Pirates fan knowing this is our lot, and will be for years and years to come.


A lot of us share your feeling but are willing to give BC and BOB one more chance.  My concern is that if BOB sells or is forced to by MLB what will happen to the Pirates franchise.  Will MLB allow a new owner to move the team to a new market once the PNC Park lease expires?  Will a new owner who wants to move the team be able and willing to buy out the remaining lease on PNC Park?  Do you really believe that MLB will move toward equality in its franchises?




I'm all for giving Cherington a chance to build his own team, but not Nutting.  I'll never believe he'll do what it takes to win a title.



As for moving the franchise, I'm not naive enough to think that couldn't happen.  Money talks, and the league will feel no guilt about abandoning Pittsburgh, not caring at all that the area's residents paid for the ballpark, if it's in their best interests.



Do I think the league will move towards equity?  Not really.  Even the franchises earning the least revenue are profitable without taking much risk.  They're virtually guaranteed to succeed because the wealthy franchises help keep them afloat.  They have little incentive to change the current system.



At this point, teams like the Pirates are just there to provide the rich teams someone to play.  For an owner like Nutting, who avoids most risks, that's fine with him.  He gets to be part of a very exclusive club, coming with little cost.  It's the fans of teams like the Pirates who are the big losers, but when did major league baseball ever care about its fans?



The wealthy owners stopped caring that guys like Nutting take shared league revenues and don't use them to win.  Those franchises will receive the money anyway regardless of who owns them.  The wealthy have concluded it's better to give that money to an owner like Nutting, who won't try to win, leaving the path to a World Series title easier to travel as there will be fewer legitimate competitors.


I am not holding my breath waiting for MLB to come in and make all teams equal, it will never happen. I completely understand that there are small market clubs that can't compete for the top players like the large market teams. I am not asking or expecting that the Pirates do that.



There are other small market clubs like Cincinnati and Milwaukee who do exactly what I think the Pirates should do. There is no reason why our team salary should be lower than the other small market clubs on a yearly basis.



Nutting has found a way to make money with revenue sharing and TV revenues without fielding a competitive team.



And, no, I don't want to give Cherington a "chance". I realize that there are some who think that Cherington is acquiring prospects as part of some grand master strategy that will make us competitive in some distant "undefined" future, but I don;t buy it.

There is no reason at all for the Pirates to field a team with a salary below $40 million. I would not be surprised at all to discover that Cherington gets a bonus based upon how much the team salary is below league average.

I agree with you Doc. Nutting won't change and has to reason to. And MLB has no incentive to change the system that works for the free spending owners who want to win, the non spending owners who don't care about winning, and the lower spending but competitive owners who can occasionally have a small window to compete if they make smart decisions.



Huntington was not good at putting together a good team on a shoestring budget. At least we can hope Cherington can do that until he proves he can't. It doesn't happen often but other GMs have done it. But Cherington is going to have to do it within the severe financial constraints imposed by Nutting. Nutting isn't going to change.

574C414049454A240 wrote: The Cardinals get Nolan Arenado for a 5 and the Rockies get Austin Gomber for a 2.  Meantime, the Indians sign eddie Rosario for a 3.5.  What say you WWD and GW?



The current standings are:



Mets - Stroman(3.5),Williams(1),May(2.5),McCann(2.5),Lindor(4.5)

--Carrascvo(3),Luchesi(1),Loup(2)................................20

Blue Jays- Dolis(2),Ray(1),Chatwood(2),Yates(3),Springer(5)

--Semien(3.5),Matz(1)...............................................17.5

Padres - O'Grady(.5),Snell(4.5),Kim(1).,Darvish(4.5),Caratini(.5).

--Kim(1.5),Musgrive(2,5),Profar(2)........                         16

Phillies - Neris(3),Alvarado(2.5.)Coonrod(0.5),Bradley(3)

--Realmuto(5),Moore(2)...............................................16

Yankees - Britton(3),Kuber(4.5),Taillon(2),)'Day(2),Lemahieu(4).15.5

Giants - Vosler(1),Gausman(2),Wisler(2),Desclafini(2.5).......

