Official Game Thread 7/19/2021 Pirates vs. Diamondbacks
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fjk090852-7
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Official Game Thread 7/19/2021 Pirates vs. Diamondbacks
I think it is strange that Tyler Anderson has not started a game since the All Star Break. I keep thinking something is up regarding a trade, but so far no traction.
Official Game Thread 7/19/2021 Pirates vs. Diamondbacks
6E6263383138303D3A253F080 wrote: I think it is strange that Tyler Anderson has not started a game since the All Star Break. I keep thinking something is up regarding a trade, but so far no traction.
It is curious. He pitched on the 10th, has been effective, he is scheduled to start tomorrow.
Maybe it is to ensure contenders he isn't over worked.
It is curious. He pitched on the 10th, has been effective, he is scheduled to start tomorrow.
Maybe it is to ensure contenders he isn't over worked.
Official Game Thread 7/19/2021 Pirates vs. Diamondbacks
0134232328112323282F23460 wrote: Polanco is better than half the guys we've had over the past 30 years. Half. 30 years.
He gets paid more. That's all.
We haven't exactly lit things up often.
Better than half of who over the last 30 years? You'll have to provide that list, and I'm not talking guys who cruised through here for a couple of weeks. I mean actual guys that spent most of a season as an OF for the Pirates.
It has nothing to do with what he gets paid. THAT has everything to do with why he's playing now. I don't care his bat is weak, that's in play for most of them. It's the liability in the field.
So, going by your claim, I'll go back to at least when Polanco started playing, and using WAR. You can use whatever else to supplement your claim.
2020- Had the worst WAR for the ENTIRE TEAM
2019-Only Melky Cabrera had a worse WAR in the OF, however, he played twice as many games. Polanco was on pace to be worse than him.
2018-Ranked 5th on team in WAR, but behind fellow OF's Marte and Dickerson. His second best year.
2017- Lowest of all regular OF. Was able to end up in a tie with Gift Ngoepe though.
2016-Behind Marte,Harrison, Joyce, Rodriguez
2015-Part of the "dream OF", had his best season, 5th on the team in WAR behind Cutch, Marte, Kang, and Cervelli.
2014-Behind Cutch, Marte, Harrison, Snider
He has three seasons where he's below replacement level, 3 seasons where he is substitute level, and 2 seasons at a starter level.
He hasn't been better than half the team but twice, was never higher than the third best OF on the team. Considering they usually carried 4-5 OF types, you have a tough argument to prove.
But if you want to compare him over every Tom, Dick, and Harry that has passed through the past 30 years, go for it. This is an argument you can't win, but you can't lose either.
He gets paid more. That's all.
We haven't exactly lit things up often.
Better than half of who over the last 30 years? You'll have to provide that list, and I'm not talking guys who cruised through here for a couple of weeks. I mean actual guys that spent most of a season as an OF for the Pirates.
It has nothing to do with what he gets paid. THAT has everything to do with why he's playing now. I don't care his bat is weak, that's in play for most of them. It's the liability in the field.
So, going by your claim, I'll go back to at least when Polanco started playing, and using WAR. You can use whatever else to supplement your claim.
2020- Had the worst WAR for the ENTIRE TEAM
2019-Only Melky Cabrera had a worse WAR in the OF, however, he played twice as many games. Polanco was on pace to be worse than him.
2018-Ranked 5th on team in WAR, but behind fellow OF's Marte and Dickerson. His second best year.
2017- Lowest of all regular OF. Was able to end up in a tie with Gift Ngoepe though.
2016-Behind Marte,Harrison, Joyce, Rodriguez
2015-Part of the "dream OF", had his best season, 5th on the team in WAR behind Cutch, Marte, Kang, and Cervelli.
2014-Behind Cutch, Marte, Harrison, Snider
He has three seasons where he's below replacement level, 3 seasons where he is substitute level, and 2 seasons at a starter level.
