Looks Like We Are Stuck With Lyles
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
Looks Like We Are Stuck With Lyles
Utility guy and backup catcher pitch three innings to an ERA of 3 and WHIP of 0.67.
Looks Like We Are Stuck With Lyles
On the other hand, Carolina Bucco's preseason prediction is looking better and better.
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steve49
Looks Like We Are Stuck With Lyles
7B77762D242D25282F302A1D0 wrote: Bucs were hoping to trade Lyles, but after tonight I would doubt if any team would want him. They should just move him to the bullpen for mop up work.
Let me confirm your "doubts." With certainty , no team will want Lyles.
Let me confirm your "doubts." With certainty , no team will want Lyles.
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CarolinaBucco
Looks Like We Are Stuck With Lyles
Yea ... I have 66-96.
But I'm not sure if we can win 21 more games.
But I'm not sure if we can win 21 more games.
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Bobster21
Looks Like We Are Stuck With Lyles
240203140212610 wrote: I strongly want NH to be replaced as I think his time as GM has more than run its course. I've been neutral on Hurdle but this stretch of play after the All Star game has turned me into the Hurdle must go camp.
The concern I have is that NH may fire Hurdle in order to place blame on him and give himself some breathing room.
I hope Nutting (and Coonley) are smart enough to see that both need to go (wouldn't bother if Frank went too as I think NH, Hurdle and Frank are three peas in a pod).
I believe TBMTIB isn't going anywhere. It's all about "spin" or "optics." If it were about making the Pirates a legit contender it would be different. But that's not what this organization is about. Nutting's objective is to give the impression of making efforts to compete while spending as little as possible to maximize profits. Nutting supposedly assembled "The Best Mgt Team in Baseball." How would it look now if he had to fire one or all? That would certainly make his judgment look very bad for assembling and praising that team when they have accomplished so little (1-2 in WC games and 0-1 in playoffs and then not even a whiff of the post season the next 4 years. ).
Nutting also knows that whoever runs the team will not receive even an average amount of financial resources to build a winner. So a new manager, a new pitching coach, a new GM, a new team president, one or all will not significantly improve the fortunes of the team. A better manager would reduce the unnecessary losses caused by Hurdle but that alone won't be enough. A new pitching coach will still have to work with inexpensive retreads and AAA pitchers on the MLB roster. A new GM might make better trades but still won't be permitted to obtain anyone who comes with a contract commensurate with top level production. Nutting feels the wrath of the fans for his cheap ways but the rest of TBMTIB are closer to the front lines and get more blame from the fans on a daily basis. Replacing those people who currently get a large share of the blame with no substantial improvement due to Nutting's cheapness would prove definitively to the fans that no amount of change will matter as long as Nutting is in control. I think the fans already know this but are distracted on a daily basis by the problems with Hurdle, NH, Searage or whoever is getting blamed. NH has to be aware of this as well and if he recommended a change in managers, the lack of substantial improvement under a new mgr would point the finger at NH as the problem. IMHO, TBMTIB is all about shifting and sharing blame and they need each other to accomplish that.
The concern I have is that NH may fire Hurdle in order to place blame on him and give himself some breathing room.
I hope Nutting (and Coonley) are smart enough to see that both need to go (wouldn't bother if Frank went too as I think NH, Hurdle and Frank are three peas in a pod).
I believe TBMTIB isn't going anywhere. It's all about "spin" or "optics." If it were about making the Pirates a legit contender it would be different. But that's not what this organization is about. Nutting's objective is to give the impression of making efforts to compete while spending as little as possible to maximize profits. Nutting supposedly assembled "The Best Mgt Team in Baseball." How would it look now if he had to fire one or all? That would certainly make his judgment look very bad for assembling and praising that team when they have accomplished so little (1-2 in WC games and 0-1 in playoffs and then not even a whiff of the post season the next 4 years. ).
