4D464E4247465D181E695048414646074A46290 wrote: What makes you think they are being built on defense?
All the new players added from those playoff teams have been known as less fielders (Bell, Moran, Dickerson, Frazier) and Polanco is still here.
the whole strategy of shifting is to improve the defense. Polanco was viewed as a plus defender in the minors. I don't think the Bucs expected Bell to be this bad at first (IMO he has regressed since last year).
Frankly, I don't know that there is any plan to build the team on defense and pitching or anything else. It seems like they don't really know what kind of team they want other than a cheap one.
Gotcha...I was thinking more of the type of players they brought in or will be going forward with. The shifting is to help put defenders in the best position. The Pirates are no longer considered the top team shifters as all teams are doing it just as much.
Can't remember where I heard it last week. May have been ESPN or MLB Network but they said there is a stat for runs saved by shifting and the Pirates are among the worst now.
6 wins and 18 Losses Changes Need To Be Made
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
6 wins and 18 Losses Changes Need To Be Made
5D565E5257564D080E794058515656175A56390 wrote: Changes need made.
I don't see Bell being moved to the outfield. I do think Osuna should get some 1B time. I don't think the outfield rotation should happen anymore. [highlight]I'd put Meadows in LF more too[/highlight]. Call up Moroff, get rid of Rodriguez.
I am ok with the pitching staff. They aren't very good overall, but all very young. They need to pitch to see what the Pirates have going forward. They have plenty of guys who can bounce in and out of the rotation.
Why would you put Meadows in LF? Dickerson seems ok at covering the ground, and his arm is nowhere near strong enough to play RF.
I don't see Bell being moved to the outfield. I do think Osuna should get some 1B time. I don't think the outfield rotation should happen anymore. [highlight]I'd put Meadows in LF more too[/highlight]. Call up Moroff, get rid of Rodriguez.
I am ok with the pitching staff. They aren't very good overall, but all very young. They need to pitch to see what the Pirates have going forward. They have plenty of guys who can bounce in and out of the rotation.
Why would you put Meadows in LF? Dickerson seems ok at covering the ground, and his arm is nowhere near strong enough to play RF.
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dogknot17@yahoo.co
6 wins and 18 Losses Changes Need To Be Made
2C2D3627317176420 wrote: Changes need made.
I don't see Bell being moved to the outfield. I do think Osuna should get some 1B time. I don't think the outfield rotation should happen anymore. [highlight]I'd put Meadows in LF more too[/highlight]. Call up Moroff, get rid of Rodriguez.
I am ok with the pitching staff. They aren't very good overall, but all very young. They need to pitch to see what the Pirates have going forward. They have plenty of guys who can bounce in and out of the rotation.
Why would you put Meadows in LF? Dickerson seems ok at covering the ground, and his arm is nowhere near strong enough to play RF.
I think there are more plays at 2B and the plate from LF than there is in preventing guys from going first to third. I felt Marte kept many guys at 1B instead of trying for a double.
If Marte isn't going to move back to CF, I would put the better arm in LF with the size of PNC Park. That isn't a knock on Dickerson, he has been very good out there. Meadows would be better in my opinion with his arm and speed. I actually would put Meadows in CF and Marte in LF going forward, but I don't see that happening.
I don't see Bell being moved to the outfield. I do think Osuna should get some 1B time. I don't think the outfield rotation should happen anymore. [highlight]I'd put Meadows in LF more too[/highlight]. Call up Moroff, get rid of Rodriguez.
I am ok with the pitching staff. They aren't very good overall, but all very young. They need to pitch to see what the Pirates have going forward. They have plenty of guys who can bounce in and out of the rotation.
Why would you put Meadows in LF? Dickerson seems ok at covering the ground, and his arm is nowhere near strong enough to play RF.
I think there are more plays at 2B and the plate from LF than there is in preventing guys from going first to third. I felt Marte kept many guys at 1B instead of trying for a double.
If Marte isn't going to move back to CF, I would put the better arm in LF with the size of PNC Park. That isn't a knock on Dickerson, he has been very good out there. Meadows would be better in my opinion with his arm and speed. I actually would put Meadows in CF and Marte in LF going forward, but I don't see that happening.
6 wins and 18 Losses Changes Need To Be Made
I don't understand the rotation narrative. Yes, we need more top end talent.
The numbers their putting up and defense behind them don't back up the "rotation sucks" narrative. The bullpen sucks, no doubt. The defense is terrible, no doubt.
I have problems with the position players we're running out there and the bullpen much more than the starters.
Williams has always been the guy that didn't belong and was pitching way over his periphrials and stuff. He should be optioned and Kingham recalled.
The numbers their putting up and defense behind them don't back up the "rotation sucks" narrative. The bullpen sucks, no doubt. The defense is terrible, no doubt.
I have problems with the position players we're running out there and the bullpen much more than the starters.
Williams has always been the guy that didn't belong and was pitching way over his periphrials and stuff. He should be optioned and Kingham recalled.
6 wins and 18 Losses Changes Need To Be Made
Boy howdy, would I ever like to see changes. Of course my biggest wish would be a change of ownership, but we all know that's as imminently likely as cockroach extinction.
Clint needs to go for the near countless reasons cited on this board regarding personnel management. He's delusional and his shelf life has expired.
As others have mentioned I'd like to see Bell and Polanco given remedial stints at AAA. Let Osuna have a few weeks of playing first base and see what he can do. His defense can't be worse than Bell's, and his hitting just might play.
I'd try to move Freese and Nova for a return of a couple of experienced and capable bullpen arms. I would even use Polanco as trade bait if the return was right. If you can get something for SRod take it. If not, release him and bring up one of our infield prospects from Indy.
