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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR) (Read 4065 times)
3pirates3
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Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Oct 9th, 2022 at 7:07pm
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Possum
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Re: Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Reply #1 - Oct 10th, 2022 at 7:34am
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I like this thread and I think I will pin it to the top of the forum for future discussion of the Bucs off-season and what we think should be going on in the Bucs world.
  

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Re: Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Reply #2 - Oct 10th, 2022 at 8:17am
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I found it curious that Cruz was described as "still above average at the dish overall, hitting .233/.294/.450." Seems odd that MLBTR considered that line above average. Only the SLG of .450 was above the league average. The BA and OBP were both below league average. I guess slugging is everything to MLBTR.
  

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Babe Adams
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Re: Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Reply #3 - Oct 10th, 2022 at 8:36am
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Bobster wrote on Oct 10th, 2022 at 8:17am:
I found it curious that Cruz was described as "still above average at the dish overall, hitting .233/.294/.450."


The sentence concludes "...for a wRC+ of 106." The 106 is what's above average, it's a Runs Created Index.
  

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Re: Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Reply #4 - Oct 10th, 2022 at 9:31am
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Babe Adams wrote on Oct 10th, 2022 at 8:36am:
Bobster wrote on Oct 10th, 2022 at 8:17am:
I found it curious that Cruz was described as "still above average at the dish overall, hitting .233/.294/.450."


The sentence concludes "...for a wRC+ of 106." The 106 is what's above average, it's a Runs Created Index.

Ok. Sounds like one of the modern abstract stats that we can't compute and have to take a numbers crunchers word for. What I can actually see is that Cruz hits safely less frequently and reaches base less frequently than the NL average.
  

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Javy
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Re: Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Reply #5 - Oct 10th, 2022 at 9:45am
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Bobster wrote on Oct 10th, 2022 at 9:31am:
Babe Adams wrote on Oct 10th, 2022 at 8:36am:
Bobster wrote on Oct 10th, 2022 at 8:17am:
I found it curious that Cruz was described as "still above average at the dish overall, hitting .233/.294/.450."


The sentence concludes "...for a wRC+ of 106." The 106 is what's above average, it's a Runs Created Index.

Ok. Sounds like one of the modern abstract stats that we can't compute and have to take a numbers crunchers word for. What I can actually see is that Cruz hits safely less frequently and reaches base less frequently than the NL average.


What we fans see, using the time honored "eye test", is a .233 hitting, error prone, but bazooka armed, shortstop who has good to great speed, but doesn't have the experience needed to steal bases effectively (when he gets on).
We also see a hitter who has tremendous power, but strikes out a lot (too much), doesn't get on base enough either via walks or getting timely hits.  Undecided

In our day, we would say that that prospect gets maybe another year to develop defensively but will likely switch positions. If the offensive output didn't improve, we would see that player as a utility/bench guy, until his contract expired and we moved on. Undecided

Today, with the cottage industry of analytics, we have a budding superstar! (Maybe we do, and maybe we don't) Wink
  
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Re: Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Reply #6 - Oct 10th, 2022 at 11:17am
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Possum wrote on Oct 10th, 2022 at 7:34am:
I like this thread and I think I will pin it to the top of the forum for future discussion of the Bucs off-season and what we think should be going on in the Bucs world.

Great idea.
  

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Re: Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Reply #7 - Oct 10th, 2022 at 6:33pm
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Cruz’s defense concerns me more than his hitting.  I think he’ll develop as a power hitter rather than a hitter with a high batting average, and that’s fine, if he can be a 30 HR guy.

I don’t know if he’ll ever be trustworthy as a defender, especially at shortstop.  I’d bring him to Bradenton for a week before Spring Training to start working with him to take over in RF or at 1B, whichever he can grasp best.  I think I’d prefer him in RF.
  
