5C7A7D68616D7A6C640F0 wrote: I tried this logic before, Sugar, but it didn't take. I doubt you'll have any luck, either. You see, when Cherington didn't make a single transaction within his first few minutes on the job, he became worse than Huntington. Because we all know that running a major league ball club is exactly like running a fantasy league team.
LOL, I was just reading at the beginning of the thread to see how it read, because possum had mention deleting it. I saw the GW quote directed at someone mentioning some sort of low level moves.
So, I just couldn't resist pointing out how serious this whole thing seems to be, until it isn't.
It was the fact they even gave Luke Maile a .5 for a grade. I guess they weren't allowed to give zeros, because if they had, I never would have thought I'd point out those "inconsistencies". You can't lay claim to BC "doing nothing like a train passing a bum" when he in fact upgraded the catching position, albeit probably minimally. But better is better right?
The whole idea behind the thread is to rip on the GM for not immediately turning the Pirates into contenders. We all want the Pirates to win, but those of us who live here on planet Earth understand there's a process when a new guy takes over. We won't even mention the impositions the pandemic caused because that's not an acceptable excuse.
Off Season Thread
Moderators: SammyKhalifa, Doc, Bobster
Off Season Thread
44626570797562747C170 wrote: I would much rather BC had acquired 1 player to help the 2020 team then playing for a undefined future that NEVER arrives in Pittsburgh. That is nothing more than kicking the can down the road and apologizing for a GM who has done nothing. Now my only concern is what BC will do to improve the 2021 team. This playing for the future is a movie I have seen more times than I have watched the movie Titanic. Relying on the draft is a hopeless strategy in Pittsburgh. Those drafted players will reach FA and be dashed off long before their prime years. I will measure BC solely on how well he does to improve the team right now.
He improved the team by claiming Michael Perez. In fact, he should be given credit for Jacob Stallings being kept, so the catcher position has been shored up. But hey, I can't make this stuff up.
You asked, you received. So here's your own words stating the expectations. Yet somehow....the only way to improve a club is by ending up on this list? Well, of course, we already know that isn't the case, at least as it stands for now with the Brewers GM. That negative .5, does that mean the freight train passed him like a bum, then backed up and did it again?
Asking for a friend
________
Michael Perez was waived by Tampa Bay making him a minor leaguer. When the Pirates acquired him, I have not seen anything saying he was given a major league contract so his still a minor leaguer. I agree that Cherington improved the team with Perez, but until he is given a major league contract, he will not be scored.
I have no idea what you are talking about with a -.5 with the Brewers.
There are NO negative scores for any reason.
He improved the team by claiming Michael Perez. In fact, he should be given credit for Jacob Stallings being kept, so the catcher position has been shored up. But hey, I can't make this stuff up.
You asked, you received. So here's your own words stating the expectations. Yet somehow....the only way to improve a club is by ending up on this list? Well, of course, we already know that isn't the case, at least as it stands for now with the Brewers GM. That negative .5, does that mean the freight train passed him like a bum, then backed up and did it again?
Asking for a friend
________
Michael Perez was waived by Tampa Bay making him a minor leaguer. When the Pirates acquired him, I have not seen anything saying he was given a major league contract so his still a minor leaguer. I agree that Cherington improved the team with Perez, but until he is given a major league contract, he will not be scored.
I have no idea what you are talking about with a -.5 with the Brewers.
There are NO negative scores for any reason.
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ArnoldRothstein
Off Season Thread
Maybe I don't understand, but Perez is on the 40-man roster at mlb.com.
Off Season Thread
497A6667646C5A677C607B7C6D6166080 wrote: Maybe I don't understand, but Perez is on the 40-man roster at mlb.com.
______
We do not score players added to the 40 man roster unless they have been given a major league contract. It would be too cumbersome to score every player added to every team's 40 man roster.
______
We do not score players added to the 40 man roster unless they have been given a major league contract. It would be too cumbersome to score every player added to every team's 40 man roster.
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GreenWeenie
- Posts: 4012
- Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2020 3:47 pm
Off Season Thread
653325313E24343F322517303A363E3B7934570 wrote: I tried this logic before, Sugar, but it didn't take. I doubt you'll have any luck, either. You see, when Cherington didn't make a single transaction within his first few minutes on the job, he became worse than Huntington. Because we all know that running a major league ball club is exactly like running a fantasy league team.
LOL, I was just reading at the beginning of the thread to see how it read, because possum had mention deleting it. I saw the GW quote directed at someone mentioning some sort of low level moves.
So, I just couldn't resist pointing out how serious this whole thing seems to be, until it isn't.