He hasn't been better than half the team but twice, was never higher than the third best OF on the team. Considering they usually carried 4-5 OF types, you have a tough argument to prove.
But if you want to compare him over every Tom, Dick, and Harry that has passed through the past 30 years, go for it. This is an argument you can't win, but you can't lose either.
Official Game Thread 7/19/2021 Pirates vs. Diamondbacks
173130273121520 wrote: I think it is strange that Tyler Anderson has not started a game since the All Star Break. I keep thinking something is up regarding a trade, but so far no traction.
It is curious. He pitched on the 10th, has been effective, he is scheduled to start tomorrow.
Maybe it is to ensure contenders he isn't over worked.
He's listed as the starter for Tuesday. I agree though, I thought something was up with him
It is curious. He pitched on the 10th, has been effective, he is scheduled to start tomorrow.
Maybe it is to ensure contenders he isn't over worked.
He's listed as the starter for Tuesday. I agree though, I thought something was up with him
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GreenWeenie
- Posts: 4012
- Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2020 3:47 pm
Official Game Thread 7/19/2021 Pirates vs. Diamondbacks
44626570797562747C170 wrote: Polanco is better than half the guys we've had over the past 30 years. Half. 30 years.
He gets paid more. That's all.
We haven't exactly lit things up often.
Better than half of who over the last 30 years? You'll have to provide that list, and I'm not talking guys who cruised through here for a couple of weeks. I mean actual guys that spent most of a season as an OF for the Pirates.
It has nothing to do with what he gets paid. THAT has everything to do with why he's playing now. I don't care his bat is weak, that's in play for most of them. It's the liability in the field.
So, going by your claim, I'll go back to at least when Polanco started playing, and using WAR. You can use whatever else to supplement your claim.
2020- Had the worst WAR for the ENTIRE TEAM
2019-Only Melky Cabrera had a worse WAR in the OF, however, he played twice as many games. Polanco was on pace to be worse than him.
2018-Ranked 5th on team in WAR, but behind fellow OF's Marte and Dickerson. His second best year.
2017- Lowest of all regular OF. Was able to end up in a tie with Gift Ngoepe though.
2016-Behind Marte,Harrison, Joyce, Rodriguez
2015-Part of the "dream OF", had his best season, 5th on the team in WAR behind Cutch, Marte, Kang, and Cervelli.
2014-Behind Cutch, Marte, Harrison, Snider
He has three seasons where he's below replacement level, 3 seasons where he is substitute level, and 2 seasons at a starter level.
He hasn't been better than half the team but twice, was never higher than the third best OF on the team. Considering they usually carried 4-5 OF types, you have a tough argument to prove.
But if you want to compare him over every Tom, Dick, and Harry that has passed through the past 30 years, go for it. This is an argument you can't win, but you can't lose either.
We've had how many hundreds of guys pass through over the years. Many. Just look at this year alone. Multiply it by close to 30 for a rough estimate.
We've had very few good years, you have to admit.
Why not? Because > half the players we've had were worse than the guy these guys complain about. Many are guys that even you would struggle to even remember being on the club.
He gets paid more. That's all.
We haven't exactly lit things up often.
Better than half of who over the last 30 years? You'll have to provide that list, and I'm not talking guys who cruised through here for a couple of weeks. I mean actual guys that spent most of a season as an OF for the Pirates.
It has nothing to do with what he gets paid. THAT has everything to do with why he's playing now. I don't care his bat is weak, that's in play for most of them. It's the liability in the field.
So, going by your claim, I'll go back to at least when Polanco started playing, and using WAR. You can use whatever else to supplement your claim.
2020- Had the worst WAR for the ENTIRE TEAM
2019-Only Melky Cabrera had a worse WAR in the OF, however, he played twice as many games. Polanco was on pace to be worse than him.
2018-Ranked 5th on team in WAR, but behind fellow OF's Marte and Dickerson. His second best year.
2017- Lowest of all regular OF. Was able to end up in a tie with Gift Ngoepe though.