--Brebbia(1),Casale(2),Wood(1.5),LaStella((2.5)............14.5

Nationals - Harrison(1),Clay(1),Bell(2),Schwarber(3),Lester(2)

--Zimmerman(1),Hand(3),Avila(.5)...............................13.5

Indians - Perez(2.5),Gimenez(2),Rosario(1.5),Hernandez(2.5)

--Rosario(3.5).............................................................12

Angels-Iglesias(2).Iglesias(3),Claidio(2),Suzuki(1),Quintana(2.5)10.5

Red Sox  Renfroe(2),Andriese(2),Perez(2),Richards(3),Ottavino(1).10

Asros - Gurriel(3),Baez(2.5),Brantley(3),Castro(1)......................9.5

White Sox - Lynn(4),Eaton(2.5),Hendricks(2.5)............................9

Rays - Zunino(2),Wacha(2),Mejia(1),Davies(3.5)........................8.5

Braves - Almonte (.5),Tomlin(2),Smyly(3),Morton(2.5)...............  8

Cardinals - Wainwrighjt(3),Arenado(5).........................................8

Royals - Minor(2.5),Taylor(1),Holland(3.5)...................................7

Mariners - Graveman(1),Flexen(2),Montero(2),Hernandez(2)..........7

Dodgers  Knebel(1),Kahnle(2.5),Treinen(3)................................6.5

Rangers -,Gotto(.5),Dunning(1.5),Lowe(1),Dahl(3),Arihara(.5).....6.5

Marlins - Marte(3),Detwiler(1.5),Bass(2)...................................6.5

Tigers - Urena(1),Grossman(2),Ramos(2)....................................5

Orioles - Iglesias(2.5),Galvis(2)................................................4.5

Cubs - Rizzo(3),Romine(1),Stewart(.5)......................................4.5

Reds - Hoffman-(.5),Ramirez(1.5),Garcia(.5),Perez(1).................3.5

Twins - Simmons(3.5)..............................................................3.5

Rockies - Stephenson(.5),Gomber(2).........................................2.5

Diamondbacks - Kelly(2)............................................................2

Brewers - Maile(.5),Robertson(1)..............................................1.5



Cherington continues twittling his thumbs.




Arenado-5- great addition for the Cards. Hadn't done much recently but this is certainly a big splash

Gomber-2

Rosario-3

3E687E6A657F6F64697E4C6B616D6560226F0C0 wrote: Arenado is one of my favorite players and it's great that I'll be able to see more of him now that he's in the division.  But I'm so frustrated that the Pirates, under this owner, never make moves like this, not because Nutting doesn't have the money, but because he refuses to use it in this fashion. 



It just further erodes my interest in major league baseball.  He's not going to change, he showed that after 2015.  Either MLB has to change by creating equity among the franchises (and I see little incentive for the owners to do that as they're all profitable), or Nutting has to either sell or be forced out.  I don't see that happening, either.  It's a terrible feeling being a Pirates fan knowing this is our lot, and will be for years and years to come.


I have a feeling that after 2030, when the lease runs out at PNC ( I may be history by then :'( the bucs will be gone. Probably Charlotte

6D404D5C5B4A5D1D1E2F0 wrote: The Cardinals get Nolan Arenado for a 5 and the Rockies get Austin Gomber for a 2.  Meantime, the Indians sign eddie Rosario for a 3.5.  What say you WWD and GW?



The current standings are:



Mets - Stroman(3.5),Williams(1),May(2.5),McCann(2.5),Lindor(4.5)

--Carrascvo(3),Luchesi(1),Loup(2)................................20

Blue Jays- Dolis(2),Ray(1),Chatwood(2),Yates(3),Springer(5)

--Semien(3.5),Matz(1)...............................................17.5

Padres - O'Grady(.5),Snell(4.5),Kim(1).,Darvish(4.5),Caratini(.5).

--Kim(1.5),Musgrive(2,5),Profar(2)........                         16

Phillies - Neris(3),Alvarado(2.5.)Coonrod(0.5),Bradley(3)

--Realmuto(5),Moore(2)...............................................16

Yankees - Britton(3),Kuber(4.5),Taillon(2),)'Day(2),Lemahieu(4).15.5

Giants - Vosler(1),Gausman(2),Wisler(2),Desclafini(2.5).......

