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Bobster
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Re: Is It Time To Move On From Marte
Reply #15 - Sep 14th, 2018 at 8:56am
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SammyKhalifa wrote on Sep 14th, 2018 at 8:22am:
Bobster wrote on Sep 14th, 2018 at 8:07am:
SammyKhalifa wrote on Sep 14th, 2018 at 7:55am:
skinnyhorse wrote on Sep 13th, 2018 at 11:42pm:
It is definitely time to move on from Marte.  The guy has worlds of talent but just doesn't have the intelligence to maximize his talents.  He's been given all the opportunity to succeed and he's fallen way short of what we need.  I really like Frazier and I think he could handle center field.  He has speed and gets a great jump on the ball and appears to have a decent arm.  Just must get some real return for him, and I'm not sure our GM has any idea about talent, probably he would get nothing in return.

If every player on the team hit and fielded like Marte we would win a lot more games than we do now.

I agree that Marte could be better. He seems to have mental lapses or just doesn't care. However, he is still one of their best players. Trading him would create a hole in the offense that likely could at best be filled by the player they would get for him, so it would be a wash. They won't get multiple players with enough offense to end up better after than before the trade. And they need to build on what they have; not continually look to get prospects for productive players for a future that never comes.   


Every player could be better though.  I think the main reason for people being down on Marte--and this is a very very good reason and I understand it--is the suspension. 

I dunno, Sammy. I think most players maximize their abilities. We see that a lot from Marte but often see him not giving his best. But as I said, he's still one of their best. I wouldn't trade him. I'm sure some fans are down on him for the suspension. But I would say the majority of fans have put that in the rear view mirror and moved on. Marte gets criticized for loafing at times or not seeming to be focused. Those are legit criticisms but aren't related to the suspension.   
  
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SyrBucco
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Re: Is It Time To Move On From Marte
Reply #16 - Sep 14th, 2018 at 9:05am
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Marte is arguably our best position player, and there's no way I'd trade him. With Meadows gone, there is no adequate internal replacement. Frazier is OK in the corners, but not as an everyday CF.

I argued long and hard that we should sign Mike Moustakas last year. I still think it's a good idea. I'd also like the idea of signing Jose Iglesias to play SS if he doen't cost much more than Mercer did. Not sold at all on Newman, who I've seen in person and just don't like the glove.
  
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MaineBucs
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Re: Is It Time To Move On From Marte
Reply #17 - Sep 14th, 2018 at 12:53pm
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Last year, when I advocated that the team tear most of it down and rebuild, Marte is one of the few players who I thought that the Bucs should keep.  As the season unfolded and started to collapse, I thought trading Marte may be one of the few ways to infuse some real younger talent into the team.

As the team approaches 2019, I am hoping that the team hangs onto Marte, even though he has flaws.  He is their best defensive player and adds both speed and pop from a position that is not necessarily considered a key offensive position. 

With most of the starting pitching and most of the bullpen looking pretty set for next year, and showing considerable improvement as the 2018 season progressed, I now view the 2019 season as one where the Bucs should make a real push for the play-offs by adding to the current major league roster.   As such, Marte should remain.  I am not sure who the team should try to add, but at present, CF likely is the team's least concern on offense.
  
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SammyKhalifa
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Re: Is It Time To Move On From Marte
Reply #18 - Sep 14th, 2018 at 1:05pm
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MaineBucs wrote on Sep 14th, 2018 at 12:53pm:
Last year, when I advocated that the team tear most of it down and rebuild, Marte is one of the few players who I thought that the Bucs should keep.  As the season unfolded and started to collapse, I thought trading Marte may be one of the few ways to infuse some real younger talent into the team.

As the team approaches 2019, I am hoping that the team hangs onto Marte, even though he has flaws.  He is their best defensive player and adds both speed and pop from a position that is not necessarily considered a key offensive position. 

With most of the starting pitching and most of the bullpen looking pretty set for next year, and showing considerable improvement as the 2018 season progressed, I now view the 2019 season as one where the Bucs should make a real push for the play-offs by adding to the current major league roster.   As such, Marte should remain.  I am not sure who the team should try to add, but at present, CF likely is the team's least concern on offense. 


Yeah, and with out pitching I think it we'd get better than expected returns by buffing up defense at all the middle positions.  I don't mind breaking in one rookie at either SS-2nd but keep Marte and sign one middle infielder. 
  
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mouse
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Re: Is It Time To Move On From Marte
Reply #19 - Sep 14th, 2018 at 2:34pm
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I sort of agree, only with the infield I would add first and third. Neither are even average (I think, based on eye test) infielders. Runs could be saved there, making pitchers look a lot better.
  
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SammyKhalifa
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Re: Is It Time To Move On From Marte
Reply #20 - Sep 14th, 2018 at 2:43pm
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Oh they weren't good either, I was thinking that a more rangey middle IF would cut down on those deficiencies a bit.  The whole infield could use an upgrade in that regard but that doesnt seem likely.
  
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CTBucco
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Re: Is It Time To Move On From Marte
Reply #21 - Sep 14th, 2018 at 4:28pm
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How would Miguel Andujar have looked at 3B this year?  Of course, if had made that trade, we would have had Chance Adams maybe and not Joe Musgrove.  Sooo...

Marte has to stay.  While he plays a premium position, the only way we get two impact bats is if they are prospects and both "lottery tickets" hit.  That won't help in '19 and brings the whole timeline into question.
  
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SCBucco
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Re: Is It Time To Move On From Marte
Reply #22 - Sep 14th, 2018 at 4:32pm
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CTBucco wrote on Sep 14th, 2018 at 4:28pm:
How would Miguel Andujar have looked at 3B this year?  Of course, if had made that trade, we would have had Chance Adams maybe and not Joe Musgrove.  Sooo...

Marte has to stay.  While he plays a premium position, the only way we get two impact bats is if they are prospects and both "lottery tickets" hit.  That won't help in '19 and brings the whole timeline into question.


We didn't have the assets to get Andujar.  He would have looked great, but that was never going to happen.
  
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