Nutting also knows that whoever runs the team will not receive even an average amount of financial resources to build a winner. So a new manager, a new pitching coach, a new GM, a new team president, one or all will not significantly improve the fortunes of the team. A better manager would reduce the unnecessary losses caused by Hurdle but that alone won't be enough. A new pitching coach will still have to work with inexpensive retreads and AAA pitchers on the MLB roster. A new GM might make better trades but still won't be permitted to obtain anyone who comes with a contract commensurate with top level production. Nutting feels the wrath of the fans for his cheap ways but the rest of TBMTIB are closer to the front lines and get more blame from the fans on a daily basis. Replacing those people who currently get a large share of the blame with no substantial improvement due to Nutting's cheapness would prove definitively to the fans that no amount of change will matter as long as Nutting is in control. I think the fans already know this but are distracted on a daily basis by the problems with Hurdle, NH, Searage or whoever is getting blamed. NH has to be aware of this as well and if he recommended a change in managers, the lack of substantial improvement under a new mgr would point the finger at NH as the problem. IMHO, TBMTIB is all about shifting and sharing blame and they need each other to accomplish that.
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SteadyFreddy
Looks Like We Are Stuck With Lyles
5D7B7A6D7B6B180 wrote: I strongly want NH to be replaced as I think his time as GM has more than run its course. I've been neutral on Hurdle but this stretch of play after the All Star game has turned me into the Hurdle must go camp.
The concern I have is that NH may fire Hurdle in order to place blame on him and give himself some breathing room.
I hope Nutting (and Coonley) are smart enough to see that both need to go (wouldn't bother if Frank went too as I think NH, Hurdle and Frank are three peas in a pod). I agree and have been saying this for awhile now that both Clint and Neal need to go. You reach a point after awhile where the message just starts getting stale and no progress is being made in the organization. And that’s where we are right now I feel with Clint and Neal. The team has not gotten better since the 2015 98 win season and has gone backwards in the last 3-4 years and has just not progressed both with the GM and with Hurdle and the coaching. Like Bobster said though Nutting will probably do nothing because he is happy with both Neal and Clint being his yes men and doesn’t want to have to go out and search for a new manager and GM. I agree though with you 100 percent though that it’s time for both Clint and Neal to go. Major changes need made especially with this coaching staff and Hurdle. I feel it’s been an absolute disaster this year so far.
The concern I have is that NH may fire Hurdle in order to place blame on him and give himself some breathing room.
I hope Nutting (and Coonley) are smart enough to see that both need to go (wouldn't bother if Frank went too as I think NH, Hurdle and Frank are three peas in a pod). I agree and have been saying this for awhile now that both Clint and Neal need to go. You reach a point after awhile where the message just starts getting stale and no progress is being made in the organization. And that’s where we are right now I feel with Clint and Neal. The team has not gotten better since the 2015 98 win season and has gone backwards in the last 3-4 years and has just not progressed both with the GM and with Hurdle and the coaching. Like Bobster said though Nutting will probably do nothing because he is happy with both Neal and Clint being his yes men and doesn’t want to have to go out and search for a new manager and GM. I agree though with you 100 percent though that it’s time for both Clint and Neal to go. Major changes need made especially with this coaching staff and Hurdle. I feel it’s been an absolute disaster this year so far.
Looks Like We Are Stuck With Lyles
735E53424554430300310 wrote: I strongly want NH to be replaced as I think his time as GM has more than run its course. I've been neutral on Hurdle but this stretch of play after the All Star game has turned me into the Hurdle must go camp.
The concern I have is that NH may fire Hurdle in order to place blame on him and give himself some breathing room.
I hope Nutting (and Coonley) are smart enough to see that both need to go (wouldn't bother if Frank went too as I think NH, Hurdle and Frank are three peas in a pod).
I believe TBMTIB isn't going anywhere. It's all about "spin" or "optics." If it were about making the Pirates a legit contender it would be different. But that's not what this organization is about. Nutting's objective is to give the impression of making efforts to compete while spending as little as possible to maximize profits. Nutting supposedly assembled "The Best Mgt Team in Baseball." How would it look now if he had to fire one or all? That would certainly make his judgment look very bad for assembling and praising that team when they have accomplished so little (1-2 in WC games and 0-1 in playoffs and then not even a whiff of the post season the next 4 years. ).
