0A272A3B3C2D3A7A79480 wrote: https://blogs.fangraphs.com/gregory-pol ... fferently/
Polanco was missing meatballs down the middle. He had very obvious swing issues and did not look comfortable. Trading or releasing him because he costs too much would be unwise. [highlight]He is exactly the player the Pirates should be trading FOR, not trading away.[/highlight]
So you want the Pirates to continue winning less than a third of their games?
They are going to lose most of their games next year no matter who the RF is.
Exactly. So why continue down that path of losing with a guy who won't reach the potential projected and won't be here after this next season? Better to find someone else as soon as possible who can become better than Polanco and will be here for 4-5 years.
Currently, that player does not exist. Having Polanco on the roster does not prevent them from finding that player. Releasing Polanco just because your opinion on him would be silly. The Pirates are smarter than that. You dont pay a player $11M to go away and let some other team benefit.
Of course that player exists. There are probably plenty of them. It's just a matter of Cherington and his staff being able to find that guy.
Having Polanco on the roster makes it more difficult to sit him on the bench because the temptation will persist to play him, which is a waste of time. Out of sight, out of mind.
It doesn't matter what Polanco is getting paid. He's due the money whether he plays or not, whether he's released or not. Why would the Pirates continue to play him for the next year when he's below average in nearly every way when he could be replaced by a guy who could be better and be playing for the next five?
Polanco wouldn't be the first player, or the first Pirate, who was "paid to go away".
Big difference paying Archer 500K to go away than the price tag on Polanco at this stage.
I acknowledge that. But the point remains that the Pirates have to pay him regardless. So the RF position will cost either Polanco's $11 million salary, or his $11 million salary plus the salary of whoever replaces him. The only question to answer is whether that marginal money is worth paying to have a better player at that position. For me, the answer is obvious.
This is not to say that I believe the Pirates will release him. I don't think they will, I just believe they should. I believe he makes the line-up worse. I want the team to win as many games as possible and I believe that's more likely with another player in RF.
Doc, I hear ya. But we know they won't release him and eat the contract even if it made them a better team. And there's no harm in opening the season with him and seeing if he can get hot and become tradeable even if they have to eat some but not all of his salary.
A more acute example of your point is the Orioles with Chris Davis. After a strong 2015 (.262, 47 HRs, 117 RBIs) he signed a 7-year deal for 23 million per year and no buyout clause. Since then he has hit .221, .215, .168, .179 and .115 with HRs dwindling from 38 to 26 to 16 to 12 to 0. He gets his 23 million per year thru 2022 regardless while providing nothing that couldn't be improved upon by a LMG. So by adding the minimum salary of over $560,000 to the payroll they could pay a better player to replace Davis and pay Davis not to play. Davis' money is guaranteed regardless so all it costs is the additional minimum salary to get better production.
Of course Polanco is not as bad as Davis or paid nearly as much. But it shows how reluctant teams are to release a high paid player even if they could replace him for minimum salary and get better results.
Completely agree. The Pirates won't release him and will hope beyond hope that he plays well when the season begins, then hope another team needs an outfielder, then hope that team's fooled enough to think he's the answer. I'll get out my rosary beads tonight and start a Novena.
Adam Frazier
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
Adam Frazier
I predict Polanco will hit 25 HR's and bat .260 next year and Cherington will salary dump him and replace him with a LMG and then blubber about how great the LMG will be in the future. Meantime BOB will pocket the cash. CHA-CHING!
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2drfischer@gmail.c
Adam Frazier
7C676A6B626E610F0 wrote: I predict Polanco will hit 25 HR's and bat .260 next year and Cherington will salary dump him and replace him with a LMG and then blubber about how great the LMG will be in the future. Meantime BOB will pocket the cash. CHA-CHING!
That would be the best possible scenario. And I thought you were an avowed capitalist. Why do you begrudge a person making profit?
That would be the best possible scenario. And I thought you were an avowed capitalist. Why do you begrudge a person making profit?
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WildwoodDave
- Posts: 568
- Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2020 11:19 am
Adam Frazier
0C5A4C58574D5D565B4C7E59535F5752105D3E0 wrote: I predict Polanco will hit 25 HR's and bat .260 next year and Cherington will salary dump him and replace him with a LMG and then blubber about how great the LMG will be in the future. Meantime BOB will pocket the cash. CHA-CHING!
