They should make those moves, but I don't see anything happening anytime soon. How much $$$ is left on SRod's contract? Pittsburgh isn't dumping him and having to pick up that freight. We know the history here of this front office. It's one thing to dump Kontos, who had little $$$ remaining. If SRod has 5 mill + left ... he is staying. They are playing him hoping he catches something to up his trade value. He has negative value now. This is the only possible reason.
This is the Pirates ... nothing positive will happen here with this crew as far as doing the right thing.
So when is enough going to be enough???
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
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SteadyFreddy
So when is enough going to be enough???
1606073026262A450 wrote: They should make those moves, but I don't see anything happening anytime soon. How much $$$ is left on SRod's contract? Pittsburgh isn't dumping him and having to pick up that freight. We know the history here of this front office. It's one thing to dump Kontos, who had little $$$ remaining. If SRod has 5 mill + left ... he is staying. They are playing him hoping he catches something to up his trade value. He has negative value now. This is the only possible reason.
This is the Pirates ... nothing positive will happen here with this crew as far as doing the right thing. What in God’s name could they possibly think that any of the other 29 teams in baseball are gonna give them for Sean Rodriguez seeing how terrible he has been this season and especially recently. He wouldnt get the Pirates an average Single or Double A player at this point let alone getting a player back that is actually decent and can help them down the road. DFA him eat the 5 million and be done with it. Mistakes happen and it’s okay to admit them. This was one of them bringing Rodriguez back last season and taking on his overpaid salary. It’s inexcusable and flat out insulting to hear both Huntington and Hurdle continue to give reasons why they need to keep Rodriguez around longer.
This is the Pirates ... nothing positive will happen here with this crew as far as doing the right thing. What in God’s name could they possibly think that any of the other 29 teams in baseball are gonna give them for Sean Rodriguez seeing how terrible he has been this season and especially recently. He wouldnt get the Pirates an average Single or Double A player at this point let alone getting a player back that is actually decent and can help them down the road. DFA him eat the 5 million and be done with it. Mistakes happen and it’s okay to admit them. This was one of them bringing Rodriguez back last season and taking on his overpaid salary. It’s inexcusable and flat out insulting to hear both Huntington and Hurdle continue to give reasons why they need to keep Rodriguez around longer.
So when is enough going to be enough???
0B2C3D393C211E2A3D3C3C21580 wrote: They should make those moves, but I don't see anything happening anytime soon. How much $$$ is left on SRod's contract? Pittsburgh isn't dumping him and having to pick up that freight. We know the history here of this front office. It's one thing to dump Kontos, who had little $$$ remaining. If SRod has 5 mill + left ... he is staying. They are playing him hoping he catches something to up his trade value. He has negative value now. This is the only possible reason.
This is the Pirates ... nothing positive will happen here with this crew as far as doing the right thing. What in God’s name could they possibly think that any of the other 29 teams in baseball are gonna give them for Sean Rodriguez seeing how terrible he has been this season and especially recently. He wouldnt get the Pirates an average Single or Double A player at this point let alone getting a player back that is actually decent and can help them down the road. DFA him eat the 5 million and be done with it. Mistakes happen and it’s okay to admit them. This was one of them bringing Rodriguez back last season and taking on his overpaid salary. It’s inexcusable and flat out insulting to hear both Huntington and Hurdle continue to give reasons why they need to keep Rodriguez around longer.
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Easy one. Just get another team to pay Rodriguez' salary and give them a couple of prospects for taking his salary ala Liriano.
This is the Pirates ... nothing positive will happen here with this crew as far as doing the right thing. What in God’s name could they possibly think that any of the other 29 teams in baseball are gonna give them for Sean Rodriguez seeing how terrible he has been this season and especially recently. He wouldnt get the Pirates an average Single or Double A player at this point let alone getting a player back that is actually decent and can help them down the road. DFA him eat the 5 million and be done with it. Mistakes happen and it’s okay to admit them. This was one of them bringing Rodriguez back last season and taking on his overpaid salary. It’s inexcusable and flat out insulting to hear both Huntington and Hurdle continue to give reasons why they need to keep Rodriguez around longer.
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Easy one. Just get another team to pay Rodriguez' salary and give them a couple of prospects for taking his salary ala Liriano.
So when is enough going to be enough???
I think there's now a real chance Glasnows career can be salvaged as a relief pitcher. I would definitely not have him start now and get destroyed again.
He's still all over the zone (and out of it) and only in command of two pitches. His last relief outing showed this again very clearly.
He's able to better hide those warts facing hitters once. He needs to improve more or he will be slaughtered as a starter again.