It was the fact they even gave Luke Maile a .5 for a grade. I guess they weren't allowed to give zeros, because if they had, I never would have thought I'd point out those "inconsistencies". You can't lay claim to BC "doing nothing like a train passing a bum" when he in fact upgraded the catching position, albeit probably minimally. But better is better right?
The whole idea behind the thread is to rip on the GM for not immediately turning the Pirates into contenders. We all want the Pirates to win, but those of us who live here on planet Earth understand there's a process when a new guy takes over. We won't even mention the impositions the pandemic caused because that's not an acceptable excuse.
We want the Pirates to win, BUT... some of us don't want the Pirates to win, going by this apology.
The pandemic has affected teams that have acquired or kept MLB players, too. That is why it is not acceptable to give passes. It's not sederved.
LOL, I was just reading at the beginning of the thread to see how it read, because possum had mention deleting it. I saw the GW quote directed at someone mentioning some sort of low level moves.
So, I just couldn't resist pointing out how serious this whole thing seems to be, until it isn't.
It was the fact they even gave Luke Maile a .5 for a grade. I guess they weren't allowed to give zeros, because if they had, I never would have thought I'd point out those "inconsistencies". You can't lay claim to BC "doing nothing like a train passing a bum" when he in fact upgraded the catching position, albeit probably minimally. But better is better right?
The whole idea behind the thread is to rip on the GM for not immediately turning the Pirates into contenders. We all want the Pirates to win, but those of us who live here on planet Earth understand there's a process when a new guy takes over. We won't even mention the impositions the pandemic caused because that's not an acceptable excuse.
We want the Pirates to win, BUT... some of us don't want the Pirates to win, going by this apology.
The pandemic has affected teams that have acquired or kept MLB players, too. That is why it is not acceptable to give passes. It's not sederved.
Off Season Thread
6F747978717D721C0 wrote: I would much rather BC had acquired 1 player to help the 2020 team then playing for a undefined future that NEVER arrives in Pittsburgh. That is nothing more than kicking the can down the road and apologizing for a GM who has done nothing. Now my only concern is what BC will do to improve the 2021 team. This playing for the future is a movie I have seen more times than I have watched the movie Titanic. Relying on the draft is a hopeless strategy in Pittsburgh. Those drafted players will reach FA and be dashed off long before their prime years. I will measure BC solely on how well he does to improve the team right now.
He improved the team by claiming Michael Perez. In fact, he should be given credit for Jacob Stallings being kept, so the catcher position has been shored up. But hey, I can't make this stuff up.
You asked, you received. So here's your own words stating the expectations. Yet somehow....the only way to improve a club is by ending up on this list? Well, of course, we already know that isn't the case, at least as it stands for now with the Brewers GM. That negative .5, does that mean the freight train passed him like a bum, then backed up and did it again?
Asking for a friend
________
Michael Perez was waived by Tampa Bay making him a minor leaguer. When the Pirates acquired him, I have not seen anything saying he was given a major league contract so his still a minor leaguer. I agree that Cherington improved the team with Perez, but until he is given a major league contract, he will not be scored.
I have no idea what you are talking about with a -.5 with the Brewers.
There are NO negative scores for any reason.
The Brewers signed a guy you scored a .5. They traded a guy who was scored a 1 for the new team. Therefore, the Brewers improved by .5, but declined by 1. That's a negative .5 so far for the Brewers, and that's how it should be scored on your list.
He improved the team by claiming Michael Perez. In fact, he should be given credit for Jacob Stallings being kept, so the catcher position has been shored up. But hey, I can't make this stuff up.
You asked, you received. So here's your own words stating the expectations. Yet somehow....the only way to improve a club is by ending up on this list? Well, of course, we already know that isn't the case, at least as it stands for now with the Brewers GM. That negative .5, does that mean the freight train passed him like a bum, then backed up and did it again?
Asking for a friend
________
Michael Perez was waived by Tampa Bay making him a minor leaguer. When the Pirates acquired him, I have not seen anything saying he was given a major league contract so his still a minor leaguer. I agree that Cherington improved the team with Perez, but until he is given a major league contract, he will not be scored.
I have no idea what you are talking about with a -.5 with the Brewers.
There are NO negative scores for any reason.
The Brewers signed a guy you scored a .5. They traded a guy who was scored a 1 for the new team. Therefore, the Brewers improved by .5, but declined by 1. That's a negative .5 so far for the Brewers, and that's how it should be scored on your list.