That would be the best possible scenario. And I thought you were an avowed capitalist. Why do you begrudge a person making profit?
saying Polanco will hit 25 Hrs and bat 260 in 2021 is equivalent to saying
that you will have two consecutive hole-in ones ;D
That would be the best possible scenario. And I thought you were an avowed capitalist. Why do you begrudge a person making profit?
saying Polanco will hit 25 Hrs and bat 260 in 2021 is equivalent to saying
that you will have two consecutive hole-in ones ;D
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Bobster21
Adam Frazier
7A616C6D646867090 wrote: I predict Polanco will hit 25 HR's and bat .260 next year and Cherington will salary dump him and replace him with a LMG and then blubber about how great the LMG will be in the future. Meantime BOB will pocket the cash. CHA-CHING!
Career highs in both HRs and BA? He doesn't seem to be trending for a career year. I hope you're right but those month long slumps of his probably won't cooperate.
Career highs in both HRs and BA? He doesn't seem to be trending for a career year. I hope you're right but those month long slumps of his probably won't cooperate.
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2drfischer@gmail.c
Adam Frazier
635D5850435B5B5070554251340 wrote: I predict Polanco will hit 25 HR's and bat .260 next year and Cherington will salary dump him and replace him with a LMG and then blubber about how great the LMG will be in the future. Meantime BOB will pocket the cash. CHA-CHING!
That would be the best possible scenario. And I thought you were an avowed capitalist. Why do you begrudge a person making profit?
saying Polanco will hit 25 Hrs and bat 260 in 2021 is equivalent to saying
that you will have two consecutive hole-in ones ;D
I'm resigned that I'll never get one. :'(
That would be the best possible scenario. And I thought you were an avowed capitalist. Why do you begrudge a person making profit?
saying Polanco will hit 25 Hrs and bat 260 in 2021 is equivalent to saying
that you will have two consecutive hole-in ones ;D
I'm resigned that I'll never get one. :'(
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BellevueBuc
- Posts: 343
- Joined: Fri Nov 06, 2020 1:41 pm
Adam Frazier
1B4D5B4F405A4A414C5B694E44484045074A290 wrote: https://blogs.fangraphs.com/gregory-pol ... fferently/
Polanco was missing meatballs down the middle. He had very obvious swing issues and did not look comfortable. Trading or releasing him because he costs too much would be unwise. [highlight]He is exactly the player the Pirates should be trading FOR, not trading away.[/highlight]
So you want the Pirates to continue winning less than a third of their games?
They are going to lose most of their games next year no matter who the RF is.
Exactly. So why continue down that path of losing with a guy who won't reach the potential projected and won't be here after this next season? Better to find someone else as soon as possible who can become better than Polanco and will be here for 4-5 years.
Currently, that player does not exist. Having Polanco on the roster does not prevent them from finding that player. Releasing Polanco just because your opinion on him would be silly. The Pirates are smarter than that. You dont pay a player $11M to go away and let some other team benefit.
Of course that player exists. There are probably plenty of them. It's just a matter of Cherington and his staff being able to find that guy.
Having Polanco on the roster makes it more difficult to sit him on the bench because the temptation will persist to play him, which is a waste of time. Out of sight, out of mind.
It doesn't matter what Polanco is getting paid. He's due the money whether he plays or not, whether he's released or not. Why would the Pirates continue to play him for the next year when he's below average in nearly every way when he could be replaced by a guy who could be better and be playing for the next five?
Polanco wouldn't be the first player, or the first Pirate, who was "paid to go away".
That player does not exist or you would have named him.
Polanco's salary is very relevant. They pay him no matter what. They lose nothing keeping him into next year. They most certainly lose something by releasing him today, with zero better options.
Polanco was missing meatballs down the middle. He had very obvious swing issues and did not look comfortable. Trading or releasing him because he costs too much would be unwise. [highlight]He is exactly the player the Pirates should be trading FOR, not trading away.[/highlight]
So you want the Pirates to continue winning less than a third of their games?
They are going to lose most of their games next year no matter who the RF is.
Exactly. So why continue down that path of losing with a guy who won't reach the potential projected and won't be here after this next season? Better to find someone else as soon as possible who can become better than Polanco and will be here for 4-5 years.
Currently, that player does not exist. Having Polanco on the roster does not prevent them from finding that player. Releasing Polanco just because your opinion on him would be silly. The Pirates are smarter than that. You dont pay a player $11M to go away and let some other team benefit.
Of course that player exists. There are probably plenty of them. It's just a matter of Cherington and his staff being able to find that guy.
Having Polanco on the roster makes it more difficult to sit him on the bench because the temptation will persist to play him, which is a waste of time. Out of sight, out of mind.