We might as well try Edgar Santana as a starter. He's every bit the pitcher Glasnow is, if not better from a pitch quality perspective. (I'm not really saying we should try him, just trying to point out that Glasnow isn't anything special without more control. Control needs to keep improving)
He's still all over the zone (and out of it) and only in command of two pitches. His last relief outing showed this again very clearly.
He's able to better hide those warts facing hitters once. He needs to improve more or he will be slaughtered as a starter again.
We might as well try Edgar Santana as a starter. He's every bit the pitcher Glasnow is, if not better from a pitch quality perspective. (I'm not really saying we should try him, just trying to point out that Glasnow isn't anything special without more control. Control needs to keep improving)
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Bobster21
So when is enough going to be enough???
With the season nearly half over, S-Rod is owed roughly half of his 2018 salary of 5.75 mil, or roughly 2.9 mil. He would be replaced by someone from Indy making the minimum ($545,000) so about half of that (about $273,000) would be added to payroll. They have to pay S-Rod regardless so releasing him costs only about half the minimum for his half season replacement. Seems like a no-brainer. But this is the team, that released Nicasio last year to save $600,000.
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rucker59@gmail.com
So when is enough going to be enough???
0E232E3F38293E7E7D4C0 wrote: I think there will be minor cosmetic changes. TBMTIB has repeatedly demonstrated that winning is not a priority. So I don't see wholesale changes being made in an attempt to win either now or in the future. Their primary priority is to keep spending low and the secondary priority is spin control to try to keep fans interested in a losing team by pretending they're oh so close to turning it around and being competitive with the big boys. Just wait 'til next year! Again.
Regarding the fans: it’s obvious, that ship has sailed. They’re not listening to the BS any more. Attendance is already in the “scary-low” category, with the bottom still to come.
My biggest fear: Nutting takes “his” team to another city to maximize his investment. I know there is a lease, but we’re into year 18, don’t know what the lease is for in years, but I don’t trust this operation.
Regarding the fans: it’s obvious, that ship has sailed. They’re not listening to the BS any more. Attendance is already in the “scary-low” category, with the bottom still to come.
My biggest fear: Nutting takes “his” team to another city to maximize his investment. I know there is a lease, but we’re into year 18, don’t know what the lease is for in years, but I don’t trust this operation.
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rucker59@gmail.com
So when is enough going to be enough???
557875646372652526170 wrote: It's possible that the Pirates are in no hurry to switch Kingham out with Williams or Kuhl because he's still on the cusp of being super two eligible with his service time.
They've demonstrated that Meadows is staying and that means he's guaranteed to get a 4th arbitration year. Meadows coming up and literally leading this baseball team offensively since Mid-May, is going to end up costing the team about 10 million over the next 6 years through additional arbitration (magnified 3 times). If Kingham gets that 4th year too we would have 2 super two players on the same arb schedule. Bob would have an additional 15-18 million spread out over 6 years all for a couple months of additional ML time by Meadows and Kingham on a lousy baseball team.
Kingham also isn't exactly a guarantee to be better than Williams or Kuhl either, especially over 2-3 starts in question until we get to the trade deadline (and Nova can be moved).
I'm not as optimistic as some about Kingham. When he made his near perfect debut, he was leaving so many pitches over the plate I couldn't understand why the Cardinals weren't trying to tee off on him. And in a few of his subsequent starts, those same pitches were getting hammered. I see the same thing with Musgrove. Like Kingham, he throws strikes and gets ahead of hitters. Or hitters tee off on those strikes. It's a very risky way of pitching. It's great when those hittable strikes are taken or fouled off or hit right at someone. But in 2 of his last 3 starts, he's looked more like the Musgrove who had a 6.12 ERA as a starter last year and gave up 95 hits in 78 innings. I think Kingham and Musgrove are similar. But they might as well find out in this lost season. I'm sure they could deal Nova and open a spot for Kingham. Seems like the logical thing to do. But I have my doubts as to how Kingham will do on a regular basis.
Agree 100% on Kingham. He looks like a “Pirate Pitcher” - in the long term, another in a fine line of nondescript 4&5 starters.
They've demonstrated that Meadows is staying and that means he's guaranteed to get a 4th arbitration year. Meadows coming up and literally leading this baseball team offensively since Mid-May, is going to end up costing the team about 10 million over the next 6 years through additional arbitration (magnified 3 times). If Kingham gets that 4th year too we would have 2 super two players on the same arb schedule. Bob would have an additional 15-18 million spread out over 6 years all for a couple months of additional ML time by Meadows and Kingham on a lousy baseball team.
Kingham also isn't exactly a guarantee to be better than Williams or Kuhl either, especially over 2-3 starts in question until we get to the trade deadline (and Nova can be moved).