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BellevueBuc
- Posts: 343
- Joined: Fri Nov 06, 2020 1:41 pm
Off Season Thread
78636E6F666A650B0 wrote: I would much rather BC had acquired 1 player to help the 2020 team then playing for a undefined future that NEVER arrives in Pittsburgh. That is nothing more than kicking the can down the road and apologizing for a GM who has done nothing. Now my only concern is what BC will do to improve the 2021 team. This playing for the future is a movie I have seen more times than I have watched the movie Titanic. Relying on the draft is a hopeless strategy in Pittsburgh. Those drafted players will reach FA and be dashed off long before their prime years. I will measure BC solely on how well he does to improve the team right now.
He improved the team by claiming Michael Perez. In fact, he should be given credit for Jacob Stallings being kept, so the catcher position has been shored up. But hey, I can't make this stuff up.
You asked, you received. So here's your own words stating the expectations. Yet somehow....the only way to improve a club is by ending up on this list? Well, of course, we already know that isn't the case, at least as it stands for now with the Brewers GM. That negative .5, does that mean the freight train passed him like a bum, then backed up and did it again?
Asking for a friend
________
Michael Perez was waived by Tampa Bay making him a minor leaguer. When the Pirates acquired him, I have not seen anything saying he was given a major league contract so his still a minor leaguer. I agree that Cherington improved the team with Perez, but until he is given a major league contract, he will not be scored.
I have no idea what you are talking about with a -.5 with the Brewers.
There are NO negative scores for any reason.
By the simple fact that Perez was designated for assignment means he has a major league contract. You can see his salary here.
https://www.usatoday.com/sports/mlb/ray ... layer/all/
Just like every pre-Arb player, his salary will be renewed in the spring. All players on the Pirates MLB 40 man roster have major league contracts including Perez and Ashton Goudeau. Their contracts are not converted to a minor league contract until they are optioned.
He improved the team by claiming Michael Perez. In fact, he should be given credit for Jacob Stallings being kept, so the catcher position has been shored up. But hey, I can't make this stuff up.
You asked, you received. So here's your own words stating the expectations. Yet somehow....the only way to improve a club is by ending up on this list? Well, of course, we already know that isn't the case, at least as it stands for now with the Brewers GM. That negative .5, does that mean the freight train passed him like a bum, then backed up and did it again?
Asking for a friend
________
Michael Perez was waived by Tampa Bay making him a minor leaguer. When the Pirates acquired him, I have not seen anything saying he was given a major league contract so his still a minor leaguer. I agree that Cherington improved the team with Perez, but until he is given a major league contract, he will not be scored.
I have no idea what you are talking about with a -.5 with the Brewers.
There are NO negative scores for any reason.
By the simple fact that Perez was designated for assignment means he has a major league contract. You can see his salary here.
https://www.usatoday.com/sports/mlb/ray ... layer/all/
Just like every pre-Arb player, his salary will be renewed in the spring. All players on the Pirates MLB 40 man roster have major league contracts including Perez and Ashton Goudeau. Their contracts are not converted to a minor league contract until they are optioned.
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skinnyhorse
- Posts: 926
- Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2016 1:19 am
Off Season Thread
217761757A60707B766153747E727A7F3D70130 wrote: I tried this logic before, Sugar, but it didn't take. I doubt you'll have any luck, either. You see, when Cherington didn't make a single transaction within his first few minutes on the job, he became worse than Huntington. Because we all know that running a major league ball club is exactly like running a fantasy league team.
LOL, I was just reading at the beginning of the thread to see how it read, because possum had mention deleting it. I saw the GW quote directed at someone mentioning some sort of low level moves.
So, I just couldn't resist pointing out how serious this whole thing seems to be, until it isn't.
It was the fact they even gave Luke Maile a .5 for a grade. I guess they weren't allowed to give zeros, because if they had, I never would have thought I'd point out those "inconsistencies". You can't lay claim to BC "doing nothing like a train passing a bum" when he in fact upgraded the catching position, albeit probably minimally. But better is better right?
The whole idea behind the thread is to rip on the GM for not immediately turning the Pirates into contenders. We all want the Pirates to win, but those of us who live here on planet Earth understand there's a process when a new guy takes over. We won't even mention the impositions the pandemic caused because that's not an acceptable excuse.
I agree Doc, it takes 2 to tango and making deals just to be making deals is how we lost Glasnow and Meadows, for a guy who money wise cost us a ton and made the team worse. But we just had to make a deal any deal, and when it first happened there were lots of people on here that were okay with it until they realized how bad Archer was. I don't want acquisition to be made just to satisfy the fan base, it has to be good for the Pirates. I will wait and see what happens before I decide on Cherington. The only criticism I have of him so far is the Shelton hire. I am really concerned he doesn't seem to understand his players strengths and weaknesses. A manager has to give the team the best chance to win and I didn't see that from him.