2016-Behind Marte,Harrison, Joyce, Rodriguez
2015-Part of the "dream OF", had his best season, 5th on the team in WAR behind Cutch, Marte, Kang, and Cervelli.
2014-Behind Cutch, Marte, Harrison, Snider
He has three seasons where he's below replacement level, 3 seasons where he is substitute level, and 2 seasons at a starter level.
He hasn't been better than half the team but twice, was never higher than the third best OF on the team. Considering they usually carried 4-5 OF types, you have a tough argument to prove.
But if you want to compare him over every Tom, Dick, and Harry that has passed through the past 30 years, go for it. This is an argument you can't win, but you can't lose either.
We've had how many hundreds of guys pass through over the years. Many. Just look at this year alone. Multiply it by close to 30 for a rough estimate.
We've had very few good years, you have to admit.
Why not? Because > half the players we've had were worse than the guy these guys complain about. Many are guys that even you would struggle to even remember being on the club.
Official Game Thread 7/19/2021 Pirates vs. Diamondbacks
4B7E6969625B69696265690C0 wrote: Polanco is better than half the guys we've had over the past 30 years. Half. 30 years.
He gets paid more. That's all.
We haven't exactly lit things up often.
Better than half of who over the last 30 years? You'll have to provide that list, and I'm not talking guys who cruised through here for a couple of weeks. I mean actual guys that spent most of a season as an OF for the Pirates.
It has nothing to do with what he gets paid. THAT has everything to do with why he's playing now. I don't care his bat is weak, that's in play for most of them. It's the liability in the field.
So, going by your claim, I'll go back to at least when Polanco started playing, and using WAR. You can use whatever else to supplement your claim.
2020- Had the worst WAR for the ENTIRE TEAM
2019-Only Melky Cabrera had a worse WAR in the OF, however, he played twice as many games. Polanco was on pace to be worse than him.
2018-Ranked 5th on team in WAR, but behind fellow OF's Marte and Dickerson. His second best year.
2017- Lowest of all regular OF. Was able to end up in a tie with Gift Ngoepe though.
2016-Behind Marte,Harrison, Joyce, Rodriguez
2015-Part of the "dream OF", had his best season, 5th on the team in WAR behind Cutch, Marte, Kang, and Cervelli.
2014-Behind Cutch, Marte, Harrison, Snider
He has three seasons where he's below replacement level, 3 seasons where he is substitute level, and 2 seasons at a starter level.
He hasn't been better than half the team but twice, was never higher than the third best OF on the team. Considering they usually carried 4-5 OF types, you have a tough argument to prove.
But if you want to compare him over every Tom, Dick, and Harry that has passed through the past 30 years, go for it. This is an argument you can't win, but you can't lose either.
We've had how many hundreds of guys pass through over the years. Many. Just look at this year alone. Multiply it by close to 30 for a rough estimate.
We've had very few good years, you have to admit.
Why not? Because > half the players we've had were worse than the guy these guys complain about. Many are guys that even you would struggle to even remember being on the club.
That's because many of those guys didn't receive albatross level contracts or hype. When he hasn't been better than half of the guys on the teams he's played for except once, and just barely a second time, yes, it's easy to say you are 100% wrong. The only difference between him and all the other flotsam and jetsam you claim he's so much better than is he got to stick around for us to complain about.
You're out of your depth on this one. It was a horrific contract made on a bunch of hype and hope. That's why you know his name, it isn't because of him being "better".
Again, you can't win and you can't lose this argument because you can set the parameters anyway you want. But when one of his positive WAR years ties him with the immortal Gift Ngoepe, I'm pretty certain you'll have a harder time proving your claim than I will proving you wrong. I've already done it for his Pirates career, which will be 8 seasons when this one is done, and he's certainly not better than half of this team either. You can dig up the previous 22. Good luck.
He gets paid more. That's all.
We haven't exactly lit things up often.