It doesn't matter what Polanco is getting paid. He's due the money whether he plays or not, whether he's released or not. Why would the Pirates continue to play him for the next year when he's below average in nearly every way when he could be replaced by a guy who could be better and be playing for the next five?
Polanco wouldn't be the first player, or the first Pirate, who was "paid to go away".
That player does not exist or you would have named him.
Polanco's salary is very relevant. They pay him no matter what. They lose nothing keeping him into next year. They most certainly lose something by releasing him today, with zero better options.
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BellevueBuc
- Posts: 343
- Joined: Fri Nov 06, 2020 1:41 pm
Adam Frazier
0313122533333F500 wrote: https://blogs.fangraphs.com/gregory-pol ... fferently/
Polanco was missing meatballs down the middle. He had very obvious swing issues and did not look comfortable. Trading or releasing him because he costs too much would be unwise. [highlight]He is exactly the player the Pirates should be trading FOR, not trading away.[/highlight]
So you want the Pirates to continue winning less than a third of their games?
They are going to lose most of their games next year no matter who the RF is.
Exactly. So why continue down that path of losing with a guy who won't reach the potential projected and won't be here after this next season? Better to find someone else as soon as possible who can become better than Polanco and will be here for 4-5 years.
Currently, that player does not exist. Having Polanco on the roster does not prevent them from finding that player. Releasing Polanco just because your opinion on him would be silly. The Pirates are smarter than that. You dont pay a player $11M to go away and let some other team benefit.
Of course that player exists. There are probably plenty of them. It's just a matter of Cherington and his staff being able to find that guy.
Having Polanco on the roster makes it more difficult to sit him on the bench because the temptation will persist to play him, which is a waste of time. Out of sight, out of mind.
It doesn't matter what Polanco is getting paid. He's due the money whether he plays or not, whether he's released or not. Why would the Pirates continue to play him for the next year when he's below average in nearly every way when he could be replaced by a guy who could be better and be playing for the next five?
Polanco wouldn't be the first player, or the first Pirate, who was "paid to go away".
Big difference paying Archer 500K to go away than the price tag on Polanco at this stage.
Huge difference. And they also have players to take over for Archer.
The idea of paying someone to go away with zero replacement is backwards.
Polanco was missing meatballs down the middle. He had very obvious swing issues and did not look comfortable. Trading or releasing him because he costs too much would be unwise. [highlight]He is exactly the player the Pirates should be trading FOR, not trading away.[/highlight]
So you want the Pirates to continue winning less than a third of their games?
They are going to lose most of their games next year no matter who the RF is.
Exactly. So why continue down that path of losing with a guy who won't reach the potential projected and won't be here after this next season? Better to find someone else as soon as possible who can become better than Polanco and will be here for 4-5 years.
Currently, that player does not exist. Having Polanco on the roster does not prevent them from finding that player. Releasing Polanco just because your opinion on him would be silly. The Pirates are smarter than that. You dont pay a player $11M to go away and let some other team benefit.
Of course that player exists. There are probably plenty of them. It's just a matter of Cherington and his staff being able to find that guy.
Having Polanco on the roster makes it more difficult to sit him on the bench because the temptation will persist to play him, which is a waste of time. Out of sight, out of mind.
It doesn't matter what Polanco is getting paid. He's due the money whether he plays or not, whether he's released or not. Why would the Pirates continue to play him for the next year when he's below average in nearly every way when he could be replaced by a guy who could be better and be playing for the next five?
Polanco wouldn't be the first player, or the first Pirate, who was "paid to go away".
Big difference paying Archer 500K to go away than the price tag on Polanco at this stage.
Huge difference. And they also have players to take over for Archer.
The idea of paying someone to go away with zero replacement is backwards.
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BellevueBuc
- Posts: 343
- Joined: Fri Nov 06, 2020 1:41 pm
Adam Frazier
4A515C5D545857390 wrote: I predict Polanco will hit 25 HR's and bat .260 next year and Cherington will salary dump him and replace him with a LMG and then blubber about how great the LMG will be in the future. Meantime BOB will pocket the cash. CHA-CHING!
This is not an unlikely scenario. He was on a 25 HR pace this year, and he does not even have to get his timing completely back to end up hitting .220. Not at all out of line to think he will have a season like Nick Castellanos, Yoan Moncada, Ramon Laureano, Luis Robert, or Adam Duvall (Plus some others). Nothing wrong with that.
This is not an unlikely scenario. He was on a 25 HR pace this year, and he does not even have to get his timing completely back to end up hitting .220. Not at all out of line to think he will have a season like Nick Castellanos, Yoan Moncada, Ramon Laureano, Luis Robert, or Adam Duvall (Plus some others). Nothing wrong with that.