Nutting also knows that whoever runs the team will not receive even an average amount of financial resources to build a winner. So a new manager, a new pitching coach, a new GM, a new team president, one or all will not significantly improve the fortunes of the team. A better manager would reduce the unnecessary losses caused by Hurdle but that alone won't be enough. A new pitching coach will still have to work with inexpensive retreads and AAA pitchers on the MLB roster. A new GM might make better trades but still won't be permitted to obtain anyone who comes with a contract commensurate with top level production. Nutting feels the wrath of the fans for his cheap ways but the rest of TBMTIB are closer to the front lines and get more blame from the fans on a daily basis. Replacing those people who currently get a large share of the blame with no substantial improvement due to Nutting's cheapness would prove definitively to the fans that no amount of change will matter as long as Nutting is in control. I think the fans already know this but are distracted on a daily basis by the problems with Hurdle, NH, Searage or whoever is getting blamed. NH has to be aware of this as well and if he recommended a change in managers, the lack of substantial improvement under a new mgr would point the finger at NH as the problem. IMHO, TBMTIB is all about shifting and sharing blame and they need each other to accomplish that.
I basically agree with this, especially about Nutting. I can even understand Nutting and Coonley feeling this way.
However, NH is another story, he says he wants to win and he is a baseball man. I would think he would be dying to get out of Pittsburgh and go somewhere we had a chance to win. To me it shows a lack of integrity on his part.
NH knows what is going on and yet stays and even worse lies to fans about it.
The concern I have is that NH may fire Hurdle in order to place blame on him and give himself some breathing room.
I hope Nutting (and Coonley) are smart enough to see that both need to go (wouldn't bother if Frank went too as I think NH, Hurdle and Frank are three peas in a pod).
I believe TBMTIB isn't going anywhere. It's all about "spin" or "optics." If it were about making the Pirates a legit contender it would be different. But that's not what this organization is about. Nutting's objective is to give the impression of making efforts to compete while spending as little as possible to maximize profits. Nutting supposedly assembled "The Best Mgt Team in Baseball." How would it look now if he had to fire one or all? That would certainly make his judgment look very bad for assembling and praising that team when they have accomplished so little (1-2 in WC games and 0-1 in playoffs and then not even a whiff of the post season the next 4 years. ).
Nutting also knows that whoever runs the team will not receive even an average amount of financial resources to build a winner. So a new manager, a new pitching coach, a new GM, a new team president, one or all will not significantly improve the fortunes of the team. A better manager would reduce the unnecessary losses caused by Hurdle but that alone won't be enough. A new pitching coach will still have to work with inexpensive retreads and AAA pitchers on the MLB roster. A new GM might make better trades but still won't be permitted to obtain anyone who comes with a contract commensurate with top level production. Nutting feels the wrath of the fans for his cheap ways but the rest of TBMTIB are closer to the front lines and get more blame from the fans on a daily basis. Replacing those people who currently get a large share of the blame with no substantial improvement due to Nutting's cheapness would prove definitively to the fans that no amount of change will matter as long as Nutting is in control. I think the fans already know this but are distracted on a daily basis by the problems with Hurdle, NH, Searage or whoever is getting blamed. NH has to be aware of this as well and if he recommended a change in managers, the lack of substantial improvement under a new mgr would point the finger at NH as the problem. IMHO, TBMTIB is all about shifting and sharing blame and they need each other to accomplish that.
I basically agree with this, especially about Nutting. I can even understand Nutting and Coonley feeling this way.
However, NH is another story, he says he wants to win and he is a baseball man. I would think he would be dying to get out of Pittsburgh and go somewhere we had a chance to win. To me it shows a lack of integrity on his part.
NH knows what is going on and yet stays and even worse lies to fans about it.
Looks Like We Are Stuck With Lyles
I agree that Lyles should be a bullpen guy for the rest of the year. Time for Keller to come up and stay up and pitch every 5th day for the balance of the season.
Looks Like We Are Stuck With Lyles
I suspect we'll see a number of promotions once the trade deadline passes. We should get an early look at next year's team.
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SteadyFreddy
Looks Like We Are Stuck With Lyles
I really expect the Vazquez trade rumors to heat up with this news on Taillon now potentially needing Tommy John again and missing next season. I think it definitely needs to be looked at a lot more given this recent news.