Better than half of who over the last 30 years? You'll have to provide that list, and I'm not talking guys who cruised through here for a couple of weeks. I mean actual guys that spent most of a season as an OF for the Pirates.
It has nothing to do with what he gets paid. THAT has everything to do with why he's playing now. I don't care his bat is weak, that's in play for most of them. It's the liability in the field.
So, going by your claim, I'll go back to at least when Polanco started playing, and using WAR. You can use whatever else to supplement your claim.
2020- Had the worst WAR for the ENTIRE TEAM
2019-Only Melky Cabrera had a worse WAR in the OF, however, he played twice as many games. Polanco was on pace to be worse than him.
2018-Ranked 5th on team in WAR, but behind fellow OF's Marte and Dickerson. His second best year.
2017- Lowest of all regular OF. Was able to end up in a tie with Gift Ngoepe though.
2016-Behind Marte,Harrison, Joyce, Rodriguez
2015-Part of the "dream OF", had his best season, 5th on the team in WAR behind Cutch, Marte, Kang, and Cervelli.
2014-Behind Cutch, Marte, Harrison, Snider
He has three seasons where he's below replacement level, 3 seasons where he is substitute level, and 2 seasons at a starter level.
He hasn't been better than half the team but twice, was never higher than the third best OF on the team. Considering they usually carried 4-5 OF types, you have a tough argument to prove.
But if you want to compare him over every Tom, Dick, and Harry that has passed through the past 30 years, go for it. This is an argument you can't win, but you can't lose either.
We've had how many hundreds of guys pass through over the years. Many. Just look at this year alone. Multiply it by close to 30 for a rough estimate.
We've had very few good years, you have to admit.
Why not? Because > half the players we've had were worse than the guy these guys complain about. Many are guys that even you would struggle to even remember being on the club.
That's because many of those guys didn't receive albatross level contracts or hype. When he hasn't been better than half of the guys on the teams he's played for except once, and just barely a second time, yes, it's easy to say you are 100% wrong. The only difference between him and all the other flotsam and jetsam you claim he's so much better than is he got to stick around for us to complain about.
You're out of your depth on this one. It was a horrific contract made on a bunch of hype and hope. That's why you know his name, it isn't because of him being "better".
Again, you can't win and you can't lose this argument because you can set the parameters anyway you want. But when one of his positive WAR years ties him with the immortal Gift Ngoepe, I'm pretty certain you'll have a harder time proving your claim than I will proving you wrong. I've already done it for his Pirates career, which will be 8 seasons when this one is done, and he's certainly not better than half of this team either. You can dig up the previous 22. Good luck.
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GreenWeenie
- Posts: 4012
- Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2020 3:47 pm
Official Game Thread 7/19/2021 Pirates vs. Diamondbacks
406661747D71667078130 wrote: Polanco is better than half the guys we've had over the past 30 years. Half. 30 years.
He gets paid more. That's all.
We haven't exactly lit things up often.
Better than half of who over the last 30 years? You'll have to provide that list, and I'm not talking guys who cruised through here for a couple of weeks. I mean actual guys that spent most of a season as an OF for the Pirates.
It has nothing to do with what he gets paid. THAT has everything to do with why he's playing now. I don't care his bat is weak, that's in play for most of them. It's the liability in the field.
So, going by your claim, I'll go back to at least when Polanco started playing, and using WAR. You can use whatever else to supplement your claim.
2020- Had the worst WAR for the ENTIRE TEAM
2019-Only Melky Cabrera had a worse WAR in the OF, however, he played twice as many games. Polanco was on pace to be worse than him.
2018-Ranked 5th on team in WAR, but behind fellow OF's Marte and Dickerson. His second best year.
2017- Lowest of all regular OF. Was able to end up in a tie with Gift Ngoepe though.
2016-Behind Marte,Harrison, Joyce, Rodriguez
2015-Part of the "dream OF", had his best season, 5th on the team in WAR behind Cutch, Marte, Kang, and Cervelli.