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2drfischer@gmail.c
Adam Frazier
684F46464F5C5F4F685F492A0 wrote: https://blogs.fangraphs.com/gregory-pol ... fferently/
Polanco was missing meatballs down the middle. He had very obvious swing issues and did not look comfortable. Trading or releasing him because he costs too much would be unwise. [highlight]He is exactly the player the Pirates should be trading FOR, not trading away.[/highlight]
So you want the Pirates to continue winning less than a third of their games?
They are going to lose most of their games next year no matter who the RF is.
Exactly. So why continue down that path of losing with a guy who won't reach the potential projected and won't be here after this next season? Better to find someone else as soon as possible who can become better than Polanco and will be here for 4-5 years.
Currently, that player does not exist. Having Polanco on the roster does not prevent them from finding that player. Releasing Polanco just because your opinion on him would be silly. The Pirates are smarter than that. You dont pay a player $11M to go away and let some other team benefit.
Of course that player exists. There are probably plenty of them. It's just a matter of Cherington and his staff being able to find that guy.
Having Polanco on the roster makes it more difficult to sit him on the bench because the temptation will persist to play him, which is a waste of time. Out of sight, out of mind.
It doesn't matter what Polanco is getting paid. He's due the money whether he plays or not, whether he's released or not. Why would the Pirates continue to play him for the next year when he's below average in nearly every way when he could be replaced by a guy who could be better and be playing for the next five?
Polanco wouldn't be the first player, or the first Pirate, who was "paid to go away".
That player does not exist or you would have named him.
Polanco's salary is very relevant. They pay him no matter what. They lose nothing keeping him into next year. They most certainly lose something by releasing him today, with zero better options.
Polanco's salary isn't relevant for the very reason you mentioned: they have to pay him regardless. It should matter not at all when making a decision as to what to do with him. The only thing that matters is playing the best man in RF.
I don't work in baseball. It's not my job to find baseball talent, so naming a replacement is out of my realm. But one thing I'm certain of is that there are many young players, several we've never even heard of, who will be replacing current major league players, beginning as soon as next season. It happens every year.
I've yet to see what the Pirates would lose if Polanco were released today. Would it be his handful of HRs? His below average batting average? His multiple strikeouts per game? His frightful outfield play? His head-scratching base running? It's genuinely hard to find any positives with him.
Polanco was missing meatballs down the middle. He had very obvious swing issues and did not look comfortable. Trading or releasing him because he costs too much would be unwise. [highlight]He is exactly the player the Pirates should be trading FOR, not trading away.[/highlight]
So you want the Pirates to continue winning less than a third of their games?
They are going to lose most of their games next year no matter who the RF is.
Exactly. So why continue down that path of losing with a guy who won't reach the potential projected and won't be here after this next season? Better to find someone else as soon as possible who can become better than Polanco and will be here for 4-5 years.
Currently, that player does not exist. Having Polanco on the roster does not prevent them from finding that player. Releasing Polanco just because your opinion on him would be silly. The Pirates are smarter than that. You dont pay a player $11M to go away and let some other team benefit.
Of course that player exists. There are probably plenty of them. It's just a matter of Cherington and his staff being able to find that guy.
Having Polanco on the roster makes it more difficult to sit him on the bench because the temptation will persist to play him, which is a waste of time. Out of sight, out of mind.
It doesn't matter what Polanco is getting paid. He's due the money whether he plays or not, whether he's released or not. Why would the Pirates continue to play him for the next year when he's below average in nearly every way when he could be replaced by a guy who could be better and be playing for the next five?
Polanco wouldn't be the first player, or the first Pirate, who was "paid to go away".
That player does not exist or you would have named him.
Polanco's salary is very relevant. They pay him no matter what. They lose nothing keeping him into next year. They most certainly lose something by releasing him today, with zero better options.
Polanco's salary isn't relevant for the very reason you mentioned: they have to pay him regardless. It should matter not at all when making a decision as to what to do with him. The only thing that matters is playing the best man in RF.
I don't work in baseball. It's not my job to find baseball talent, so naming a replacement is out of my realm. But one thing I'm certain of is that there are many young players, several we've never even heard of, who will be replacing current major league players, beginning as soon as next season. It happens every year.
I've yet to see what the Pirates would lose if Polanco were released today. Would it be his handful of HRs? His below average batting average? His multiple strikeouts per game? His frightful outfield play? His head-scratching base running? It's genuinely hard to find any positives with him.