LOL, I was just reading at the beginning of the thread to see how it read, because possum had mention deleting it. I saw the GW quote directed at someone mentioning some sort of low level moves.
So, I just couldn't resist pointing out how serious this whole thing seems to be, until it isn't.
It was the fact they even gave Luke Maile a .5 for a grade. I guess they weren't allowed to give zeros, because if they had, I never would have thought I'd point out those "inconsistencies". You can't lay claim to BC "doing nothing like a train passing a bum" when he in fact upgraded the catching position, albeit probably minimally. But better is better right?
The whole idea behind the thread is to rip on the GM for not immediately turning the Pirates into contenders. We all want the Pirates to win, but those of us who live here on planet Earth understand there's a process when a new guy takes over. We won't even mention the impositions the pandemic caused because that's not an acceptable excuse.
I agree Doc, it takes 2 to tango and making deals just to be making deals is how we lost Glasnow and Meadows, for a guy who money wise cost us a ton and made the team worse. But we just had to make a deal any deal, and when it first happened there were lots of people on here that were okay with it until they realized how bad Archer was. I don't want acquisition to be made just to satisfy the fan base, it has to be good for the Pirates. I will wait and see what happens before I decide on Cherington. The only criticism I have of him so far is the Shelton hire. I am really concerned he doesn't seem to understand his players strengths and weaknesses. A manager has to give the team the best chance to win and I didn't see that from him.
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WildwoodDave
- Posts: 568
- Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2020 11:19 am
Off Season Thread
120904050C000F610 wrote: I tried this logic before, Sugar, but it didn't take. I doubt you'll have any luck, either. You see, when Cherington didn't make a single transaction within his first few minutes on the job, he became worse than Huntington. Because we all know that running a major league ball club is exactly like running a fantasy league team.
LOL, I was just reading at the beginning of the thread to see how it read, because possum had mention deleting it. I saw the GW quote directed at someone mentioning some sort of low level moves.
So, I just couldn't resist pointing out how serious this whole thing seems to be, until it isn't.
It was the fact they even gave Luke Maile a .5 for a grade. I guess they weren't allowed to give zeros, because if they had, I never would have thought I'd point out those "inconsistencies". You can't lay claim to BC "doing nothing like a train passing a bum" when he in fact upgraded the catching position, albeit probably minimally. But better is better right?
________
The reason Maile was scored was that he was given a major league contract by the Brewers. The players scored all have major league contracts. Arbitration deals do not count. Instead of apologizing for Cherington, he needs to sign some major league ballplayers to major league contracts. If you want Cjerington's minor league acquisitions to count, then I suggest you keep track of all the minor league acquisiitions around the league. You can even use this thread to post the results.
You completely miss the point of the comments. No one's asking you to score anything other than what you want. It's the ridiculous parameters you set up that end up making this whole thing look foolish. You can throw around all the little snide remarks you want about "apologists". You claim this thread shows GM's improving their team. So I'll ask you, based upon YOUR parameters, exactly how did the Brewers GM improve his team, by signing Maile, but dealing Knebel? He got a plus .5 for Maile, but doesn't he get a negative 1 for Knebel?
Please, feel free to actually answer the question. Asking for a friend.
_________
It is you who is completely missing the point. This thread is NOT an attempt top measure how much a GM has improved the team. There are many ways to improve the team including major league acquisitions, minor league acquisition, drafting, player development, etc, etc, etc. This thread is an attempt to measure a GM's acquisitions
of major league ball players.
If a player is DFA's, that would be an indication that he was a minor league ballplayer and would not be scored. However, if that player is acquired by another GM and that GM gives the player a major league contract, he would be scored. If that player is given an invite to spring training with no major league contract, he would not be scored.
If you have some evidence that BC acquired a player during the off season and gave him a major league contract, please let me know and we will score him.
Who would have thought that this thread which was so highly regarded on the previous board would cause so much misunderstanding. It reminds me of a Shakespeare Play entitled " Much Ado About Nothing"
LOL, I was just reading at the beginning of the thread to see how it read, because possum had mention deleting it. I saw the GW quote directed at someone mentioning some sort of low level moves.
So, I just couldn't resist pointing out how serious this whole thing seems to be, until it isn't.
It was the fact they even gave Luke Maile a .5 for a grade. I guess they weren't allowed to give zeros, because if they had, I never would have thought I'd point out those "inconsistencies". You can't lay claim to BC "doing nothing like a train passing a bum" when he in fact upgraded the catching position, albeit probably minimally. But better is better right?