2014-Behind Cutch, Marte, Harrison, Snider
He has three seasons where he's below replacement level, 3 seasons where he is substitute level, and 2 seasons at a starter level.
He hasn't been better than half the team but twice, was never higher than the third best OF on the team. Considering they usually carried 4-5 OF types, you have a tough argument to prove.
But if you want to compare him over every Tom, Dick, and Harry that has passed through the past 30 years, go for it. This is an argument you can't win, but you can't lose either.
We've had how many hundreds of guys pass through over the years. Many. Just look at this year alone. Multiply it by close to 30 for a rough estimate.
We've had very few good years, you have to admit.
Why not? Because > half the players we've had were worse than the guy these guys complain about. Many are guys that even you would struggle to even remember being on the club.
That's because many of those guys didn't receive albatross level contracts or hype. When he hasn't been better than half of the guys on the teams he's played for except once, and just barely a second time, yes, it's easy to say you are 100% wrong. The only difference between him and all the other flotsam and jetsam you claim he's so much better than is he got to stick around for us to complain about.
You're out of your depth on this one. It was a horrific contract made on a bunch of hype and hope. That's why you know his name, it isn't because of him being "better".
Again, you can't win and you can't lose this argument because you can set the parameters anyway you want. But when one of his positive WAR years ties him with the immortal Gift Ngoepe, I'm pretty certain you'll have a harder time proving your claim than I will proving you wrong. I've already done it for his Pirates career, which will be 8 seasons when this one is done, and he's certainly not better than half of this team either. You can dig up the previous 22. Good luck.
It's for a few reasons.
I'll begin with less than desirable talent evaluation.
We dump McCutchen and Marte. We keep Polanco.
Not the first time by any means. I sense that it won't be the last.
The contract wasn't the problem. The problem was to whom they chose to give it. $11million was reasonable for a veteran player. If the Pirates can't afford it, then time to close the doors.
The albatross is poor executive decisions. We're paying the price for a few.
He gets paid more. That's all.
We haven't exactly lit things up often.
Better than half of who over the last 30 years? You'll have to provide that list, and I'm not talking guys who cruised through here for a couple of weeks. I mean actual guys that spent most of a season as an OF for the Pirates.
It has nothing to do with what he gets paid. THAT has everything to do with why he's playing now. I don't care his bat is weak, that's in play for most of them. It's the liability in the field.
So, going by your claim, I'll go back to at least when Polanco started playing, and using WAR. You can use whatever else to supplement your claim.
2020- Had the worst WAR for the ENTIRE TEAM
2019-Only Melky Cabrera had a worse WAR in the OF, however, he played twice as many games. Polanco was on pace to be worse than him.
2018-Ranked 5th on team in WAR, but behind fellow OF's Marte and Dickerson. His second best year.
2017- Lowest of all regular OF. Was able to end up in a tie with Gift Ngoepe though.
2016-Behind Marte,Harrison, Joyce, Rodriguez
2015-Part of the "dream OF", had his best season, 5th on the team in WAR behind Cutch, Marte, Kang, and Cervelli.
2014-Behind Cutch, Marte, Harrison, Snider
He has three seasons where he's below replacement level, 3 seasons where he is substitute level, and 2 seasons at a starter level.
He hasn't been better than half the team but twice, was never higher than the third best OF on the team. Considering they usually carried 4-5 OF types, you have a tough argument to prove.
But if you want to compare him over every Tom, Dick, and Harry that has passed through the past 30 years, go for it. This is an argument you can't win, but you can't lose either.
We've had how many hundreds of guys pass through over the years. Many. Just look at this year alone. Multiply it by close to 30 for a rough estimate.
We've had very few good years, you have to admit.
Why not? Because > half the players we've had were worse than the guy these guys complain about. Many are guys that even you would struggle to even remember being on the club.
That's because many of those guys didn't receive albatross level contracts or hype. When he hasn't been better than half of the guys on the teams he's played for except once, and just barely a second time, yes, it's easy to say you are 100% wrong. The only difference between him and all the other flotsam and jetsam you claim he's so much better than is he got to stick around for us to complain about.