I'm not as optimistic as some about Kingham. When he made his near perfect debut, he was leaving so many pitches over the plate I couldn't understand why the Cardinals weren't trying to tee off on him. And in a few of his subsequent starts, those same pitches were getting hammered. I see the same thing with Musgrove. Like Kingham, he throws strikes and gets ahead of hitters. Or hitters tee off on those strikes. It's a very risky way of pitching. It's great when those hittable strikes are taken or fouled off or hit right at someone. But in 2 of his last 3 starts, he's looked more like the Musgrove who had a 6.12 ERA as a starter last year and gave up 95 hits in 78 innings. I think Kingham and Musgrove are similar. But they might as well find out in this lost season. I'm sure they could deal Nova and open a spot for Kingham. Seems like the logical thing to do. But I have my doubts as to how Kingham will do on a regular basis.
Agree 100% on Kingham. He looks like a “Pirate Pitcher” - in the long term, another in a fine line of nondescript 4&5 starters.
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Bobster21
So when is enough going to be enough???
7B594A57545156597A4D5B5B57380 wrote: This is classic. Since May 31, our pal S-Rod has:
* 1 hit (1 for 23 for .043)
* 5 errors
* 11 strikeouts
I think he needs to start today at SS to give Mercer a rest. Jordy has played 3 days in a row and must be exhausted.
You guessed it. S-Rod at SS today!
* 1 hit (1 for 23 for .043)
* 5 errors
* 11 strikeouts
I think he needs to start today at SS to give Mercer a rest. Jordy has played 3 days in a row and must be exhausted.
You guessed it. S-Rod at SS today!
So when is enough going to be enough???
4245535B5542050970575D51595C1E535F5D300 wrote: I think there will be minor cosmetic changes. TBMTIB has repeatedly demonstrated that winning is not a priority. So I don't see wholesale changes being made in an attempt to win either now or in the future. Their primary priority is to keep spending low and the secondary priority is spin control to try to keep fans interested in a losing team by pretending they're oh so close to turning it around and being competitive with the big boys. Just wait 'til next year! Again.
Regarding the fans: it’s obvious, that ship has sailed. They’re not listening to the BS any more. Attendance is already in the “scary-low” category, with the bottom still to come.
My biggest fear: Nutting takes “his” team to another city to maximize his investment. I know there is a lease, but we’re into year 18, don’t know what the lease is for in years, but I don’t trust this operation.
My fear as well. During the off-season I heard on a talk show Charlotte is looking for a franchise and the Pirates were included as one of a couple existing teams that would be a target. Hopefully just a lot of bluster, but I don't trust Nutting either.
Regarding the fans: it’s obvious, that ship has sailed. They’re not listening to the BS any more. Attendance is already in the “scary-low” category, with the bottom still to come.
My biggest fear: Nutting takes “his” team to another city to maximize his investment. I know there is a lease, but we’re into year 18, don’t know what the lease is for in years, but I don’t trust this operation.
My fear as well. During the off-season I heard on a talk show Charlotte is looking for a franchise and the Pirates were included as one of a couple existing teams that would be a target. Hopefully just a lot of bluster, but I don't trust Nutting either.
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skinnyhorse
- Posts: 926
- Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2016 1:19 am
So when is enough going to be enough???
2D242C3D33490 wrote: I think there's now a real chance Glasnows career can be salvaged as a relief pitcher. I would definitely not have him start now and get destroyed again.
He's still all over the zone (and out of it) and only in command of two pitches. His last relief outing showed this again very clearly.
He's able to better hide those warts facing hitters once. He needs to improve more or he will be slaughtered as a starter again.
We might as well try Edgar Santana as a starter. He's every bit the pitcher Glasnow is, if not better from a pitch quality perspective. (I'm not really saying we should try him, just trying to point out that Glasnow isn't anything special without more control. Control needs to keep improving)
Your flat out wrong about Santana having a better chance at succeeding as a starter than Glasnow. I have zero faith in Santana and at least Glasnow has lots of movement which make it harder to hit.
He's still all over the zone (and out of it) and only in command of two pitches. His last relief outing showed this again very clearly.
He's able to better hide those warts facing hitters once. He needs to improve more or he will be slaughtered as a starter again.
We might as well try Edgar Santana as a starter. He's every bit the pitcher Glasnow is, if not better from a pitch quality perspective. (I'm not really saying we should try him, just trying to point out that Glasnow isn't anything special without more control. Control needs to keep improving)
Your flat out wrong about Santana having a better chance at succeeding as a starter than Glasnow. I have zero faith in Santana and at least Glasnow has lots of movement which make it harder to hit.