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Surgnbuck
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Re: Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Reply #8 - Oct 10th, 2022 at 7:56pm
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Doc wrote on Oct 10th, 2022 at 6:33pm:
Cruz’s defense concerns me more than his hitting.  I think he’ll develop as a power hitter rather than a hitter with a high batting average, and that’s fine, if he can be a 30 HR guy.

I don’t know if he’ll ever be trustworthy as a defender, especially at shortstop.  I’d bring him to Bradenton for a week before Spring Training to start working with him to take over in RF or at 1B, whichever he can grasp best.  I think I’d prefer him in RF.

I'm betting he's their SS for the vast majority of 2023. Remember, for all his defensive flaws, there's always DH
  

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Re: Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Reply #9 - Oct 10th, 2022 at 8:00pm
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The price of business just looks more and more hopeless for Bucs fans. Rookie Spencer Strider signs 6 year, 75 million dollar deal. So if they want to sign Roansy long term, there's your ballpark figure.
  

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Re: Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Reply #10 - Oct 10th, 2022 at 8:35pm
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Surgnbuck wrote on Oct 10th, 2022 at 7:56pm:
Doc wrote on Oct 10th, 2022 at 6:33pm:
Cruz’s defense concerns me more than his hitting.  I think he’ll develop as a power hitter rather than a hitter with a high batting average, and that’s fine, if he can be a 30 HR guy.

I don’t know if he’ll ever be trustworthy as a defender, especially at shortstop.  I’d bring him to Bradenton for a week before Spring Training to start working with him to take over in RF or at 1B, whichever he can grasp best.  I think I’d prefer him in RF.

I'm betting he's their SS for the vast majority of 2023. Remember, for all his defensive flaws, there's always DH


It wouldn’t surprise me if he plays SS until Peguero is ready, perhaps midway through the year.  But if BC’s convinced Liover is the future, it’s best to get Cruz to start playing his new position (RF or 1B) as soon as possible.  Let Newman play SS until Perguero arrives.
  
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Re: Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Reply #11 - Oct 10th, 2022 at 9:31pm
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I agree Cruz will get 2023 to prove it on defense. Nick Gonzales is playing SS in the AFL. Peguero fizzled out when he was sent back down. Just more questions then answers, business as usual.
  
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Re: Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Reply #12 - Oct 11th, 2022 at 5:50am
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ChillinStation wrote on Oct 10th, 2022 at 9:31pm:
I agree Cruz will get 2023 to prove it on defense. Nick Gonzales is playing SS in the AFL. Peguero fizzled out when he was sent back down. Just more questions then answers, business as usual.


Interesting that Gonzales is playing there.  Is that a combination of Peguero's performance and the drafting of Johnson, who looks like he might fit best at 2nd base?  Is Gonzales's arm good enough to play SS?  His total minor league hitting numbers are really promising.  Duplicating them in the big leagues would be fantastic.
  
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Re: Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Reply #13 - Oct 11th, 2022 at 7:22am
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Does anyone know if Termarr Johnson is playing Winter Ball this year?
  
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Re: Offseason Outlook: Pittsburgh Pirates (MLBTR)
Reply #14 - Oct 11th, 2022 at 11:40am
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Doc wrote on Oct 11th, 2022 at 5:50am:
ChillinStation wrote on Oct 10th, 2022 at 9:31pm:
I agree Cruz will get 2023 to prove it on defense. Nick Gonzales is playing SS in the AFL. Peguero fizzled out when he was sent back down. Just more questions then answers, business as usual.


Interesting that Gonzales is playing there.  Is that a combination of Peguero's performance and the drafting of Johnson, who looks like he might fit best at 2nd base?  Is Gonzales's arm good enough to play SS?  His total minor league hitting numbers are really promising.  Duplicating them in the big leagues would be fantastic.


PBN says Gonzales seems to have the arm to play SS but
probably has the arm strength for short, but many scouts question whether he has the quickness for the position.

It seems that the Bucs might try to make him a SUG.
  

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