________
The reason Maile was scored was that he was given a major league contract by the Brewers. The players scored all have major league contracts. Arbitration deals do not count. Instead of apologizing for Cherington, he needs to sign some major league ballplayers to major league contracts. If you want Cjerington's minor league acquisitions to count, then I suggest you keep track of all the minor league acquisiitions around the league. You can even use this thread to post the results.
You completely miss the point of the comments. No one's asking you to score anything other than what you want. It's the ridiculous parameters you set up that end up making this whole thing look foolish. You can throw around all the little snide remarks you want about "apologists". You claim this thread shows GM's improving their team. So I'll ask you, based upon YOUR parameters, exactly how did the Brewers GM improve his team, by signing Maile, but dealing Knebel? He got a plus .5 for Maile, but doesn't he get a negative 1 for Knebel?
Please, feel free to actually answer the question. Asking for a friend.
_________
It is you who is completely missing the point. This thread is NOT an attempt top measure how much a GM has improved the team. There are many ways to improve the team including major league acquisitions, minor league acquisition, drafting, player development, etc, etc, etc. This thread is an attempt to measure a GM's acquisitions
of major league ball players.
If a player is DFA's, that would be an indication that he was a minor league ballplayer and would not be scored. However, if that player is acquired by another GM and that GM gives the player a major league contract, he would be scored. If that player is given an invite to spring training with no major league contract, he would not be scored.
If you have some evidence that BC acquired a player during the off season and gave him a major league contract, please let me know and we will score him.
Who would have thought that this thread which was so highly regarded on the previous board would cause so much misunderstanding. It reminds me of a Shakespeare Play entitled " Much Ado About Nothing"
Off Season Thread
0A2C2B3E373B2C3A32590 wrote: I would much rather BC had acquired 1 player to help the 2020 team then playing for a undefined future that NEVER arrives in Pittsburgh. That is nothing more than kicking the can down the road and apologizing for a GM who has done nothing. Now my only concern is what BC will do to improve the 2021 team. This playing for the future is a movie I have seen more times than I have watched the movie Titanic. Relying on the draft is a hopeless strategy in Pittsburgh. Those drafted players will reach FA and be dashed off long before their prime years. I will measure BC solely on how well he does to improve the team right now.
He improved the team by claiming Michael Perez. In fact, he should be given credit for Jacob Stallings being kept, so the catcher position has been shored up. But hey, I can't make this stuff up.
You asked, you received. So here's your own words stating the expectations. Yet somehow....the only way to improve a club is by ending up on this list? Well, of course, we already know that isn't the case, at least as it stands for now with the Brewers GM. That negative .5, does that mean the freight train passed him like a bum, then backed up and did it again?
Asking for a friend
________
Michael Perez was waived by Tampa Bay making him a minor leaguer. When the Pirates acquired him, I have not seen anything saying he was given a major league contract so his still a minor leaguer. I agree that Cherington improved the team with Perez, but until he is given a major league contract, he will not be scored.
I have no idea what you are talking about with a -.5 with the Brewers.
There are NO negative scores for any reason.
The Brewers signed a guy you scored a .5. They traded a guy who was scored a 1 for the new team. Therefore, the Brewers improved by .5, but declined by 1. That's a negative .5 so far for the Brewers, and that's how it should be scored on your list.
_____
Why is it so hard for you to understand. There are no negative points under any conditions. If a GM waived his entire 40 man roster, he would not get any negative points.
He improved the team by claiming Michael Perez. In fact, he should be given credit for Jacob Stallings being kept, so the catcher position has been shored up. But hey, I can't make this stuff up.
You asked, you received. So here's your own words stating the expectations. Yet somehow....the only way to improve a club is by ending up on this list? Well, of course, we already know that isn't the case, at least as it stands for now with the Brewers GM. That negative .5, does that mean the freight train passed him like a bum, then backed up and did it again?
Asking for a friend
________
Michael Perez was waived by Tampa Bay making him a minor leaguer. When the Pirates acquired him, I have not seen anything saying he was given a major league contract so his still a minor leaguer. I agree that Cherington improved the team with Perez, but until he is given a major league contract, he will not be scored.
I have no idea what you are talking about with a -.5 with the Brewers.
There are NO negative scores for any reason.
The Brewers signed a guy you scored a .5. They traded a guy who was scored a 1 for the new team. Therefore, the Brewers improved by .5, but declined by 1. That's a negative .5 so far for the Brewers, and that's how it should be scored on your list.
_____
Why is it so hard for you to understand. There are no negative points under any conditions. If a GM waived his entire 40 man roster, he would not get any negative points.