The only thing I wouldn't mess with is our young starting staff. At age 25-26 I don't see any reason to call any of them a failure. In fact The Athletic's Enos Sarris rated our young starters in the top 151 MLB starters projected for the rest of the season with these rankings:
#24 Jameson Taillon
#57 Joe Musgrove
#71 Nick Kingham
#102 Chad Kuhl
#117 Trevor Williams
Those rankings correspond to a respectable if not particularly impressive rotation with Taillon being a low #1, Musgrove a low #2, Kingham a high #3, Kuhl a high #4 and Williams a low #4. The addition of an experienced true top of the rotation arm would make this young staff look really good with a significant chance for improvement with maturation of the young arms.
Clint needs to go for the near countless reasons cited on this board regarding personnel management. He's delusional and his shelf life has expired.
As others have mentioned I'd like to see Bell and Polanco given remedial stints at AAA. Let Osuna have a few weeks of playing first base and see what he can do. His defense can't be worse than Bell's, and his hitting just might play.
I'd try to move Freese and Nova for a return of a couple of experienced and capable bullpen arms. I would even use Polanco as trade bait if the return was right. If you can get something for SRod take it. If not, release him and bring up one of our infield prospects from Indy.
The only thing I wouldn't mess with is our young starting staff. At age 25-26 I don't see any reason to call any of them a failure. In fact The Athletic's Enos Sarris rated our young starters in the top 151 MLB starters projected for the rest of the season with these rankings:
#24 Jameson Taillon
#57 Joe Musgrove
#71 Nick Kingham
#102 Chad Kuhl
#117 Trevor Williams
Those rankings correspond to a respectable if not particularly impressive rotation with Taillon being a low #1, Musgrove a low #2, Kingham a high #3, Kuhl a high #4 and Williams a low #4. The addition of an experienced true top of the rotation arm would make this young staff look really good with a significant chance for improvement with maturation of the young arms.
6 wins and 18 Losses Changes Need To Be Made
Unfortunately Josh Bell will likely never be a good starting 1b option. Even if he turns the bat around, his defense is pedroesque. It's just not good enough to make up for even an average 1b bat (which he doesn't have...yet)The offensive gains he needs to make are borderline insurmountable to offset his inability to make simple plays regularly.
Getting him hitting is step 1. He's never going to field though. Hopefully he can hit and could make a good DH or you could move him to the OF and try to hide him.
1b is not a good place for a guy as clumsy as he is. He's involved in every play. OF you can possibly hide a guy like that because of the lack of plays.
Getting him hitting is step 1. He's never going to field though. Hopefully he can hit and could make a good DH or you could move him to the OF and try to hide him.
1b is not a good place for a guy as clumsy as he is. He's involved in every play. OF you can possibly hide a guy like that because of the lack of plays.
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dogknot17@yahoo.co
6 wins and 18 Losses Changes Need To Be Made
Bell had a good night last night. Maybe the line up drop will help him? I thought his defense was fine last year. If was hitting I am not sure how much of his defense we will notice.
(Everyone's defense looks so bad this year. Mercer and Rodriguez included.)
(Everyone's defense looks so bad this year. Mercer and Rodriguez included.)
6 wins and 18 Losses Changes Need To Be Made
It could be that it looks bad because it is bad. Maybe we ignore that in the excitement of someone hitting, but the hitting doesn't change that. And in the end, bad defense costs games.
6 wins and 18 Losses Changes Need To Be Made
Yeah. What on earth does fans "not noticing" have to do with if a player is good or not? Well, he's hitting so they don't notice.
Defense not mattering is nonsense
If a guy hits but cannot field, his lack of value may be overlooked by fans, but it's not overlooked in the W-L column. I guess some people will just always accept mediocrity (or worse).
Defense not mattering is nonsense
If a guy hits but cannot field, his lack of value may be overlooked by fans, but it's not overlooked in the W-L column. I guess some people will just always accept mediocrity (or worse).
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dogknot17@yahoo.co
6 wins and 18 Losses Changes Need To Be Made
There are more bad fielders in the game playing every day than bad hitters playing because they are good fielders.
There are many examples in Pittsburgh over the years. Marte has always been better than McCutchen on defense. But McCutchen was moved to RF after he was done hitting. He was still in CF while he was getting MVP votes. Alvarez always led the league in errors at 3B. He also led the league in HRs and won a Silver Slugger. Kang is a league leader in errors too but many want him back.
Alvarez was probably the worst 1B I have ever seen. He still made 97% of the plays the year he played 1B for the Pirates.
It's not that defense doesn't matter it is important. Teams prefer the bat over a glove any day. Hitters find positions. Gloves don't find themselves in the line up.
Bad fielders are still making well over 93% of the plays. Good hitters are trying to be successful at a 30% rate. We can justify a player being bad on defense if he is hitting. People still don't want a Rodriguez in the line up if they are hitting .162.
Modify to add a link:
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/106 ... ll-history
There are many examples in Pittsburgh over the years. Marte has always been better than McCutchen on defense. But McCutchen was moved to RF after he was done hitting. He was still in CF while he was getting MVP votes. Alvarez always led the league in errors at 3B. He also led the league in HRs and won a Silver Slugger. Kang is a league leader in errors too but many want him back.
Alvarez was probably the worst 1B I have ever seen. He still made 97% of the plays the year he played 1B for the Pirates.
It's not that defense doesn't matter it is important. Teams prefer the bat over a glove any day. Hitters find positions. Gloves don't find themselves in the line up.
Bad fielders are still making well over 93% of the plays. Good hitters are trying to be successful at a 30% rate. We can justify a player being bad on defense if he is hitting. People still don't want a Rodriguez in the line up if they are hitting .162.
Modify to add a link:
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/106 ... ll-history