--Brebbia(1),Casale(2),Wood(1.5),LaStella((2.5)............14.5

Nationals - Harrison(1),Clay(1),Bell(2),Schwarber(3),Lester(2)

--Zimmerman(1),Hand(3),Avila(.5)...............................13.5

Indians - Perez(2.5),Gimenez(2),Rosario(1.5),Hernandez(2.5)

--Rosario(3.5).............................................................12

Angels-Iglesias(2).Iglesias(3),Claidio(2),Suzuki(1),Quintana(2.5)10.5

Red Sox  Renfroe(2),Andriese(2),Perez(2),Richards(3),Ottavino(1).10

Asros - Gurriel(3),Baez(2.5),Brantley(3),Castro(1)......................9.5

White Sox - Lynn(4),Eaton(2.5),Hendricks(2.5)............................9

Rays - Zunino(2),Wacha(2),Mejia(1),Davies(3.5)........................8.5

Braves - Almonte (.5),Tomlin(2),Smyly(3),Morton(2.5)...............  8

Cardinals - Wainwrighjt(3),Arenado(5).........................................8

Royals - Minor(2.5),Taylor(1),Holland(3.5)...................................7

Mariners - Graveman(1),Flexen(2),Montero(2),Hernandez(2)..........7

Dodgers  Knebel(1),Kahnle(2.5),Treinen(3)................................6.5

Rangers -,Gotto(.5),Dunning(1.5),Lowe(1),Dahl(3),Arihara(.5).....6.5

Marlins - Marte(3),Detwiler(1.5),Bass(2)...................................6.5

Tigers - Urena(1),Grossman(2),Ramos(2)....................................5

Orioles - Iglesias(2.5),Galvis(2)................................................4.5

Cubs - Rizzo(3),Romine(1),Stewart(.5)......................................4.5

Reds - Hoffman-(.5),Ramirez(1.5),Garcia(.5),Perez(1).................3.5

Twins - Simmons(3.5)..............................................................3.5

Rockies - Stephenson(.5),Gomber(2).........................................2.5

Diamondbacks - Kelly(2)............................................................2

Brewers - Maile(.5),Robertson(1)..............................................1.5



Cherington continues twittling his thumbs.




His thumbs are quite muscular now.


Goldschmidt and Arenado- probably dood for 80 HR's and over 200 RBI's

1B4D5B4F405A4A414C5B694E44484045074A290 wrote: "Phillies Managing Partner John Middleton said in a statement. "While Matt made many significant contributions to the organization, we did not accomplish our goal of playing baseball in October. Consequently, we have mutually agreed to allow new leadership to head Baseball Operations."

____

This is the type of attitude we desperately need in Pittsburgh.


I don't know about that.  When Huntington was fired, Nutting issued this statement:  "While Neal made many significant contributions to the organization, we did not accomplish our goal of making more money.  Consequently, we have mutually agreed to allow new leadership to head Baseball operations."  It's just a wee subtle difference.


I am sure this will come as no surprise but in today's post gazette sports writer, Ron Cook said' team owners don't come any worse than Bob Nutting" AMEN

6F2C352E3D28392F6F5C0 wrote: Gregorius to the Phillies.


Gregorius 3.5 Phillies payroll going higher and higher

635D5850435B5B507055425106340 wrote: Arenado is one of my favorite players and it's great that I'll be able to see more of him now that he's in the division.  But I'm so frustrated that the Pirates, under this owner, never make moves like this, not because Nutting doesn't have the money, but because he refuses to use it in this fashion. 



It just further erodes my interest in major league baseball.  He's not going to change, he showed that after 2015.  Either MLB has to change by creating equity among the franchises (and I see little incentive for the owners to do that as they're all profitable), or Nutting has to either sell or be forced out.  I don't see that happening, either.  It's a terrible feeling being a Pirates fan knowing this is our lot, and will be for years and years to come.


I have a feeling that after 2030, when the lease runs out at PNC ( I may be history by then :'( the bucs will be gone. Probably Charlotte
There are times I get that same feeling that after 2030 the Pirates will no longer be in Pittsburgh. If that happens that is a darn shame, and shame on Bob Nutting for letting that happen. Baseball and the Pirates is my favorite sport, and as an older fan my hope would be that future generations in the Pittsburgh area will continue to go to a game on a summer night and watch Major League Baseball.