You're out of your depth on this one. It was a horrific contract made on a bunch of hype and hope. That's why you know his name, it isn't because of him being "better".
Again, you can't win and you can't lose this argument because you can set the parameters anyway you want. But when one of his positive WAR years ties him with the immortal Gift Ngoepe, I'm pretty certain you'll have a harder time proving your claim than I will proving you wrong. I've already done it for his Pirates career, which will be 8 seasons when this one is done, and he's certainly not better than half of this team either. You can dig up the previous 22. Good luck.
It's for a few reasons.
I'll begin with less than desirable talent evaluation.
We dump McCutchen and Marte. We keep Polanco.
Not the first time by any means. I sense that it won't be the last.
The contract wasn't the problem. The problem was to whom they chose to give it. $11million was reasonable for a veteran player. If the Pirates can't afford it, then time to close the doors.
The albatross is poor executive decisions. We're paying the price for a few.
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WildwoodDave2
Official Game Thread 7/19/2021 Pirates vs. Diamondbacks
015741555A40505B564173545E525A5F1D50330 wrote: It’s a really good day when Polanco’s out of the line-up.
and it's a bad day when Frazier is out of the lineup
and it's a bad day when Frazier is out of the lineup
Official Game Thread 7/19/2021 Pirates vs. Diamondbacks
675245454E7745454E4945200 wrote:
We dump McCutchen and Marte. We keep Polanco.
Not the first time by any means. I sense that it won't be the last.
The contract wasn't the problem. The problem was to whom they chose to give it. $11million was reasonable for a veteran player. If the Pirates can't afford it, then time to close the doors.
The albatross is poor executive decisions. We're paying the price for a few.
You're turning this even more laughable by the minute. Dumped Cutch and Marte, but "kept" Polanco? If they could have dumped Polanco, they would have and we'd probably still have Marte. THAT'S how bad Polanco is.
Spin it all you want, but you've also spun it away from your original argument.
it was a horrendous contract, but are the Pirates the only ones to do so? Of course not. Yeah, no kidding Sherlock it was an executive decision, who else makes those? You and I?
You still haven't remotely tried to justify him being "better than half of the players in the last 30 years". I already showed you 7, this year will make 8 where you're wrong. I'll go out on a limb and say that you can scratch 90-92 off your list too, just to save you time. You're now down to 19 years to make your case.
We dump McCutchen and Marte. We keep Polanco.
Not the first time by any means. I sense that it won't be the last.
The contract wasn't the problem. The problem was to whom they chose to give it. $11million was reasonable for a veteran player. If the Pirates can't afford it, then time to close the doors.
The albatross is poor executive decisions. We're paying the price for a few.
You're turning this even more laughable by the minute. Dumped Cutch and Marte, but "kept" Polanco? If they could have dumped Polanco, they would have and we'd probably still have Marte. THAT'S how bad Polanco is.
Spin it all you want, but you've also spun it away from your original argument.
it was a horrendous contract, but are the Pirates the only ones to do so? Of course not. Yeah, no kidding Sherlock it was an executive decision, who else makes those? You and I?
You still haven't remotely tried to justify him being "better than half of the players in the last 30 years". I already showed you 7, this year will make 8 where you're wrong. I'll go out on a limb and say that you can scratch 90-92 off your list too, just to save you time. You're now down to 19 years to make your case.
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Bobster21
Official Game Thread 7/19/2021 Pirates vs. Diamondbacks
76484D45564E4E456540574413210 wrote: It’s a really good day when Polanco’s out of the line-up.
and it's a bad day when Frazier is out of the lineup
Well, it's been 4 days since the All-Star break. Shelton probably thinks Frazier is exhausted.
and it's a bad day when Frazier is out of the lineup
Well, it's been 4 days since the All-Star break. Shelton probably thinks Frazier is exhausted.